P4P bias towards American based fighters?

[Trainer Monkey]

Less then half of the list is everyone but Americans....

Pacquiao, Hatton, Vazquez, Munoz, Darchinyan, Doniare, etc are not American and they are all mainstays...Hell the liost changes every month...

Not too long ago the only Americans were Hopkins and Pavlik,

No i said American based not specifically Americans.

Pac, Hatton, Vazquez etc.. have all fought in or beaten American based fighters.

I can't find a non-American based fighter in The Ring's top ten. This is understandable considering it is an American publication but still....

Most fights happen in America at the higher levels,how could it be any other way

[Fenster]

Less then half of the list is everyone but Americans....

Pacquiao, Hatton, Vazquez, Munoz, Darchinyan, Doniare, etc are not American and they are all mainstays...Hell the liost changes every month...

Not too long ago the only Americans were Hopkins and Pavlik,

No i said American based not specifically Americans.

Pac, Hatton, Vazquez etc.. have all fought in or beaten American based fighters.

I can't find a non-American based fighter in The Ring's top ten. This is understandable considering it is an American publication but still....

Most fights happen in America at the higher levels,how could it be any other way

Yes.. the majority of BIG fights happen in America where the glamour divisions are concerned.. but this shouldn't have such an over strong bias towards P4P rankings.

Glen Johnson entered the top ten after beating Roy Jones. Roy is undoubtedly a great fighter but was coming off a loss in under 6 minutes. Johnson had 9-10 losses on his record.

Pavlik entered the top 10 after beating Taylor. But Taylor had been DROPPED from the top 10 for poor performances. Pavlik has no better record than Abraham.

There's an inconsistency here, no?

[DaxxKahn]

No i said American based not specifically Americans.

Pac, Hatton, Vazquez etc.. have all fought in or beaten American based fighters.

I can't find a non-American based fighter in The Ring's top ten. This is understandable considering it is an American publication but still....

Most fights happen in America at the higher levels,how could it be any other way

Yes.. the majority of BIG fights happen in America where the glamour divisions are concerned.. but this shouldn't have such an over strong bias towards P4P rankings.

Glen Johnson entered the top ten after beating Roy Jones. Roy is undoubtedly a great fighter but was coming off a loss in under 6 minutes. Johnson had 9-10 losses on his record.

Pavlik entered the top 10 after beating Taylor. But Taylor had ben DROPPED from the top 10 for poor performances. Pavlik has no better record than Abraham.

There's an inconsistency here, no?

Pavlik also beat top rated at the time..Edison Miranda....

Taylor had 2 shitty performences against Junior Middleweights...Small ones at that

[Fenster]

Most fights happen in America at the higher levels,how could it be any other way

Yes.. the majority of BIG fights happen in America where the glamour divisions are concerned.. but this shouldn't have such an over strong bias towards P4P rankings.

Glen Johnson entered the top ten after beating Roy Jones. Roy is undoubtedly a great fighter but was coming off a loss in under 6 minutes. Johnson had 9-10 losses on his record.

Pavlik entered the top 10 after beating Taylor. But Taylor had ben DROPPED from the top 10 for poor performances. Pavlik has no better record than Abraham.

There's an inconsistency here, no?

Pavlik also beat top rated at the time..Edison Miranda....

Taylor had 2 shitty performences against Junior Middleweights...Small ones at that

That's the point, Daxx

Abraham had already beat Miranda.

[Spicoli]

In the minority here,but I think p4p ranking are mostly subjective and a bit useless,I cant stand them.They often dispay the "out of sight,out of mind" mentality that many lower weight class fighters suffer from.Simply because we (American based media ?) have not seen a fighter on a regular basis,should that exclude them from consideration?P4P can be a popularity/familiarity contest.Chris john is making his stateside big show splash with Rocky "tons o' chances" Juarez next fight.A big win will put him in the conversation.

[Fenster]

In the minority here,but I think p4p ranking are mostly subjective and a bit useless,I cant stand them.They often dispay the "out of sight,out of mind" mentality that many lower weight class fighters suffer from.Simply because we (American based media ?) have not seen a fighter on a regular basis,should that exclude them from consideration?P4P can be a popularity/familiarity contest.Chris john is making his stateside big show splash with Rocky "tons o' chances" Juarez next fight.A big win will put him in the conversation.

I'm with you Spicoli.

P4P is nonsense. I'm certain it is more popularity than anything else. And it clearly has no use at all if completely favouring a particular group.

So much weight is put in it though

[Spicoli]

They do give us a broad general feel for the most prominent and current fighters (?).maybe just not the most accurate reflection of "best fighter" & Thats where it gets full of spotty definitions.It really can be a mind melt.Has to be a complete balance of Competition faced,consitancy,and all around skillset I suppose.By definition,Skillset should be at the top but it gets blurry.

