Wladimir Klitschko Is A Poor Man's Lennox Lewis

[El Kabong]

I don't think the statements about "dominating by holding" are fair. Wladimir works at a distance, if an opponent gets past the jab and works to the inside holding is perfect technique....Lennox Lewis did that and he also pushed off a lot and I think that is how Wlad should mix this up and stay away from the holding, people are watching to see if he gets in a clinch just so they can say "Oh there he goes again, he always holds!". You let a fighter get inside your reach and let his hands stay free then you're going to be in big trouble and you should know that.

Wladimir doesn't hold any more or any less than the champions of similar styles did before him: Ali, Holmes, Lewis.

This is the way tall fighters fight, Wladimir puts on a performance to show how to use height and reach....and sometimes that style looks bad.

It was a bad style match up and everyone has those nights

[El Kabong]

Wladimir knows he needs to have a showing like:

Vitali Klitschko - Kirk Johnson
Lennox Lewis - Michael Grant
Lennox Lewis - Andrew Golota


For Wladimir's next fight he needs someone dangerous and someone who has not been KO'd. My choices are as follows:

1. Nikolay Valuev - He's big, easy to hit, and a KO of him would prove visually impressive.

2. Alexander Povetkin - he's unbeaten, a boxer/puncher and supposed to be the heir to the division....he is also easy to hit.

3. Ruslan Chagaev - I don't think his defense is like Sultan's but his offense might be better. He's solid and a tough fighter if Wladimir can KO him then that would be impressive.

4. Cris Arreola - he's a brawler and a pressure fighter, he has fast hands and good power but he is unproven against the contenders.

5. Alexander Dimitrenko - he's big, tall, and undefeated. KO-ing anyone near his same height would prove impressive and he poses virtually no KO threat but he too is unproven vs the contenders

[p4pking]

Excellent posting Amat. I just watched the fight today(and god knows why, after I'd heard how horrible it was). I was disgusted with how tentative Wlad was in there. Your absolutely right in that he didn't take a single risk in the fight, especially since I didn't think there was all that much risk there, even if he had been aggressive.. Sure he could have been countered if he overcommited to the right hand, but he never even used it to feel out. People who compare that performance with the way Mayweather or Hopkins fight smart, are kidding themselves. Mayweather may not throw his chin out there, but he takes the openings that are there, as does Hopkins or any smart fighter. They at least test their opponents, see what kind of punishment they can take, etc.. Wlad just didn't seem to bother even trying to do anything but the bare minimum he needed to in order to win the rounds. That was not a display of intelligent boxing whatsoever imo, as like I say, he did nothing to create or capitalize on any opening Sultan gave him. The jab was simply a punch he could always land do to his physical advantages. He showed very little boxing IQ if you ask me. I've always hated watching Wlad fight too, though I do respect he has incredible punching power and is a very good athlete. He just lacks some intangibles, that I think would cost him dearly if the HW division was not so poor at the moment.

[ArawakWarria]

Excellent posting Amat. I just watched the fight today(and god knows why, after I'd heard how horrible it was). I was disgusted with how tentative Wlad was in there. Your absolutely right in that he didn't take a single risk in the fight, especially since I didn't think there was all that much risk there, even if he had been aggressive.. Sure he could have been countered if he overcommited to the right hand, but he never even used it to feel out. People who compare that performance with the way Mayweather or Hopkins fight smart, are kidding themselves. Mayweather may not throw his chin out there, but he takes the openings that are there, as does Hopkins or any smart fighter. They at least test their opponents, see what kind of punishment they can take, etc.. Wlad just didn't seem to bother even trying to do anything but the bare minimum he needed to in order to win the rounds. That was not a display of intelligent boxing whatsoever imo, as like I say, he did nothing to create or capitalize on any opening Sultan gave him. The jab was simply a punch he could always land do to his physical advantages. He showed very little boxing IQ if you ask me. I've always hated watching Wlad fight too, though I do respect he has incredible punching power and is a very good athlete. He just lacks some intangibles, that I think would cost him dearly if the HW division was not so poor at the moment.

Ditto to amat & p4pk

I find it amazing how the commentators can have such an intelligent conversation on the use of holding, but it was a different story when it was John Ruiz doing the same thing. He is giving us John Ruiz level action and it is now considered to be the best in the division!

The fighter-that hasn't been KO'd-that WK needs to fight-is Tony Thompson. And while everyone is doing their best to ignore him and not cover his fights, he is now #9 on the Ring & still undefeated since his 4 round decision loss in 2000. Not only is he the WBO mandatory, but it would also be a great US / Ukraine promotion.

[El Kabong]

Fine you fight a shorter fighter and let them have their hands free when they get on the inside.


Comparing Wlad to Ruiz is just fucking stupid

[amat]

Fine you fight a shorter fighter and let them have their hands free when they get on the inside.


Comparing Wlad to Ruiz is just fucking stupid

Lyle, there is nothing wrong with Wlad wanting to fight on the outside. Of course he does.

