Is Hatton Pac's most powerful opponent yet?

[ICB]

Well, yes.

Kostya is rated as perhaps the gretest Light Welter ever and was ranked by many as p4p No.1 when MAB and Erik were in their primes (before Pac fought them.)

oh really now?

how about when hatton fought him? grr i never debate against kostya, his one of my favorites all time. I hope your right as him being the greatest light welterweight ever but I dont think i can really say that. I did enjoy him beating the shit out of JCC twice and ofcourse the zab judah knock the fuck out ghetto boy

well i remember when pac face marco the first time. the ranking went like this.

Roy jones.
Oscar dela hoya
Marco Antonio Barrera

It's hard to gauge how good Kostya was when Hatton stopped him, Hatton completely shut down his work.
However, with Kostya and his amazing power it's a bit irrelevant. Power is the last thing to fade from a fighter and Tszyu couldn't knock Ricky out.

Power alone won't KO Ricky. Precision like Mayweather's can though.

As a MAB fan I have to defend him a little. Marco had gone through some traumatic fights with El Terrible before Pac. Trilogies fade fighters and that may have been the most svagely consistent trilogy of all time. He had also just had surgery on his skull, so although Pac's performance was impressive, I can't say he beat the best Barerra.

Its as if Pacquiao and MAB/Erik are seperate but overlapping eras.
A close to prime Morales beat green Pac, Pac then beat an old Morales.
Very difficult to gauge.

You could also argue MAB was coming off some of his best wins before he fought Manny Pacquiao. He looked great beating Johnny Tapia, Kevin Kelley, Erik Morales 2. And i have to say the 2nd meeting between Erik Morales and MAB wasn't a brutal fight at all.

Infact that was a fight that never caught fire to me, the first 6 rounds were mostly alot of boxing and little action. Then the fight sort of picked up in the last 6 rounds, but it certainly wasn't a brutal fight by any means, infact it was a walk in the park compared to there other 2 fights.

[Julius Rain]

oh really now?

how about when hatton fought him? grr i never debate against kostya, his one of my favorites all time. I hope your right as him being the greatest light welterweight ever but I dont think i can really say that. I did enjoy him beating the shit out of JCC twice and ofcourse the zab judah knock the fuck out ghetto boy

well i remember when pac face marco the first time. the ranking went like this.

Roy jones.
Oscar dela hoya
Marco Antonio Barrera

It's hard to gauge how good Kostya was when Hatton stopped him, Hatton completely shut down his work.
However, with Kostya and his amazing power it's a bit irrelevant. Power is the last thing to fade from a fighter and Tszyu couldn't knock Ricky out.

Power alone won't KO Ricky. Precision like Mayweather's can though.

As a MAB fan I have to defend him a little. Marco had gone through some traumatic fights with El Terrible before Pac. Trilogies fade fighters and that may have been the most svagely consistent trilogy of all time. He had also just had surgery on his skull, so although Pac's performance was impressive, I can't say he beat the best Barerra.

Its as if Pacquiao and MAB/Erik are seperate but overlapping eras.
A close to prime Morales beat green Pac, Pac then beat an old Morales.
Very difficult to gauge.

You could also argue MAB was coming off some of his best wins before he fought Manny Pacquiao. He looked great beating Johnny Tapia, Kevin Kelley, Erik Morales 2. And i have to say the 2nd meeting between Erik Morales and MAB wasn't a brutal fight at all.

Infact that was a fight that never caught fire to me, the first 6 rounds were mostly alot of boxing and little action. Then the fight sort of picked up in the last 6 rounds, but it certainly wasn't a brutal fight by any means, infact it was a walk in the park compared to there other 2 fights.

I really think people buy into that whole myth about "too much war" Jesus Christ, pac is only 30 and he has been in more war then anybody. Seriously have you guyss seen pacs earlier battles before he came to the states. By the time he got to the states he was use to all the wars.

I love Mab i do, but seriously people need to quit with the "too much war" excuses.

When mab first met pac, he only had 2 matches with eric the trilogy came after the pac fight, and he already had several fights after he had his skull surgery, and the camp distraction excuses. Well he didn't do any better in the rematch did he? he just went an extra round longer

Thats right Ice, plus marco already had several fights after he had his surgery. He didn't just had surgery then he fought pac. He already had several fights and won. However the media just found out he had skull surgery right before the pac fight. make sense?

The excuse of "too many war" would be legit if it wasn't against a guy who has the same amount of "war" if not more under his belt. Even Eric Morales said its just a myth.

