Zhilei Zhang says "Wilder is out of Ammo!"

[TIC]

I don't believe Joshua has ever ducked anyone, either. But to categorically say Fury and Wilder ducked Joshua? Hogwash.

None of that "proves" that either ducked Joshua.

I'm not a diehard fan of any of them, so bias doesn't come into my argument.

Joshua could've made the Wilder fight happen had he really wanted it. Fact.

Fury swooped in and spared us the ongoing soap opera between Joshua and Wilder. Fact.

No one knows for certain how Joshua would've fared against that version of Wilder. Fact.

aj was rated & seen as the number one in the division & held three of the four major belts. deontay & tyson both chose to fight someone other than the perceived number one guy. this proves both deontay & tyson chose not to fight the perceived number one guy with three of the four major belts. no bias needed as that is what happened.

you can't make someone fight you if they don't want to fight you. fact. what was deontay getting out of fighting tyson instead of aj? aj was seen as number one & had three of the four belts. deontay also would have made more for aj over tyson & getting a chance at three belts & the number one guy in the division

tyson swooped in to fight deontay instead of fighting the number one guy with three of the four major belts. fact. what was tyson getting out of fighting deontay instead of aj? aj was seen as number one & had three of the four belts. tyson would have made more for fighting aj over deontay & getting a chance at three belts & the number one guy in the division

no one knows how an aj v deontay fight would have gone at the time. i agree

[NoSavingByTheBell]

Let's be honest about two things sfaccim'

AJ only ever really looked good against the 41-year-old Klitschko

Deontay burned himself out on three fights with Tyson

There is no doubt that if deonte had fought AJ in 2019 he would have harpooned his ass. Look what Andy Ruiz did ffs imagine Wilder before he got worn down by Tyson Fury

[TitoFan]

I don't believe Joshua has ever ducked anyone, either. But to categorically say Fury and Wilder ducked Joshua? Hogwash.

None of that "proves" that either ducked Joshua.

I'm not a diehard fan of any of them, so bias doesn't come into my argument.

Joshua could've made the Wilder fight happen had he really wanted it. Fact.

Fury swooped in and spared us the ongoing soap opera between Joshua and Wilder. Fact.

No one knows for certain how Joshua would've fared against that version of Wilder. Fact.

aj was rated & seen as the number one in the division & held three of the four major belts. deontay & tyson both chose to fight someone other than the perceived number one guy. this proves both deontay & tyson chose not to fight the perceived number one guy with three of the four major belts. no bias needed as that is what happened.

you can't make someone fight you if they don't want to fight you. fact. what was deontay getting out of fighting tyson instead of aj? aj was seen as number one & had three of the four belts. deontay also would have made more for aj over tyson & getting a chance at three belts & the number one guy in the division

tyson swooped in to fight deontay instead of fighting the number one guy with three of the four major belts. fact. what was tyson getting out of fighting deontay instead of aj? aj was seen as number one & had three of the four belts. tyson would have made more for fighting aj over deontay & getting a chance at three belts & the number one guy in the division

no one knows how an aj v deontay fight would have gone at the time. i agree

"Choosing to fight someone else" does not automatically equate to "ducking."

There are many intricacies involved. Discussions, thought processes, demands, conditions, etc, etc.

None of us, no matter how badly we want to claim insight into fighters' heads, can claim to have the "inside scoop."

When "ducks" are obvious, they're obvious.

Wilder and Joshua were involved in long, drawn-out negotiations. If memory serves me correctly (and I'm not one to be interested in the bickering aspect of boxing), Joshua's initial offerings to Wilder were ridiculous.

At some point yes, they were improved.

Wilder-Fury was much easier to make.

What proof do you have that both Wilder and Fury were scared to fight Joshua so they fought each other instead?

I didn't think so.

[TIC]

I don't believe Joshua has ever ducked anyone, either. But to categorically say Fury and Wilder ducked Joshua? Hogwash.

None of that "proves" that either ducked Joshua.

I'm not a diehard fan of any of them, so bias doesn't come into my argument.

Joshua could've made the Wilder fight happen had he really wanted it. Fact.

Fury swooped in and spared us the ongoing soap opera between Joshua and Wilder. Fact.

No one knows for certain how Joshua would've fared against that version of Wilder. Fact.

aj was rated & seen as the number one in the division & held three of the four major belts. deontay & tyson both chose to fight someone other than the perceived number one guy. this proves both deontay & tyson chose not to fight the perceived number one guy with three of the four major belts. no bias needed as that is what happened.

you can't make someone fight you if they don't want to fight you. fact. what was deontay getting out of fighting tyson instead of aj? aj was seen as number one & had three of the four belts. deontay also would have made more for aj over tyson & getting a chance at three belts & the number one guy in the division

tyson swooped in to fight deontay instead of fighting the number one guy with three of the four major belts. fact. what was tyson getting out of fighting deontay instead of aj? aj was seen as number one & had three of the four belts. tyson would have made more for fighting aj over deontay & getting a chance at three belts & the number one guy in the division

no one knows how an aj v deontay fight would have gone at the time. i agree

"Choosing to fight someone else" does not automatically equate to "ducking."

