JMM v. Mayweather Talks underway

[ClubberLang]

I just don't think at the end of the day that Marquez will bring enough money to the table to interest Mayweather. It's be an interesting fight, though Marquez is going to be pushing it weight wise. The fight could also become a snoozer with both guys looking for countering opportunities.

[killersheep]

ANYWAY

Since this isn't a Pacquiao thread.

Is it just me or does Dan Rafael "report" team Mayweather is in talks with everyone that wins a major fight between 135 and 147?

[Taeth]

ANYWAY

Since this isn't a Pacquiao thread.

Is it just me or does Dan Rafael "report" team Mayweather is in talks with everyone that wins a major fight between 135 and 147?

I think its because they think they are in talks with Mayweather. And it would make sense, there are so many guys right now that could further promote Mayweather's career that he must be interested with Cotto, Pacquiao, Hatton II, Mosley, Marquez, and if he wins a big fight Andre Berto.

[killersheep]

ANYWAY

Since this isn't a Pacquiao thread.

Is it just me or does Dan Rafael "report" team Mayweather is in talks with everyone that wins a major fight between 135 and 147?

I think its because they think they are in talks with Mayweather. And it would make sense, there are so many guys right now that could further promote Mayweather's career that he must be interested with Cotto, Pacquiao, Hatton II, Mosley, Marquez, and if he wins a big fight Andre Berto.

By "They" do you mean Dan Rafael?

[GAME]

I just don't think at the end of the day that Marquez will bring enough money to the table to interest Mayweather. It's be an interesting fight, though Marquez is going to be pushing it weight wise. The fight could also become a snoozer with both guys looking for countering opportunities.

I hope your right and it doesnt happen . Theres so many more better fights to be made

Marquez is out of his depth and would be shooled by the better man . Even if Floyd is proper ring rusty he still has it easy with Marquez. Juan didnt look good againt Nate campbells leftovers up until the stoppage. I dont think he was leading vs a washed up Casamayor either .

[JT Rock]

Lets clarify something...

Jmm/Pac #1 was a draw

Jmm/Pac#2 Pac scrapes by for a win

Pac beat him once not twice

Also taeth your so full of crap sometimes, you absolutely jump on any athletically gifted fighters lap and denigrate any fighter thats not..

Classic example, you say Pac is better than JMM.. HMMM weird that in 2 fight with Pac, marquez won more rounds oficially and can be argued strongly that Jmm could have got the nod or ideally and deservedly another draw.

Stop trying to argue D Diaz absolute shit credentials, he was an extremely weak title holder, no one gives a crap that he beat Zab to get into the olympics.... Geezus Chrise man, Mike Tyson didnt make the olympic team

Delahoya at 147 was an absolute zombie, freeze dried shell of the fighter he once was didnt even hydrate to the 160 that he did when he was 10 years younger.

Jmm has done more and looked even more impressive over elite competition, were as Pac fought a once elite Delahoya that was inactive and shot and a weak title holder... Those my friend are undisputable facts

[Taeth]

Lets clarify something...

Jmm/Pac #1 was a draw

Jmm/Pac#2 Pac scrapes by for a win

Pac beat him once not twice

Also taeth your so full of crap sometimes, you absolutely jump on any athletically gifted fighters lap and denigrate any fighter thats not..

Classic example, you say Pac is better than JMM.. HMMM weird that in 2 fight with Pac, marquez won more rounds oficially and can be argued strongly that Jmm could have got the nod or ideally and deservedly another draw.

Stop trying to argue D Diaz absolute shit credentials, he was an extremely weak title holder, no one gives a crap that he beat Zab to get into the olympics.... Geezus Chrise man, Mike Tyson didnt make the olympic team

Delahoya at 147 was an absolute zombie, freeze dried shell of the fighter he once was didnt even hydrate to the 160 that he did when he was 10 years younger.

Jmm has done more and looked even more impressive over elite competition, were as Pac fought a once elite Delahoya that was inactive and shot and a weak title holder... Those my friend are undisputable facts

Was Dela Hoya 10 years younger when he KO'ed Mayorga 10x faster and more impressively than Mosley? Was he 10 years younger when he fought competitive fights with Hopkins and Mayweather?

How has JMM done more at the elite level? You are the one talking crap. JMM doesn't even have half the elite level fights that Pacquiao has had. Pacquiao has foughten four ATG's and has come out of nine confrontation 8-1-1(4ko's). You say Oscar is shot yet fail to recognize that Joel Casamayor has been shot for a few years. Oscar had the best sparring partners imaginable to get ready for Pacman, the best trainers, everything. Don't use inactivity as an excuse. Pacquiao looked better both times against Barrera if you want to compare a common opponent. I am not denigrating JMM, I am stating the obvious that he isn't as good as Pacquiao. That's why he isn't p4p#1, thats why he struggled with a decent but not great Juan Diaz.

