Roger Clemens, steroid user.

[El Kabong]

....what do you care about baseball.....you hate America

[Kirkland Laing]

....what do you care about baseball.....you hate America

Disagreeing with dumbass bigotry isn't the same thing as hating America. America isn't a big dumb racist white boy, it's a secular liberal democracy.

[Kirkland Laing]

Clemens is going to face charges after today. There's no way they can indict Barry Bonds and not charge Clemens.

[El Kabong]

Clemens is going to face charges after today. There's no way they can indict Barry Bonds and not charge Clemens.

And behold, we see the reasoning

Perjury is extremely difficult to prove even in this case or in any case...to find SOLID permissible evidence to prove someone has lied is a hard thing to do considering you have to prove it BEYOND A REASONABLE DOUBT. Even with Andy Petitte's testimony all a lawyer would have to counter with is "I am sure you're a nice person, and you're trying to do the right thing by informing the jury of what happened all those years ago, but is there any possibility you may have simply misunderstood or wrongly remembered the conversation you had with Mr. Clemens" odds are Petitte is going to say "I guess" or something to that effect which should be enough to cause doubt and therefore you're off the hook so to speak.

And Kirkland, America isn't a "secular liberal democracy"...America is a Constitutional Republic we elect our leaders who vote FOR us on certain issues and that is a Republic....they abide (for the most part) to the Constitution in their decision making and via a system of checks and balances. But I do agree, voting IS democratic, and our leaders are secular in that we don't have religious laws passed (not yet), and some of our representatives are liberal.

[Kirkland Laing]

And behold, we see the reasoning

Perjury is extremely difficult to prove even in this case or in any case...to find SOLID permissible evidence to prove someone has lied is a hard thing to do considering you have to prove it BEYOND A REASONABLE DOUBT. Even with Andy Petitte's testimony all a lawyer would have to counter with is "I am sure you're a nice person, and you're trying to do the right thing by informing the jury of what happened all those years ago, but is there any possibility you may have simply misunderstood or wrongly remembered the conversation you had with Mr. Clemens" odds are Petitte is going to say "I guess" or something to that effect which should be enough to cause doubt and therefore you're off the hook so to speak.

And Kirkland, America isn't a "secular liberal democracy"...America is a Constitutional Republic we elect our leaders who vote FOR us on certain issues and that is a Republic....they abide (for the most part) to the Constitution in their decision making and via a system of checks and balances. But I do agree, voting IS democratic, and our leaders are secular in that we don't have religious laws passed (not yet), and some of our representatives are liberal.

There's more evidence from unimpeachable sources like Pettitte and his wife against Clemens than there is against Bonds.

Glad you agree with me that America is a secular liberal democracy.

[El Kabong]

Oh really? So we CAN trust Brian MacNamee but we CAN'T trust Victor Conte or Greg Anderson......yyyyyyeah

[Kirkland Laing]

Oh really? So we CAN trust Brian MacNamee but we CAN'T trust Victor Conte or Greg Anderson......yyyyyyeah

You're not supposed to make the other guy's argument for them in a debate you know.

Similarly compromised people in both cases but far more evidence from uncompromised credible witnessess in Clemens' case. Even the Bush DOJ can't avoid indicting Clemens, unless of course they want to turn it into an election issue.