But you can't just break the rules in order to get by. It's not like the other guy can tie up from the outside just because he doesn't think it's best for him to fight at a distance.

At some point, some referee is going to have to make Klitschko stop tying up on the inside and that is the only time an inside fighter is going to have a shot in there. And it's only fair that he gets that shot and is allowed to keep punching.

There are plenty of things you can do to create space if you're a tall fighter. Wlad's camp always talks about his footspeed, maybe he should move the feet to create space. Anything but holding. It literally seems to be the only thing he knows how to do. That goes back to the boxing IQ point P4P said.

I personally wouldn't compare him to Ruiz because...well Ruiz didn't even punch, inside or out. But as long as this keeps going, you can't blame someone all that much for putting Ruiz and Wlad in the same sentence.

[El Kabong]

...vs Peter he tied up before Sam threw anything vs Sultan he tied up after Sultan threw his punches or when he was out of position....is that wrong? Is that not acceptable?

[ArawakWarria]

I personally wouldn't compare him to Ruiz because...well Ruiz didn't even punch, inside or out. But as long as this keeps going, you can't blame someone all that much for putting Ruiz and Wlad in the same sentence.

amat, again you said it perfectly.


and i will say one more thing, since we are on rules. I can't remember anyone saying that a punch was a downward motion with your arm already fully extended... Althought WK was landing many of his jabs, he was also holding it out, swatting, slapping, I don't know what you would call it, but only this ref could have called it legal.

[amat]

I don't think the statements about "dominating by holding" are fair. Wladimir works at a distance, if an opponent gets past the jab and works to the inside holding is perfect technique....Lennox Lewis did that and he also pushed off a lot and I think that is how Wlad should mix this up and stay away from the holding, people are watching to see if he gets in a clinch just so they can say "Oh there he goes again, he always holds!". You let a fighter get inside your reach and let his hands stay free then you're going to be in big trouble and you should know that.

Wladimir doesn't hold any more or any less than the champions of similar styles did before him: Ali, Holmes, Lewis.

This is the way tall fighters fight, Wladimir puts on a performance to show how to use height and reach....and sometimes that style looks bad.

It was a bad style match up and everyone has those nights

Holding shouldn't be a technique, and while it is, Wladimir definitely takes it to an extreme by using an illegal technique so much that his opponent has next to no chance to win. And I'm not just talking about Ibragimov either because let's be honest he was never going to beat Klitschko.

It's not so much how much holding he does but the fact that it is the only thing he does. I don't think Ali, Holmes and Lewis (especially) held nearly as much as Wladimir does but even if they did, it's not all they did. All did plenty of punching on the inside and Klitschko doesn't.

And pushing off is hardly the same as holding. Lewis did a lot of pushing, so did Ali but at least that keeps the fight going.

As for his next opponents, Chagaev is the next logical step of course and is the fight I would most like to see in the heavyweight division. I don't think Arreola factors in yet and same goes for Dimitrenko who from what I read did not look at all impressive in his last outing.

Valuev - Klitschko is an interesting one that I wouldn't mind seeing and I think it's a bit to early for Povetkin and he would probably go the way of Ibragimov and Brock before him.

[The Shadow]

I don't think the statements about "dominating by holding" are fair. Wladimir works at a distance, if an opponent gets past the jab and works to the inside holding is perfect technique....Lennox Lewis did that and he also pushed off a lot and I think that is how Wlad should mix this up and stay away from the holding, people are watching to see if he gets in a clinch just so they can say "Oh there he goes again, he always holds!". You let a fighter get inside your reach and let his hands stay free then you're going to be in big trouble and you should know that.

Wladimir doesn't hold any more or any less than the champions of similar styles did before him: Ali, Holmes, Lewis.

This is the way tall fighters fight, Wladimir puts on a performance to show how to use height and reach....and sometimes that style looks bad.

It was a bad style match up and everyone has those nights

Indeed. It was a bad style match-up. But that being said, the holding comes right out of the Steward play-book. He's looking quite similar to Lewis. From what I've heard and read, Sultan is one tough S.O.B. and stood in there with a heavy-handed puncher for 12. That's pretty admirable in my neck of the woods.

[littlebif]

Indeed. It was a bad style match-up. But that being said, the holding comes right out of the Steward play-book. He's looking quite similar to Lewis. From what I've heard and read, Sultan is one tough S.O.B. and stood in there with a heavy-handed puncher for 12. That's pretty admirable in my neck of the woods.

Wlad only let his right hand go about 2 times in the whole fight.

[El Kabong]

Wlad only let his right hand go about 2 times in the whole fight.

hyperboles are not needed to try to get your point across....Wladimir landed a lot more than 2 right hands.

[donnydarkoIRL]

I think Wlad boxed badly...

And he still won against a world class opponent.

You've GOT to be good to have an off night and still win.

[Howlin Mad Missy]

Wladimir Klitschko Is A Poor Man's Lennox Lewis?

He could well be a poor mans Klitschko