Once again Bowe won 2 out of 3 fights against Holyfield, he wasn't the greater fighter, Saddler won 3 out of 4 fights with Pep, he wasn't the greater fighter. Buster Douglas beat Tyson, he wasn't the greater fighter, styles make fights, and Marquez employs the perfect strategy against Pacquiao.

I was just making a point with David Diaz in that he isn't the worst fighter ever, he is a decent fighter. He wasn't hte best that the lightweight division had to offer. As for Oscar De La Hoya, he would have beaten Marquez even on that night, a guy who is easy to hit, who isn't unorthodox, who is that much shorter, and more importantly Oscar's jab and left hook would be lined up. If people watched Oscar against PAcquiao then against Mayweather, you will see that its movement that killed him, he wasn't able to get off punches because Manny wasn't there, he employed brilliant footwork.

Also in this case I think Mayweather, Berto, Roy Jones Jr are all better athletes than Pacquiao, and I like first and the latter more than Pacquiao, but I still recognize that he has accomplished more with his career, because he has more heart, he wants to fight best, and he succeeds when he does.

Once again its bullshit to say PAcquiao has only foughten a once elite De La Hoya, he also faced Barrera twice, Morales 3 times, MArquez twice, not to mention other very highly ranked individuals.

Either you know nothing about boxing or you know nothing east Pacquiao's career if this is the refuse you spew forth.

[JT Rock]

Lets clarify something...

Jmm/Pac #1 was a draw

Jmm/Pac#2 Pac scrapes by for a win

Pac beat him once not twice

Also taeth your so full of crap sometimes, you absolutely jump on any athletically gifted fighters lap and denigrate any fighter thats not..

Classic example, you say Pac is better than JMM.. HMMM weird that in 2 fight with Pac, marquez won more rounds oficially and can be argued strongly that Jmm could have got the nod or ideally and deservedly another draw.

Stop trying to argue D Diaz absolute shit credentials, he was an extremely weak title holder, no one gives a crap that he beat Zab to get into the olympics.... Geezus Chrise man, Mike Tyson didnt make the olympic team

Delahoya at 147 was an absolute zombie, freeze dried shell of the fighter he once was didnt even hydrate to the 160 that he did when he was 10 years younger.

Jmm has done more and looked even more impressive over elite competition, were as Pac fought a once elite Delahoya that was inactive and shot and a weak title holder... Those my friend are undisputable facts

Was Dela Hoya 10 years younger when he KO'ed Mayorga 10x faster and more impressively than Mosley? Was he 10 years younger when he fought competitive fights with Hopkins and Mayweather?

How has JMM done more at the elite level? You are the one talking crap. JMM doesn't even have half the elite level fights that Pacquiao has had. Pacquiao has foughten four ATG's and has come out of nine confrontation 8-1-1(4ko's). You say Oscar is shot yet fail to recognize that Joel Casamayor has been shot for a few years. Oscar had the best sparring partners imaginable to get ready for Pacman, the best trainers, everything. Don't use inactivity as an excuse. Pacquiao looked better both times against Barrera if you want to compare a common opponent. I am not denigrating JMM, I am stating the obvious that he isn't as good as Pacquiao. That's why he isn't p4p#1, thats why he struggled with a decent but not great Juan Diaz.

Once again Bowe won 2 out of 3 fights against Holyfield, he wasn't the greater fighter, Saddler won 3 out of 4 fights with Pep, he wasn't the greater fighter. Buster Douglas beat Tyson, he wasn't the greater fighter, styles make fights, and Marquez employs the perfect strategy against Pacquiao.

I was just making a point with David Diaz in that he isn't the worst fighter ever, he is a decent fighter. He wasn't hte best that the lightweight division had to offer. As for Oscar De La Hoya, he would have beaten Marquez even on that night, a guy who is easy to hit, who isn't unorthodox, who is that much shorter, and more importantly Oscar's jab and left hook would be lined up. If people watched Oscar against PAcquiao then against Mayweather, you will see that its movement that killed him, he wasn't able to get off punches because Manny wasn't there, he employed brilliant footwork.