[ICB]

No i said American based not specifically Americans.

Pac, Hatton, Vazquez etc.. have all fought in or beaten American based fighters.

I can't find a non-American based fighter in The Ring's top ten. This is understandable considering it is an American publication but still....

Most fights happen in America at the higher levels,how could it be any other way

Yes.. the majority of BIG fights happen in America where the glamour divisions are concerned.. but this shouldn't have such an over strong bias towards P4P rankings.

Glen Johnson entered the top ten after beating Roy Jones. Roy is undoubtedly a great fighter but was coming off a loss in under 6 minutes. Johnson had 9-10 losses on his record.

Pavlik entered the top 10 after beating Taylor. But Taylor had ben DROPPED from the top 10 for poor performances. Pavlik has no better record than Abraham.

There's an inconsistency here, no?

Im pretty sure Jermain Taylor was still in the top 10 P4P.

[Fenster]

Most fights happen in America at the higher levels,how could it be any other way

Yes.. the majority of BIG fights happen in America where the glamour divisions are concerned.. but this shouldn't have such an over strong bias towards P4P rankings.

Glen Johnson entered the top ten after beating Roy Jones. Roy is undoubtedly a great fighter but was coming off a loss in under 6 minutes. Johnson had 9-10 losses on his record.

Pavlik entered the top 10 after beating Taylor. But Taylor had ben DROPPED from the top 10 for poor performances. Pavlik has no better record than Abraham.

There's an inconsistency here, no?

Im pretty sure Jermain Taylor was still in the top 10 P4P.

He wasn't.

When you get the time look it up

[JazMerkin]

For the record I thought Hopkins beat Taylor twice, & that Marquez won the 2nd fight & could easily have given him the first.

However, the fact is those were fights that could have gone the other way, whilst IMO the John-Marquez decision was just an outright hometown decision & I think this is why it has not helped John the same way.

I think the Ring P4P ratings are pretty good, yes sometimes they may bump a fighter too high on the basis of hype (Taylor, Pavlik), but I feel that overall they are pretty fair. Of the 3 fighters with a claim to P4P#1 since PBF retired (Pac,JMM,JC) only Pacquiao is actually based in the US for training & I think of last week's top 10, at most half are based in the US. The fact is the US is where the big money fights are so that's where they will fight out of. In addition, IMO you will generally get more competitive fights over there, as over here in Europe, there is a tendency for fighters to take it easy a bit in terms of their opposition sometimes.

[Fenster]

For the record I thought Hopkins beat Taylor twice, & that Marquez won the 2nd fight & could easily have given him the first.

However, the fact is those were fights that could have gone the other way, whilst IMO the John-Marquez decision was just an outright hometown decision & I think this is why it has not helped John the same way.

I think the Ring P4P ratings are pretty good, yes sometimes they may bump a fighter too high on the basis of hype (Taylor, Pavlik), but I feel that overall they are pretty fair. Of the 3 fighters with a claim to P4P#1 since PBF retired (Pac,JMM,JC) only Pacquiao is actually based in the US for training & I think of last week's top 10, at most half are based in the US. The fact is the US is where the big money fights are so that's where they will fight out of. In addition, IMO you will generally get more competitive fights over there, as over here in Europe, there is a tendency for fighters to take it easy a bit in terms of their opposition sometimes.

I agree.. the Ring ratings pretty much mirror the fans view.

The current top 10 have all fought in "world" title fights in America. The non-American based fighters fight there.

Fighters taking it "easy" in other countries? Don't know about that, have you got examples?

[Lance Uppercut]

For the record I thought Hopkins beat Taylor twice, & that Marquez won the 2nd fight & could easily have given him the first.

However, the fact is those were fights that could have gone the other way, whilst IMO the John-Marquez decision was just an outright hometown decision & I think this is why it has not helped John the same way.

I think the Ring P4P ratings are pretty good, yes sometimes they may bump a fighter too high on the basis of hype (Taylor, Pavlik), but I feel that overall they are pretty fair. Of the 3 fighters with a claim to P4P#1 since PBF retired (Pac,JMM,JC) only Pacquiao is actually based in the US for training & I think of last week's top 10, at most half are based in the US. The fact is the US is where the big money fights are so that's where they will fight out of. In addition, IMO you will generally get more competitive fights over there, as over here in Europe, there is a tendency for fighters to take it easy a bit in terms of their opposition sometimes.

I agree.. the Ring ratings pretty much mirror the fans view.

The current top 10 have all fought in "world" title fights in America. The non-American based fighters fight there.

Fighters taking it "easy" in other countries? Don't know about that, have you got examples?

Fighting crap mandatories instead of fight legit fighters. Joe C. did it for almost 9 years, Kessler has been doing it a lot lately, and Chris John has been fighting crap mandatories since he beat JMM(although that is about to change).And almost every german based fighter who holds the WBA title does this.

