God help me, I've become a social democrat

[CFH]

I'm voting NDP (all the Canadians will know what that means) .

Fucking education. I knew it would ruin me.

[El Kabong]

Well you had everything stacked against you...you're in Canada, weed is basically legal there.


Just as an aside, I'm fairly liberal on education myself (yeah I'm a college grad and preparing to go to Law School)...I don't agree AT ALL with "No Child Left Behind". I think teachers should be paid more (especially the good ones) and their jobs should be achievement oriented and if they do poorly for a couple years you should be able to fire them without getting teacher's unions on your ass.

[Deanrw]

I'm moving in the opposite direction as I get older. More and more conservative all the time. I used to be fairly Liberal, not anymore.


I'm a cranky old bastard!LOL

[Gandalf]

I'm moving in the opposite direction as I get older. More and more conservative all the time. I used to be fairly Liberal, not anymore.


I'm a cranky old bastard!LOL

Im finding the same thing in myself. Having lived in a country where income tax is less than 10% for so long, I find myself questioning the sense in countries like the UK where the tax band is so high.

I still think Im pretty liberal but when it comes to issues like how much tax Im paying, then I suppose I have become much more self centred.

[Trainer Monkey]

I'm moving in the opposite direction as I get older. More and more conservative all the time. I used to be fairly Liberal, not anymore.


I'm a cranky old bastard!LOL

Im finding the same thing in myself. Having lived in a country where income tax is less than 10% for so long, I find myself questioning the sense in countries like the UK where the tax band is so high.

I still think Im pretty liberal but when it comes to issues like how much tax Im paying, then I suppose I have become much more self centred.

Roads dont build themselves
We all do better when we all do better
Now I dont really like paying for stupid wars,tax breaks for rich people,intrest on national debt.
But I think I can pony for the greater public intrest,Ive certainly benefited from it,every time I fire up my Jeep

[Gandalf]

I'm moving in the opposite direction as I get older. More and more conservative all the time. I used to be fairly Liberal, not anymore.


I'm a cranky old bastard!LOL

Im finding the same thing in myself. Having lived in a country where income tax is less than 10% for so long, I find myself questioning the sense in countries like the UK where the tax band is so high.

I still think Im pretty liberal but when it comes to issues like how much tax Im paying, then I suppose I have become much more self centred.

Roads dont build themselves
We all do better when we all do better
Now I dont really like paying for stupid wars,tax breaks for rich people,intrest on national debt.
But I think I can pony for the greater public intrest,Ive certainly benefited from it,every time I fire up my Jeep

I agree to an extent. Infratructure and the like is fundamental. But Korea has good roads, services and pretty much everybody is covered with health insurance. I cannot complain about those aspects of life here and all with a relatively low tax rate. There is too much bureaucracy in Western governments. And probably too much welfare, especially in the UK.

You dont see too many single mothers in Korea. And Im quite sure thats one reason my tax is so low.

[Trainer Monkey]

Im finding the same thing in myself. Having lived in a country where income tax is less than 10% for so long, I find myself questioning the sense in countries like the UK where the tax band is so high.

I still think Im pretty liberal but when it comes to issues like how much tax Im paying, then I suppose I have become much more self centred.

Roads dont build themselves
We all do better when we all do better
Now I dont really like paying for stupid wars,tax breaks for rich people,intrest on national debt.
But I think I can pony for the greater public intrest,Ive certainly benefited from it,every time I fire up my Jeep

I agree to an extent. Infratructure and the like is fundamental. But Korea has good roads, services and pretty much everybody is covered with health insurance. I cannot complain about those aspects of life here and all with a relatively low tax rate. There is too much bureaucracy in Western governments. And probably too much welfare, especially in the UK.

You dont see too many single mothers in Korea. And Im quite sure thats one reason my tax is so low.

Odd that people allways bitch about "single mom's" but rarely have quite so much fury reserved for "dead beat dad's"

[Gandalf]

Roads dont build themselves
We all do better when we all do better
Now I dont really like paying for stupid wars,tax breaks for rich people,intrest on national debt.
But I think I can pony for the greater public intrest,Ive certainly benefited from it,every time I fire up my Jeep

I agree to an extent. Infratructure and the like is fundamental. But Korea has good roads, services and pretty much everybody is covered with health insurance. I cannot complain about those aspects of life here and all with a relatively low tax rate. There is too much bureaucracy in Western governments. And probably too much welfare, especially in the UK.