Also in this case I think Mayweather, Berto, Roy Jones Jr are all better athletes than Pacquiao, and I like first and the latter more than Pacquiao, but I still recognize that he has accomplished more with his career, because he has more heart, he wants to fight best, and he succeeds when he does.

Once again its bullshit to say PAcquiao has only foughten a once elite De La Hoya, he also faced Barrera twice, Morales 3 times, MArquez twice, not to mention other very highly ranked individuals.

Either you know nothing about boxing or you know nothing east Pacquiao's career if this is the refuse you spew forth.

Many writers including Dan Rafael rank JMM achievments highr than both Barrera and Morales..

Delahoya hasnt fought 147 for almost a decade

You have ignored the fact that JMM has won more rounds against Pac in 2 combined fights.

Casamayor was the recognized Ring Champion at 135 and had been fighting at that weight all along.... Not an inactive fighter, competing at a weight he hadnt fought in 10 years... Were was Oscar ranked at the time of the fight? Certainly not ranked as high as Casa.

You are the one with questionable knowledge

[Taeth]

Oscar made 150, and looked fine against Forbes, stop using 3 pounds as an excuse. People thought the Forbes fight even indicated he could do well against Mayweather.

Even with his current victories I don't see how Marquez would possibly have a better resume than Barrera or Morales. They both fought a lot more top end guys then Marquez who was always in their shadow.

I am not saying Marquez isn't one of the mexican greats, I think he will surpass Barrera and Morales before his career is over, which is an amazing feat considering he never got the recognition he deserved. I love watching him fight, but that doesn't change the fact Pacquiao is a little better than him, I don't know why that bothers you guys so much. Pacquiao is more dominant, he's more exciting, and he's beaten Marquez among others.

Marquez one more rounds in the first fight against Pacquiao when Manny was a totally different fighter, in the second fight besides Gerry Roth's ridiculous scoring he didn't win more rounds.

All in all it doesn't change the fact Marquez wouldn't have been able to beat Oscar the same way, he wouldn't be the nearly 50/50 split against Mayweather, nor would he favorite like Pacquiao would be against guys like Miguel Cotto. The reason is because Pacquiao is a dynamic fighter, I am not talking about his athleticism, I am talking about his style, nobody else fights like him, which makes it a unique experience facing him.

Once again, I find it funny that you guys can criticize other people for saying how great Pacquiao is, which is plainly the truth, but when Marquez is mentioned you guys think he is the greatest mexican fighter ever, or that he should be p4p #1, when he isn't. He's a great fighter, but he isn't as good as Bernard Hopkins, and he definitely isn't as good as Pacquiao, he is in their league, but on a slightly dimmer celestial plane.

[JonesJrMayweather]

Oscar made 150, and looked fine against Forbes, stop using 3 pounds as an excuse. People thought the Forbes fight even indicated he could do well against Mayweather.

Even with his current victories I don't see how Marquez would possibly have a better resume than Barrera or Morales. They both fought a lot more top end guys then Marquez who was always in their shadow.

I am not saying Marquez isn't one of the mexican greats, I think he will surpass Barrera and Morales before his career is over, which is an amazing feat considering he never got the recognition he deserved. I love watching him fight, but that doesn't change the fact Pacquiao is a little better than him, I don't know why that bothers you guys so much. Pacquiao is more dominant, he's more exciting, and he's beaten Marquez among others.

Marquez one more rounds in the first fight against Pacquiao when Manny was a totally different fighter, in the second fight besides Gerry Roth's ridiculous scoring he didn't win more rounds.

All in all it doesn't change the fact Marquez wouldn't have been able to beat Oscar the same way, he wouldn't be the nearly 50/50 split against Mayweather, nor would he favorite like Pacquiao would be against guys like Miguel Cotto. The reason is because Pacquiao is a dynamic fighter, I am not talking about his athleticism, I am talking about his style, nobody else fights like him, which makes it a unique experience facing him.

Once again, I find it funny that you guys can criticize other people for saying how great Pacquiao is, which is plainly the truth, but when Marquez is mentioned you guys think he is the greatest mexican fighter ever, or that he should be p4p #1, when he isn't. He's a great fighter, but he isn't as good as Bernard Hopkins, and he definitely isn't as good as Pacquiao, he is in their league, but on a slightly dimmer celestial plane.

didnt oscar fight forbes after losing to PBF? dont see how that would serve as an indicator for a fight that already happened

[brucelee]

Oscar made 150, and looked fine against Forbes, stop using 3 pounds as an excuse. People thought the Forbes fight even indicated he could do well against Mayweather.