Wilder and Joshua were involved in long, drawn-out negotiations. If memory serves me correctly (and I'm not one to be interested in the bickering aspect of boxing), Joshua's initial offerings to Wilder were ridiculous.

At some point yes, they were improved.

Wilder-Fury was much easier to make.

What proof do you have that both Wilder and Fury were scared to fight Joshua so they fought each other instead?

I didn't think so.

where did i say ducking? did deontay or tyson choose to fight the perceived number one guy in the division with three of the four major belts? can you please provide a source for these ridiculous offers from team aj & a source for what they improved to? deontay v tyson may have been easier to make but my argument is not about how easy a fight is to make it is about who was seen as the top guy in the division & who deontay & tyson chose to fight instead. where did i say deontay or tyson were scared? the fact is they didn't fight the perceived number one guy in the division with three of the four major belts

[TitoFan]

I don't believe Joshua has ever ducked anyone, either. But to categorically say Fury and Wilder ducked Joshua? Hogwash.

None of that "proves" that either ducked Joshua.

I'm not a diehard fan of any of them, so bias doesn't come into my argument.

Joshua could've made the Wilder fight happen had he really wanted it. Fact.

Fury swooped in and spared us the ongoing soap opera between Joshua and Wilder. Fact.

No one knows for certain how Joshua would've fared against that version of Wilder. Fact.

aj was rated & seen as the number one in the division & held three of the four major belts. deontay & tyson both chose to fight someone other than the perceived number one guy. this proves both deontay & tyson chose not to fight the perceived number one guy with three of the four major belts. no bias needed as that is what happened.

you can't make someone fight you if they don't want to fight you. fact. what was deontay getting out of fighting tyson instead of aj? aj was seen as number one & had three of the four belts. deontay also would have made more for aj over tyson & getting a chance at three belts & the number one guy in the division

tyson swooped in to fight deontay instead of fighting the number one guy with three of the four major belts. fact. what was tyson getting out of fighting deontay instead of aj? aj was seen as number one & had three of the four belts. tyson would have made more for fighting aj over deontay & getting a chance at three belts & the number one guy in the division

no one knows how an aj v deontay fight would have gone at the time. i agree

"Choosing to fight someone else" does not automatically equate to "ducking."

Wilder and Joshua were involved in long, drawn-out negotiations. If memory serves me correctly (and I'm not one to be interested in the bickering aspect of boxing), Joshua's initial offerings to Wilder were ridiculous.

At some point yes, they were improved.

Wilder-Fury was much easier to make.

What proof do you have that both Wilder and Fury were scared to fight Joshua so they fought each other instead?

I didn't think so.

where did i say ducking? did deontay or tyson choose to fight the perceived number one guy in the division with three of the four major belts? can you please provide a source for these ridiculous offers from team aj & a source for what they improved to? deontay v tyson may have been easier to make but my argument is not about how easy a fight is to make it is about who was seen as the top guy in the division & who deontay & tyson chose to fight instead. where did i say deontay or tyson were scared? the fact is they didn't fight the perceived number one guy in the division with three of the four major belts

No argument then. You're not the one claiming "ducking." You're not the one implying that Deontay was "scared."

We agree that Joshua was the perceived number one in the division at the time.

We also agree that no one knows how Wilder vs Joshua would've ended at the time.

[TIC]

I don't believe Joshua has ever ducked anyone, either. But to categorically say Fury and Wilder ducked Joshua? Hogwash.

None of that "proves" that either ducked Joshua.

I'm not a diehard fan of any of them, so bias doesn't come into my argument.

Joshua could've made the Wilder fight happen had he really wanted it. Fact.

Fury swooped in and spared us the ongoing soap opera between Joshua and Wilder. Fact.

No one knows for certain how Joshua would've fared against that version of Wilder. Fact.

aj was rated & seen as the number one in the division & held three of the four major belts. deontay & tyson both chose to fight someone other than the perceived number one guy. this proves both deontay & tyson chose not to fight the perceived number one guy with three of the four major belts. no bias needed as that is what happened.

you can't make someone fight you if they don't want to fight you. fact. what was deontay getting out of fighting tyson instead of aj? aj was seen as number one & had three of the four belts. deontay also would have made more for aj over tyson & getting a chance at three belts & the number one guy in the division

tyson swooped in to fight deontay instead of fighting the number one guy with three of the four major belts. fact. what was tyson getting out of fighting deontay instead of aj? aj was seen as number one & had three of the four belts. tyson would have made more for fighting aj over deontay & getting a chance at three belts & the number one guy in the division

no one knows how an aj v deontay fight would have gone at the time. i agree

"Choosing to fight someone else" does not automatically equate to "ducking."