You dont see too many single mothers in Korea. And Im quite sure thats one reason my tax is so low.

Odd that people allways bitch about "single mom's" but rarely have quite so much fury reserved for "dead beat dad's"

Anybody who becomes a parent should take responsibility. Dad's especially so. Its a travesty they so often dont. I dont know about life in the US but I do know the UK has become a bit of a farce with the number of children being supported by welfare, and absent or lazy Dad's don't help a bit.

I dont feel comfortable subsidising that through my taxes. I would like to have a child of my own someday and pay for its upbringing myself. Not paying extortionate tax rates for the benefits of all others to become parents might help facilitate that.

The concept of self responsibility is perhaps where I have become more right wing as the years have gone on.

Generally I am still left wing though. I believe in Unions, universal health care, decent pension coverage (for those that work hard). But I do think welfare can go too far.

[Trainer Monkey]

I agree to an extent. Infratructure and the like is fundamental. But Korea has good roads, services and pretty much everybody is covered with health insurance. I cannot complain about those aspects of life here and all with a relatively low tax rate. There is too much bureaucracy in Western governments. And probably too much welfare, especially in the UK.

You dont see too many single mothers in Korea. And Im quite sure thats one reason my tax is so low.

Odd that people allways bitch about "single mom's" but rarely have quite so much fury reserved for "dead beat dad's"

Anybody who becomes a parent should take responsibility. Dad's especially so. Its a travesty they so often dont. I dont know about life in the US but I do know the UK has become a bit of a farce with the number of children being supported by welfare, and absent or lazy Dad's don't help a bit.

I dont feel comfortable subsidising that through my taxes. I would like to have a child of my own someday and pay for its upbringing myself. Not paying extortionate tax rates for the benefits of all others to become parents might help facilitate that.

The concept of self responsibility is perhaps where I have become more right wing as the years have gone on.

Generally I am still left wing though. I believe in Unions, universal health care, decent pension coverage (for those that work hard). But I do think welfare can go too far.

Not in the states
We've gutted the whole system,if your ass is hoping for welfare,your major league screwed blued and tattooed
We've cut enforcement to go after dead beat dads for child support,we've cut LIHEAP,we've cut CHIPS,and if you are a single mom on welfare,we'll force you to neglect your child and get a job that doesnt pay as much as welfare,which pays dirt all.
Welfare reform,can get seriously mean spirited,and we're the shining example of it
But if you want us to blow some stuff up,no problem,helping people is too expensive,killing them is okey dokey

[Gandalf]

Odd that people allways bitch about "single mom's" but rarely have quite so much fury reserved for "dead beat dad's"

Anybody who becomes a parent should take responsibility. Dad's especially so. Its a travesty they so often dont. I dont know about life in the US but I do know the UK has become a bit of a farce with the number of children being supported by welfare, and absent or lazy Dad's don't help a bit.

I dont feel comfortable subsidising that through my taxes. I would like to have a child of my own someday and pay for its upbringing myself. Not paying extortionate tax rates for the benefits of all others to become parents might help facilitate that.

The concept of self responsibility is perhaps where I have become more right wing as the years have gone on.

Generally I am still left wing though. I believe in Unions, universal health care, decent pension coverage (for those that work hard). But I do think welfare can go too far.

Not in the states
We've gutted the whole system,if your ass is hoping for welfare,your major league screwed blued and tattooed
We've cut enforcement to go after dead beat dads for child support,we've cut LIHEAP,we've cut CHIPS,and if you are a single mom on welfare,we'll force you to neglect your child and get a job that doesnt pay as much as welfare,which pays dirt all.
Welfare reform,can get seriously mean spirited,and we're the shining example of it
But if you want us to blow some stuff up,no problem,helping people is too expensive,killing them is okey dokey

That was my perception of how the US has gone. I could never get as right wing as to ever suggest the Republicans should ever get in. America needs change and things are never going to change for the better under McCain. America is at a scary place, and change is better than no change now.

[CFH]

I'm moving in the opposite direction as I get older. More and more conservative all the time. I used to be fairly Liberal, not anymore.