[ICB]

It's hard to gauge how good Kostya was when Hatton stopped him, Hatton completely shut down his work.
However, with Kostya and his amazing power it's a bit irrelevant. Power is the last thing to fade from a fighter and Tszyu couldn't knock Ricky out.

Power alone won't KO Ricky. Precision like Mayweather's can though.

As a MAB fan I have to defend him a little. Marco had gone through some traumatic fights with El Terrible before Pac. Trilogies fade fighters and that may have been the most svagely consistent trilogy of all time. He had also just had surgery on his skull, so although Pac's performance was impressive, I can't say he beat the best Barerra.

Its as if Pacquiao and MAB/Erik are seperate but overlapping eras.
A close to prime Morales beat green Pac, Pac then beat an old Morales.
Very difficult to gauge.

You could also argue MAB was coming off some of his best wins before he fought Manny Pacquiao. He looked great beating Johnny Tapia, Kevin Kelley, Erik Morales 2. And i have to say the 2nd meeting between Erik Morales and MAB wasn't a brutal fight at all.

Infact that was a fight that never caught fire to me, the first 6 rounds were mostly alot of boxing and little action. Then the fight sort of picked up in the last 6 rounds, but it certainly wasn't a brutal fight by any means, infact it was a walk in the park compared to there other 2 fights.

I really think people buy into that whole myth about "too much war" Jesus Christ, pac is only 30 and he has been in more war then anybody. Seriously have you guyss seen pacs earlier battles before he came to the states. By the time he got to the states he was use to all the wars.

I love Mab i do, but seriously people need to quit with the "too much war" excuses.

When mab first met pac, he only had 2 matches with eric the trilogy came after the pac fight, and he already had several fights after he had his skull surgery, and the camp distraction excuses. Well he didn't do any better in the rematch did he? he just went an extra round longer

Thats right Ice, plus marco already had several fights after he had his surgery. He didn't just had surgery then he fought pac. He already had several fights and won. However the media just found out he had skull surgery right before the pac fight. make sense?

The excuse of "too many war" would be legit if it wasn't against a guy who has the same amount of "war" if not more under his belt. Even Eric Morales said its just a myth.

Rains the stuff you quoted in red i didn't say that Donny did. I was actually sort of agreeing with you i wasn't using any excuses. I think you need to read my post again.

[CGM]

Yeah Conrad, we can ignore the DLH fight, it means very little. Sooner or later PAC is going to find himself in too deep with the weight thing. When that will be I'm not sure. Hatton is probably is toughest opponent in that sense, although PAC has fought "better" guys in the p4p sense.

[Julius Rain]

Oh yea back to Mab:

to be exact, his brain surgery was 6 years and 16 fights ago before the first pacquiao match. So that excuse is really not valid.

[levi#1BoxingFan]

Just curious Jaz, how does a shoulder roll take the effectiveness of landing a body shot away? Your shoulder protects your chin, not your gut.

[JazMerkin]

Just curious Jaz, how does a shoulder roll take the effectiveness of landing a body shot away? Your shoulder protects your chin, not your gut.

Because when PBF does it, he effectively positions his body at a 90 degree angle to his opponent, and used his elbows to protect his gut. Also Joe Cortez reffing that night meant that when he did this, if Hatton went with a body shot with his left, Cortez would pull him up for hitting Mayweather behind the back. So basically whenever Hatton went to the body he would get pulled up on it because of how Mayweather was fighting. Hatton wasn't smart enough on the night to create the angles so he could get his punches in, & Cortez didn't help on this. So yeah that's why in my opinion the shoulder roll meant Hatton could not get in any meaningful work to the body.

[brucelee]

oh really now?

how about when hatton fought him? grr i never debate against kostya, his one of my favorites all time. I hope your right as him being the greatest light welterweight ever but I dont think i can really say that. I did enjoy him beating the shit out of JCC twice and ofcourse the zab judah knock the fuck out ghetto boy

well i remember when pac face marco the first time. the ranking went like this.

Roy jones.
Oscar dela hoya
Marco Antonio Barrera

It's hard to gauge how good Kostya was when Hatton stopped him, Hatton completely shut down his work.
However, with Kostya and his amazing power it's a bit irrelevant. Power is the last thing to fade from a fighter and Tszyu couldn't knock Ricky out.

Power alone won't KO Ricky. Precision like Mayweather's can though.

