Quote Originally Posted by Master View Post
25 defences is truly great and a mark of a great heavyweight because that shows consistency and dedication. I am bringing up 3 great heavyweights who had it not been for Ali would have been greater.

As Tito said, Liston was a beast with a ram rod jab, had it not been for Ali he could have reigned for years. Frazier proved his top 10 quality. Big George was another monster who proved his greatness by winning the title 20 years later.

It is all there to see but you choose not to because...?
You assume they'd be greater.

Liston would have ruled MAYBE until Leotis Martin beat him. Frazier maybe, who knows how he'd fare vs the guys he never got around to because he was too busy having his head bounce off of Foreman's fists. Foreman lost to Jimmy Young, is that great? Is that incredible?

25 title defenses happened. Hypothesizing about Ali is obviously an exercise in futility in your mind Ali is STILL undefeated it's the problem discussing him.


To you and boxing fans who don't bother taking the time to think: Ali's greatness is untouchable, unquestionable....Joe Louis' greatness comes with caveats "Weeeellll akshully he didn't fight great fighters" he fought who was available "Yeah but he didn't fight great fighters"....Were there any he missed? Did he duck anyone? "No, but he didn't fight Liston, Frazier, Foreman"...those may have been one sided as they weren't even babies when Joe was champ "Yeah but he didn't have those guys to fight in his era" ....and so he fought and beat 25 fighters in a row holding on to the title...so no points for consistency, none for work ethic and having what 13 bouts in 1 year? No 'atta boy's for that? OK, I get it...you love Ali and there's nobody else that could even hold a candle to him and his legacy and you're not cool with just YOU thinking that, but I've got to be corrected and think that way too.



What's the difference? Master? What's the difference? You tell me. "Oh it's the boxers Ali fought" Joe Louis fought 110% of everyone out there available to fight and beat them all....not great? Not acceptable? Not something which stands the test of time? I'm telling you it's not like Louis could go out and get a Frazier or Foreman or Liston and even you agree to that, but yet you STILL fuck around with "Well he didn't fight great fighters".......OK then I guess you're right then. I guess nobody will ever ever ever be better or on a par with Ali because of who he fought, not in the history of boxing, not in the future of boxing, boxing should have just folded and closed the doors when Ali retired because everything to achieve was achieved by Ali forever and ever amen.