I'm a cranky old bastard!LOL

As Winston Churchill is often quoted, "If you're not a liberal when you're 25, you have no heart. If you're not a conservative by the time you're 35, you have no brain".

I'm still not convinced the quote is Churchill's though...

[Gandalf]

I'm moving in the opposite direction as I get older. More and more conservative all the time. I used to be fairly Liberal, not anymore.


I'm a cranky old bastard!LOL

As Winston Churchill is often quoted, "If you're not a liberal when you're 25, you have no heart. If you're not a conservative by the time you're 35, you have no brain".

I'm still not convinced the quote is Churchill's though...

Politics is the art of bullshit and getting away with it. Churchill was right on the money, a typical politician and not a man to be trusted by any means.

[Trainer Monkey]

Anybody who becomes a parent should take responsibility. Dad's especially so. Its a travesty they so often dont. I dont know about life in the US but I do know the UK has become a bit of a farce with the number of children being supported by welfare, and absent or lazy Dad's don't help a bit.

I dont feel comfortable subsidising that through my taxes. I would like to have a child of my own someday and pay for its upbringing myself. Not paying extortionate tax rates for the benefits of all others to become parents might help facilitate that.

The concept of self responsibility is perhaps where I have become more right wing as the years have gone on.

Generally I am still left wing though. I believe in Unions, universal health care, decent pension coverage (for those that work hard). But I do think welfare can go too far.

Not in the states
We've gutted the whole system,if your ass is hoping for welfare,your major league screwed blued and tattooed
We've cut enforcement to go after dead beat dads for child support,we've cut LIHEAP,we've cut CHIPS,and if you are a single mom on welfare,we'll force you to neglect your child and get a job that doesnt pay as much as welfare,which pays dirt all.
Welfare reform,can get seriously mean spirited,and we're the shining example of it
But if you want us to blow some stuff up,no problem,helping people is too expensive,killing them is okey dokey

That was my perception of how the US has gone. I could never get as right wing as to ever suggest the Republicans should ever get in. America needs change and things are never going to change for the better under McCain. America is at a scary place, and change is better than no change now.

The States are WAY different then when I was a kid,and its gotten mean. It used to be,you just didnt go in "those neighborhoods" now we pretend they just dont exist.
And one thing I freaking loathe is people in this country who go on about how poor they grew up,and then when you ask them,"Did your family ever take welfare" and they awnser"Yeah we were poor"
And then you find yourself thinking,"But you want to cut it to the bone for other people?". I got mine and screw you,WELCOME TO AMERICA

[El Kabong]

There is too much bureaucracy in Western governments. And probably too much welfare, especially in the UK.

You dont see too many single mothers in Korea. And Im quite sure thats one reason my tax is so low.

Yes there IS too much bureaucracy in western governments. And there is no PROBABLY about it there is WAAAAAAY too much welfare ESPECIALLY in places like England and Canada!


As for single mothers....when the government isn't picking up the tab it's not the greatest life choice to keep popping out little bastard kids.

Trainer you're playing revisionist history if you think Americans ever liked it when people got something for nothing ESPECIALLY if it was a person of a different ethnicity....watch Gangs of New York again, it has ALWAYS been like this.

[Trainer Monkey]

There is too much bureaucracy in Western governments. And probably too much welfare, especially in the UK.

You dont see too many single mothers in Korea. And Im quite sure thats one reason my tax is so low.

Yes there IS too much bureaucracy in western governments. And there is no PROBABLY about it there is WAAAAAAY too much welfare ESPECIALLY in places like England and Canada!


As for single mothers....when the government isn't picking up the tab it's not the greatest life choice to keep popping out little bastard kids.

Trainer you're playing revisionist history if you think Americans ever liked it when people got something for nothing ESPECIALLY if it was a person of a different ethnicity....watch Gangs of New York again, it has ALWAYS been like this.

Since you used a work of fiction,Ill use groundbreaking opinion piece from the time "The Other America"
Or would you prefer Upton Sinclairs "The Jungle"
The "Auotbiography of Mother Jones"?
Sorry Lyle,your historically inaccurate,and historically ignorant
Now if you care to bitch about Welfare Moms,complain about the tax abatements Mercedes Benz got to open a plant in the states
It was significantly more costly