FROCH v TAYLOR - 25/4/09 - ITV1 Sunday replay!

[Fenster]

I''ll be very surprised if Froch gets a decision in Taylor's backyard.

Taylor has a big speed advantage. He'll be bombing eye-catching crowd-whoopers, especially early doors, onto Froch's bonce, which will influence the judges greatly.

Froch has to stop him. I doubt he can do that unless Taylor fades badly.

[ono]

I''ll be very surprised if Froch gets a decision in Taylor's backyard.

Taylor has a big speed advantage. He'll be bombing eye-catching crowd-whoopers, especially early doors, onto Froch's bonce, which will influence the judges greatly.

Froch has to stop him. I doubt he can do that unless Taylor fades badly.

I'm going with the fenster on this one. He's prediction champion for a reason (reason being because i didn't enter )

Anyway i see Taylor starting with a point to prove and outboxing Froch for the first few. Then it will all depend on whether or not Taylor folds when he gets tagged. I'd say Froch has quite a bit more power than Pavlik and clearly has a better chin so the only way for Taylor to win is to stay out of trouble and use his speed and ring smarts for 12 rounds. Should be quite gripping.

[ross]

I'd say Froch has quite a bit more power than Pavlik and clearly has a better chin.

Which heavy handed fighter has proven Carls chin?

The only reason Carl hasnt hit the deck yet is because he hasnt fought any world class fighters yet

Carl couldnt hurt Magee till late, Reid had him down whenever he connected

Pascal was badly hurt in his previous fight but Carl couldnt persuad him to not fight reckless

Im not rating Taylor, just fed up of reading presumptions on Carls part, he hasnt got a proven chin and hasnt got a proven punch all because he hasnt mixed in world class yet and fighting a fading middle weight wont prove his own powers at supermiddle either

[Rantcatrat]

Give Froch credit for coming over to the US to fight Taylor. It is more than a lot of European fighters do and it is more than some do over their whole careers.

For Froch to win Taylor needs to slow down in the later rounds. Fortunately for Froch, Taylor frequently slows down as the fight goes on.

The other thing Froch must hope for is that he can walk through Taylor's punches. He won't know that until after the fight begins. He has an unproven chin. This fight will show what it is made of on the international level. Taylor isn't a Pavlik when it comes to power, but he isn't feather fisted either.

I've read that Froch has an "awkward" style. Can anyone comment on what that means?

[richard (mossley)]

Nice one ITV. Now for avoiding the score. No phone, no internet, no telly until 8.30pm. I will have to climb Scafell it seems.

[ono]

I'd say Froch has quite a bit more power than Pavlik and clearly has a better chin.

Which heavy handed fighter has proven Carls chin?

The only reason Carl hasnt hit the deck yet is because he hasnt fought any world class fighters yet

Carl couldnt hurt Magee till late, Reid had him down whenever he connected

Pascal was badly hurt in his previous fight but Carl couldnt persuad him to not fight reckless

Im not rating Taylor, just fed up of reading presumptions on Carls part, he hasnt got a proven chin and hasnt got a proven punch all because he hasnt mixed in world class yet and fighting a fading middle weight wont prove his own powers at supermiddle either

You don't need to be facing a world class fighter to be put on your arse. It can happen to any fighter at any time.

It's also worth mentioning that Froch actually put Magee to sleep...literally.

He also knocked out Tatevosyan inside 2 rounds....a feat that Lucian Bute couldn't even come close to.

The sheer amount of hard flush shots he took from Pascal is testament to his chin (not to his defence mind). Ok you may argue that Pascal isn't a big puncher but he is a fighter who has a decent KO percentage bordering between light heavyweight and super middleweight....in other words, much heavier company than Pavlik or Taylor has mixed in.

You've sort of answered your own questions really by declaring Taylor as a faded middleweight. If Carl can take flush shot after flush shot from a 168-175lber you can bet your arse he can take them from a 'fading middleweight.'...a feat that Pavlik quite clearly struggled like hell to do.

My point was, Taylor the fading middleweight had Pavlik almost out of there and in turn Pavlik actually managed to get Taylor out of there. That was at 160. P4P Carl might not be as big a puncher as Pavlik but p4p punching power matters very little when you are taking shots from a guy who is naturally at least one weight class heavier than you are.