Wilder and Joshua were involved in long, drawn-out negotiations. If memory serves me correctly (and I'm not one to be interested in the bickering aspect of boxing), Joshua's initial offerings to Wilder were ridiculous.

At some point yes, they were improved.

Wilder-Fury was much easier to make.

What proof do you have that both Wilder and Fury were scared to fight Joshua so they fought each other instead?

I didn't think so.

where did i say ducking? did deontay or tyson choose to fight the perceived number one guy in the division with three of the four major belts? can you please provide a source for these ridiculous offers from team aj & a source for what they improved to? deontay v tyson may have been easier to make but my argument is not about how easy a fight is to make it is about who was seen as the top guy in the division & who deontay & tyson chose to fight instead. where did i say deontay or tyson were scared? the fact is they didn't fight the perceived number one guy in the division with three of the four major belts

No argument then. You're not the one claiming "ducking." You're not the one implying that Deontay was "scared."

We agree that Joshua was the perceived number one in the division at the time.

We also agree that no one knows how Wilder vs Joshua would've ended at the time.

so no sources on those offers? the fact is both deontay & tyson chose to fight each other instead of the perceived number one in the division at the time who held three of the four major belts

[TitoFan]

I don't believe Joshua has ever ducked anyone, either. But to categorically say Fury and Wilder ducked Joshua? Hogwash.

None of that "proves" that either ducked Joshua.

I'm not a diehard fan of any of them, so bias doesn't come into my argument.

Joshua could've made the Wilder fight happen had he really wanted it. Fact.

Fury swooped in and spared us the ongoing soap opera between Joshua and Wilder. Fact.

No one knows for certain how Joshua would've fared against that version of Wilder. Fact.

aj was rated & seen as the number one in the division & held three of the four major belts. deontay & tyson both chose to fight someone other than the perceived number one guy. this proves both deontay & tyson chose not to fight the perceived number one guy with three of the four major belts. no bias needed as that is what happened.

you can't make someone fight you if they don't want to fight you. fact. what was deontay getting out of fighting tyson instead of aj? aj was seen as number one & had three of the four belts. deontay also would have made more for aj over tyson & getting a chance at three belts & the number one guy in the division

tyson swooped in to fight deontay instead of fighting the number one guy with three of the four major belts. fact. what was tyson getting out of fighting deontay instead of aj? aj was seen as number one & had three of the four belts. tyson would have made more for fighting aj over deontay & getting a chance at three belts & the number one guy in the division

no one knows how an aj v deontay fight would have gone at the time. i agree

"Choosing to fight someone else" does not automatically equate to "ducking."

Wilder and Joshua were involved in long, drawn-out negotiations. If memory serves me correctly (and I'm not one to be interested in the bickering aspect of boxing), Joshua's initial offerings to Wilder were ridiculous.

At some point yes, they were improved.

Wilder-Fury was much easier to make.

What proof do you have that both Wilder and Fury were scared to fight Joshua so they fought each other instead?

I didn't think so.

where did i say ducking? did deontay or tyson choose to fight the perceived number one guy in the division with three of the four major belts? can you please provide a source for these ridiculous offers from team aj & a source for what they improved to? deontay v tyson may have been easier to make but my argument is not about how easy a fight is to make it is about who was seen as the top guy in the division & who deontay & tyson chose to fight instead. where did i say deontay or tyson were scared? the fact is they didn't fight the perceived number one guy in the division with three of the four major belts

No argument then. You're not the one claiming "ducking." You're not the one implying that Deontay was "scared."

We agree that Joshua was the perceived number one in the division at the time.

We also agree that no one knows how Wilder vs Joshua would've ended at the time.

so no sources on those offers? the fact is both deontay & tyson chose to fight each other instead of the perceived number one in the division at the time who held three of the four major belts

I can't be bothered with the usual "produce sources" crap today. Take it or leave it.

I remember reading about it, and that's good enough for me.

BTW, I'm not in the mood to prolong useless arguments now.

We agree on some basic things and let's leave it at that.

Someone else was promoting the "ducking" angle, and you came into the conversation.

If you're not claiming "ducking" then there's nothing else to talk about.

[TIC]

i'm just interested in the purses you read about do you remember how much was originally offered & how much they improved to? just roughly, i don't need exacts. i'm not claiming ducking but i am claiming both deontay & tyson avoided the perceived number one guy in the division at the time who held three of the four major belts to instead fight each other