As a MAB fan I have to defend him a little. Marco had gone through some traumatic fights with El Terrible before Pac. Trilogies fade fighters and that may have been the most svagely consistent trilogy of all time. He had also just had surgery on his skull, so although Pac's performance was impressive, I can't say he beat the best Barerra.

Its as if Pacquiao and MAB/Erik are seperate but overlapping eras.
A close to prime Morales beat green Pac, Pac then beat an old Morales.
Very difficult to gauge.

You could also argue MAB was coming off some of his best wins before he fought Manny Pacquiao. He looked great beating Johnny Tapia, Kevin Kelley, Erik Morales 2. And i have to say the 2nd meeting between Erik Morales and MAB wasn't a brutal fight at all.

Infact that was a fight that never caught fire to me, the first 6 rounds were mostly alot of boxing and little action. Then the fight sort of picked up in the last 6 rounds, but it certainly wasn't a brutal fight by any means, infact it was a walk in the park compared to there other 2 fights.

I agree with you ICB. MAB was just coronated as king of the featherweight when he fought Pac. That was after MAB schooled Hamed. People are forgetting this. Pac was fighting MAB who was at his peak.IMO.

[awdleyfuturehalloffamer]

Is hatton pac's most holding opponent yet?

[donnydarkoIRL]

You could also argue MAB was coming off some of his best wins before he fought Manny Pacquiao. He looked great beating Johnny Tapia, Kevin Kelley, Erik Morales 2. And i have to say the 2nd meeting between Erik Morales and MAB wasn't a brutal fight at all.

Infact that was a fight that never caught fire to me, the first 6 rounds were mostly alot of boxing and little action. Then the fight sort of picked up in the last 6 rounds, but it certainly wasn't a brutal fight by any means, infact it was a walk in the park compared to there other 2 fights.

You could, but then you could just counter saying MAB was about as focused for that fight as Judah.
How could a fighter perform when the media had just caught wind of his injury and spilled it everywhere?

The Morales v MAB 2 fight was more of a boxing affair than the 2 other rows. I actually felt that fight was the one Erik should have been awarded (I scored the other 2 for Marco) and MAB took a lot of straight rights in that fight.

well koysta wasn't just about power. he was awesome to watch because of his accuracy.

I was actually suprise floyd ko'ed ricky, floyd is not well known for his power. Nor is Lazcano but Juan Lazcano was able to hit and nearly put hatton away. Knowing how good a trainer roach is, im sure his going to send pacman out on hatton with a solid game plan. Ok sure pac has not fought at 140, but his speed,stamina and power seem to be there even at 147. Plus he doesn't have to drain himself to make weight anymore. You guys may believe hatton is a devestating body puncher, but is he really? he looked great against pauli but pauli is a soft puncher, hatton could of cared less if pauli caught him with whatever. His going to care and really feel pacs punches though, he probubly wont see them coming nor know where or when they get to him

Kostya was very accurate from range. Under pressure in close he had problems, Hatton availed of this minute flaw.

I've always thought Mayweather is underrated in terms of strength. His style doesn't see him put guys away often as he is primarily a defensive fighter, but with guys like Corrales and Corrales we saw him breakdown good fighters and finish them. To some extent we saw this vs. Judah, but Judah famously interrupted this flow with fouls.

Although Pacquiao stopped De la Hoya (durable at Light Middle) I don't think his punch equates to the power we saw at Superfeather.
He beat Oscar on pressure, persistance and surprisingly acuracy.

[donnydarkoIRL]

You could also argue MAB was coming off some of his best wins before he fought Manny Pacquiao. He looked great beating Johnny Tapia, Kevin Kelley, Erik Morales 2. And i have to say the 2nd meeting between Erik Morales and MAB wasn't a brutal fight at all.

Infact that was a fight that never caught fire to me, the first 6 rounds were mostly alot of boxing and little action. Then the fight sort of picked up in the last 6 rounds, but it certainly wasn't a brutal fight by any means, infact it was a walk in the park compared to there other 2 fights.

You could, but then you could just counter saying MAB was about as focused for that fight as Judah.
How could a fighter perform when the media had just caught wind of his injury and spilled it everywhere?

The Morales v MAB 2 fight was more of a boxing affair than the 2 other rows. I actually felt that fight was the one Erik should have been awarded (I scored the other 2 for Marco) and MAB took a lot of straight rights in that fight.

well koysta wasn't just about power. he was awesome to watch because of his accuracy.