[ross]

I'd say Froch has quite a bit more power than Pavlik and clearly has a better chin.

Which heavy handed fighter has proven Carls chin?

The only reason Carl hasnt hit the deck yet is because he hasnt fought any world class fighters yet

Carl couldnt hurt Magee till late, Reid had him down whenever he connected

Pascal was badly hurt in his previous fight but Carl couldnt persuad him to not fight reckless

Im not rating Taylor, just fed up of reading presumptions on Carls part, he hasnt got a proven chin and hasnt got a proven punch all because he hasnt mixed in world class yet and fighting a fading middle weight wont prove his own powers at supermiddle either

You don't need to be facing a world class fighter to be put on your arse. It can happen to any fighter at any time.

It's also worth mentioning that Froch actually put Magee to sleep...literally.

He also knocked out Tatevosyan inside 2 rounds....a feat that Lucian Bute couldn't even come close to.

The sheer amount of hard flush shots he took from Pascal is testament to his chin (not to his defence mind). Ok you may argue that Pascal isn't a big puncher but he is a fighter who has a decent KO percentage bordering between light heavyweight and super middleweight....in other words, much heavier company than Pavlik or Taylor has mixed in.

You've sort of answered your own questions really by declaring Taylor as a faded middleweight. If Carl can take flush shot after flush shot from a 168-175lber you can bet your arse he can take them from a 'fading middleweight.'...a feat that Pavlik quite clearly struggled like hell to do.

My point was, Taylor the fading middleweight had Pavlik almost out of there and in turn Pavlik actually managed to get Taylor out of there. That was at 160. P4P Carl might not be as big a puncher as Pavlik but p4p punching power matters very little when you are taking shots from a guy who is naturally at least one weight class heavier than you are.

Catch up!

Im saying Froch hasnt faced any world class super middles as yet so how do we know he can take world class supermiddle power, how do we know his power will be any good on a world class super middle?

After Saturday night we still wont know because it is only a faded middle he is fighting, so by all rights, if Froch is as good as he says he is then he should be able to put away very quickly a middle weight who was knocked out by a middle weight and dropped in his last fight by Lacy, a man who couldnt hurt Manfredo

[OumaFan]

I still am surprised he didn't stop Paschal who got hit a lot and looked pretty chinny up till that fight. I was sure Froch would stop him considering all the talk of his power. Not sure its really there and definitely haven't seen anything to make me think he punches harder than Pavlik, no way.

I don't think Froch's chin has been tested enough to be considered world class or anything but it looks like its at least ok.

Looking at Froch I think this should be a field day for Taylor but I keep coming back to Taylor doesn't have a field day with anyone, nobody. I wouldn't even consider what he did to Lacy as being that dominant and lets face it Lacy just doesn't have anything, for all the shit I've given Froch he's above present day Lacy for sure.

So I don't know, I could see Froch coming on a bit late but something tells me he's not gonna go balls to the wall, I have a feeling Taylor will get his respect early and he'll do enough to win in a close but clear way when really he's talented enough to handle Froch, just doesn't have it mentally. Still I think if he shows what he showed in the second Pavlik fight he should win.

[Rantcatrat]

I''ll be very surprised if Froch gets a decision in Taylor's backyard.

Taylor has a big speed advantage. He'll be bombing eye-catching crowd-whoopers, especially early doors, onto Froch's bonce, which will influence the judges greatly.

Froch has to stop him. I doubt he can do that unless Taylor fades badly.

It isn't really Taylor's backyard - Taylor is from Arkansas and the fight is in Connecticut. As anyone from the US will tell you, there is a big difference between Arkansas and Connecticut; I imagine it is comparable to the difference between Cardiff and London. For example, to the extent Calzaghe would have a hometown advantage versus a foreign fighter in London, Taylor, will have that same advantage (perhaps to a lesser extent because Calzaghe is bigger in Britain than Taylor is in the US), in Connecticut versus Froch. Of course, the crowd will be pro-Taylor (you can count on that from at least one spectator ), but more because of his notoriety than because of a specific allegiance to Taylor.