[JazMerkin]

For the record I thought Hopkins beat Taylor twice, & that Marquez won the 2nd fight & could easily have given him the first.

However, the fact is those were fights that could have gone the other way, whilst IMO the John-Marquez decision was just an outright hometown decision & I think this is why it has not helped John the same way.

I think the Ring P4P ratings are pretty good, yes sometimes they may bump a fighter too high on the basis of hype (Taylor, Pavlik), but I feel that overall they are pretty fair. Of the 3 fighters with a claim to P4P#1 since PBF retired (Pac,JMM,JC) only Pacquiao is actually based in the US for training & I think of last week's top 10, at most half are based in the US. The fact is the US is where the big money fights are so that's where they will fight out of. In addition, IMO you will generally get more competitive fights over there, as over here in Europe, there is a tendency for fighters to take it easy a bit in terms of their opposition sometimes.

I agree.. the Ring ratings pretty much mirror the fans view.

The current top 10 have all fought in "world" title fights in America. The non-American based fighters fight there.

Fighters taking it "easy" in other countries? Don't know about that, have you got examples?

Fighting crap mandatories instead of fight legit fighters. Joe C. did it for almost 9 years, Kessler has been doing it a lot lately, and Chris John has been fighting crap mandatories since he beat JMM(although that is about to change).And almost every german based fighter who holds the WBA title does this.

Yeah that's basically what I meant, although I was more specifically thinking of some of the guys with Sauerland but those mentioned have kind of done the same thing, although they have all faced class opposition at some point.

[Fenster]

For the record I thought Hopkins beat Taylor twice, & that Marquez won the 2nd fight & could easily have given him the first.

However, the fact is those were fights that could have gone the other way, whilst IMO the John-Marquez decision was just an outright hometown decision & I think this is why it has not helped John the same way.

I think the Ring P4P ratings are pretty good, yes sometimes they may bump a fighter too high on the basis of hype (Taylor, Pavlik), but I feel that overall they are pretty fair. Of the 3 fighters with a claim to P4P#1 since PBF retired (Pac,JMM,JC) only Pacquiao is actually based in the US for training & I think of last week's top 10, at most half are based in the US. The fact is the US is where the big money fights are so that's where they will fight out of. In addition, IMO you will generally get more competitive fights over there, as over here in Europe, there is a tendency for fighters to take it easy a bit in terms of their opposition sometimes.

I agree.. the Ring ratings pretty much mirror the fans view.

The current top 10 have all fought in "world" title fights in America. The non-American based fighters fight there.

Fighters taking it "easy" in other countries? Don't know about that, have you got examples?

Fighting crap mandatories instead of fight legit fighters. Joe C. did it for almost 9 years, Kessler has been doing it a lot lately, and Chris John has been fighting crap mandatories since he beat JMM(although that is about to change).And almost every german based fighter who holds the WBA title does this.

I'm pretty sure Calzaghe didn't face many mandatories. Can you name them? And it's no different to what Hopkins was doing with his IBF title, right?

Kessler has had two fights since Calzaghe beat him. Before that he was trying to unify the titles.

Since beating Marquez, John has beaten Rojas - the guy that KO'd current Ring P4P no.10 Caballero.

P4P ranked Kelly Pavlik fought "crap" mandatrory Gary Lockett last year. P4P Cotto fought Gomez? P4P fighters face "crap" too... but it's not always clear why they get the rating

[CutMeMick]

Fenster there's a lot of boxers who aren't based here in the states meaning they live, train in other countries but they fight here because of the cash. They get payed dollars here they fight in the best arenas in the world on TV.

Based to me is someone who lives here, trains here and fights here.


Since 2000.

Naz (trained and fought in the UK)
"Finito" Lopez (trained in Mexico & Japan fought mostly there until the later part of his career)
PongsaShit (Never fucken left Thailand not even on vacation)
Hatton (trains and lives and fights in the UK mostly until recently)
Calzaghe (trains and lives fights in the UK until recently)
Mijares (Mexico trains, lives and fights there mostly)
Castillo (trains, lives in Mexico fought 50/50 in Mexico & US)
Caballero (trains, lives in Panama fights
JMM (trains, lives in Mexico fights in the US)
Rafa (trains, lives in Mexico fights in the US)
Cotto (trains mostly in PR has also trained in FL. lives in PR)
Calderon (trains in PR, lives in PR fights in both the US & PR)


-Margarito lives in Mexico, trains here in Los Angeles and fights here so I
to me that would make him a US based fighter.

Take Izzy Vasquez he's a Mexican boxer, but he lives, trains and fights here in the states therefore hes a US based boxer.
But as I stated to me your based here if you live, train & fight here.
If you train, live in another country but just fight here I don't consider that a US based fighter like Ricky Hatton.