I was actually suprise floyd ko'ed ricky, floyd is not well known for his power. Nor is Lazcano but Juan Lazcano was able to hit and nearly put hatton away. Knowing how good a trainer roach is, im sure his going to send pacman out on hatton with a solid game plan. Ok sure pac has not fought at 140, but his speed,stamina and power seem to be there even at 147. Plus he doesn't have to drain himself to make weight anymore. You guys may believe hatton is a devestating body puncher, but is he really? he looked great against pauli but pauli is a soft puncher, hatton could of cared less if pauli caught him with whatever. His going to care and really feel pacs punches though, he probubly wont see them coming nor know where or when they get to him

Kostya was very accurate from range. Under pressure in close he had problems, Hatton availed of this minute flaw.

I've always thought Mayweather is underrated in terms of strength. His style doesn't see him put guys away often as he is primarily a defensive fighter, but with guys like Corrales and Corrales we saw him breakdown good fighters and finish them. To some extent we saw this vs. Judah, but Judah famously interrupted this flow with fouls.

Although Pacquiao stopped De la Hoya (durable at Light Middle) I don't think his punch equates to the power we saw at Superfeather.
He beat Oscar on pressure, persistance and surprisingly acuracy.

[Conrad]

Although Pacquiao stopped De la Hoya (durable at Light Middle) I don't think his punch equates to the power we saw at Superfeather.
He beat Oscar on pressure, persistance and surprisingly acuracy.

I couldn't agree more Donny.

Maybe it's wishful thinking on my part but I can't help but think the ODLH win exagerates his capabilities at the higher weights somewhat. Sure he looked awesome against Oscar but that's as much down to ODLH himself as it is Pac.

How can everybody be so sure that Pac takes his power with him to 140 and above? IMO the ODLH fight can't be evidence of that.

[Cortez The Killer]

Forgive me ass straight off:

I didnt read any responses here yet.

I think yes: Hatton is definitely the hardest oppent Pac would fight.

PAC schooled dlh, but from a fairly non-biased view dlh was looking pretty zombie that night.

And I am not taking away from Pacquiao. Oscar just didnt have it in him physically that night.

I have never been a fan of Hatton, but that doesnt mean I dont like him. He's a hard, rough, go ahead fighter and anyone who fights him is going to have to buckle down hard and be in their game, because he is a little pitbull even on his off nights.

Hatton detractors can say what they want: but the fact is at 140 he is a physical force. Oscar at 147 wasnt, he was a dead man walking.

I think a number of fighters could have beaten Oscar that night. Not as smooothly as Manny, but they would have beaten Oscar down and ended it before the final bell. The fact that Manny did it moving up was what was spectacular, but it didnt look like DLH had too much fight in him to start out. Whatever was there Pac beat down quickly.



From what I said it may sound like I'd favor hatton against pac. But I dont.

Hatton looked nervous when he saw how thoroughly pacman destroyed oscar.

Ricky had doubt in how he would fare against oscar when it was being talked about, and even though it was a weak oscar that showed up against pacman, hatton still has that fear.

Pac out speeds hatton. Hatton will give a very good fight, but he just wont have it.

However much free money I have that night it's on Pac UD.

[fan johnny]

Assuming Hatton is able to connect, weight class and power behind his punches then yes he is the biggest and most powerful Pacquiao will have faced inside the ring. Oscar was only 142 at fight time and wasn't able to land anything flush so while he would have been the biggest (not the tallest). You have to remember more power comes with more weight behind it. Had Oscar not overtrained his weight he would have been the biggest. My guess is he was afraid of that 3 million per pound clause over the limit.

Only way Hatton wins this fight is he can get in close otherwise Hatton gets outboxed and out punched. Expect Hatton to come into the fight around 150lbs and Pacquiao two or three pounds less than that. Although there is a good chance Hatton makes the same mistake as DLH and overtrains. I read he is planning 13 weeks training.

[Andre]

Kostya had focus ,timing and big pucussive power from it all put together.
Pac and Mayweather have a sharper faster accumulation style damage that Ricky will find harder to cope with in the later rounds.If he does damage fast in the first 5 rounds he has a hope but I think its a repeat of Floyds style of fight against him and he wont have the patience after all else fails early on.

Kostya fought Rickys fight and even said he would fight his fight from the start so the younger fitter more hungary man deservedly won, these other two mentioned dont fight like that he will find it hard to catch Pac clean once he goes off plan. Im with Pac so long as he doesnt get dragged into a phone box style fight which I dont think he will, so long as hes got the legs he'll use them.