Even with his current victories I don't see how Marquez would possibly have a better resume than Barrera or Morales. They both fought a lot more top end guys then Marquez who was always in their shadow.

I am not saying Marquez isn't one of the mexican greats, I think he will surpass Barrera and Morales before his career is over, which is an amazing feat considering he never got the recognition he deserved. I love watching him fight, but that doesn't change the fact Pacquiao is a little better than him, I don't know why that bothers you guys so much. Pacquiao is more dominant, he's more exciting, and he's beaten Marquez among others.

Marquez one more rounds in the first fight against Pacquiao when Manny was a totally different fighter, in the second fight besides Gerry Roth's ridiculous scoring he didn't win more rounds.

All in all it doesn't change the fact Marquez wouldn't have been able to beat Oscar the same way, he wouldn't be the nearly 50/50 split against Mayweather, nor would he favorite like Pacquiao would be against guys like Miguel Cotto. The reason is because Pacquiao is a dynamic fighter, I am not talking about his athleticism, I am talking about his style, nobody else fights like him, which makes it a unique experience facing him.

Once again, I find it funny that you guys can criticize other people for saying how great Pacquiao is, which is plainly the truth, but when Marquez is mentioned you guys think he is the greatest mexican fighter ever, or that he should be p4p #1, when he isn't. He's a great fighter, but he isn't as good as Bernard Hopkins, and he definitely isn't as good as Pacquiao, he is in their league, but on a slightly dimmer celestial plane.

well said.

[XaduBoxer]

Delahoya hasnt fought 147 for almost a decade

JMM has won more rounds against Pac in 2 combined fights.

Pacquiao hasn't fought 147 in his entire life...

PAC has knocked down JMM more as against all of JMM's other opponents combined...

.

[XaduBoxer]

link --> Mayweather vs. Marquez: Juan Seriously After Floyd


WBA/WBO lightweight champion Juan Manuel Marquez, and manager/trainer Nacho Berestain have spoken out in the Mexican press about their position on fighting Floyd Mayweather Jr. After Marquez stopped Juan Diaz last Saturday in Texas, he called for a fight with Mayweather, who is technically retired and inactive since December 2007.

Berestain says their pursuit of Mayweather is real and not a ploy to lure Manny Pacquiao into a third fight. They don't deny their desire to fight the Filipino for a third time but they want a fight with Mayweather in September.

One of the main sticking points by Berestain is the weight. He says under no circumstances do they plan to fight Mayweather at the welterweight limit of 147-pounds. Nacho says a twelve-pound advantage is too much for Marquez. They are willing to meet Mayweather at a catch-weight of 143-144-pounds. Most insiders don't expect Mayweather to un-retire for Marquez. Richard Schaefer, CEO for Golden Boy Promotions, who promote Marquez, believes the fight can be made. He already reached out to Mayweather's adviser Al Haymon and their conversations have gone well.

That doesn't mean Floyd will actually return for Marquez.

He wanted a guarantee of $20 million to fight Shane Mosley. Even if he dropped his demand to an area between $10 to 15 million for Marquez, that is still a lot of money to make back and a lot of risk for Golden Boy. Maybe too much risk. Marquez is not a proven ticket seller or pay-per-view star. Mayweather, unless he has De La Hoya/Hatton on the other end, has done an average of 350-400 on pay-per-view. Considering the economic times, it would be very tough to get a million pay-per-view buys.


Yeah, we heard you clearly Nacho, it's not a ploy...
.

[Majesty]

You have ignored the fact that JMM has won more rounds against Pac in 2 combined fights.

I really like your points except this one somewhat.

If winning more rounds is the only thing that makes a fighter better then we should completely ignore the significance of knockdowns.

Marquez may have won more rounds in terms of 10-9s. But he was down 4 times combined in both fights and that can't be thrown out the window.

But you make good points.

[Majesty]

But Mayweather vs JMM.

I think people are shortchanging JMM just a little bit.

Mayweather's style isn't to overpower you like Juan Diaz's style was, and even then, it didnt work.

Mayweather would be trying to box Marquez so it may not be as much of a mismatch as people think it would be.

Marquez has a very good knack for finding out a fighters weakness and exploiting it.

I don't think Mayweather would stop Marquez but I think it would be one sided for Mayweather at first, then the middle rounds back and forth between him and Marquez with Mayweather taking the later rounds.

But Mayweather's style, for his reflexes and speed and everything, isnt exactly a style you come back to 100 percent effectiveness after 2 years off.

It could be a better fight then people think. And Marquez is a smart enough fighter that he wouldn't call out Mayweather if he didnt think he could win