That said, I agree Froch has to stop him because Taylor will win more rounds due to his advantages in speed. Look at the evidence: besides his second fight with Pavlik, in which Pavlik was the rising superstar and coming off a highlight reel KO, Taylor has never lost a fight on the cards even when the challengers gave good efforts (Hopkins, Spinks etc). In order to win on the cards, Froch needs to show Taylor his power in the early rounds, gain Taylor's respect, much like KP was able to do in Pavlik v. Taylor II, and then hustle and win the last few rounds. Does he have the power to gain Taylor's respect? Maybe.

Personally, I'm not sold yet on Froch's chin and power. For Froch, clearly a chin is essential because his defense is abysmal. He couldn't knock out Pascal. Why should we be convinced of his power? Who has he knocked out that has a reputable chin (that wasn't meant to be rhetorical)? Pavlik's power is widely heralded and proved - he was the first person to knock out both Miranda and Taylor.

Taylor has the advantages in speed, experience, and fight location. The safe pick is Taylor.

Interesting fact: Froch was beat by Denis Inkin in the amateurs.

[Fenster]

I''ll be very surprised if Froch gets a decision in Taylor's backyard.

Taylor has a big speed advantage. He'll be bombing eye-catching crowd-whoopers, especially early doors, onto Froch's bonce, which will influence the judges greatly.

Froch has to stop him. I doubt he can do that unless Taylor fades badly.

It isn't really Taylor's backyard - Taylor is from Arkansas and the fight is in Connecticut. As anyone from the US will tell you, there is a big difference between Arkansas and Connecticut; I imagine it is comparable to the difference between Cardiff and London. For example, to the extent Calzaghe would have a hometown advantage versus a foreign fighter in London, Taylor, will have that same advantage (perhaps to a lesser extent because Calzaghe is bigger in Britain than Taylor is in the US), in Connecticut versus Froch. Of course, the crowd will be pro-Taylor (you can count on that from at least one spectator ), but more because of his notoriety than because of a specific allegiance to Taylor.

That said, I agree Froch has to stop him because Taylor will win more rounds due to his advantages in speed. Look at the evidence: besides his second fight with Pavlik, in which Pavlik was the rising superstar and coming off a highlight reel KO, Taylor has never lost a fight on the cards even when the challengers gave good efforts (Hopkins, Spinks etc). In order to win on the cards, Froch needs to show Taylor his power in the early rounds, gain Taylor's respect, much like KP was able to do in Pavlik v. Taylor II, and then hustle and win the last few rounds. Does he have the power to gain Taylor's respect? Maybe.

Personally, I'm not sold yet on Froch's chin and power. For Froch, clearly a chin is essential because his defense is abysmal. He couldn't knock out Pascal. Why should we be convinced of his power? Who has he knocked out that has a reputable chin (that wasn't meant to be rhetorical)? Pavlik's power is widely heralded and proved - he was the first person to knock out both Miranda and Taylor.

Taylor has the advantages in speed, experience, and fight location. The safe pick is Taylor.

Interesting fact: Froch was beat by Denis Inkin in the amateurs.

You know what I mean.

Wherever the fight was taking place in the UK it would be labled Froch's "backyard." When really only Nottingham is.

[Hunter]

Does any one know if Froch has ever been wobbled or down in a fight?

[Fenster]

Does any one know if Froch has ever been wobbled or down in a fight?

Never down. Ive seen him stopped in his tracks but never looking in the slightest bit wobbly.

[HattonTheHammer]

Does any one know if Froch has ever been wobbled or down in a fight?

Never down. Ive seen him stopped in his tracks but never looking in the slightest bit wobbly.

very good point fenst about it not getting much attention, saying that checking the listings i dont even think its being shown over here at all

Feel bad for frochy as he deserves better than that and will no doubt i`ll somehow find a way to watch the fight sunday morning and cheer him on to what i suspect will indeed be a hard earned points victory!!

Taylor has the power and the reach but carls just too clever a fighter for the likes of jermain.

Froch taking either a 116-112 or a 117-111

[Hunter]

Does any one know if Froch has ever been wobbled or down in a fight?

Never down. Ive seen him stopped in his tracks but never looking in the slightest bit wobbly.

very good point fenst about it not getting much attention, saying that checking the listings i dont even think its being shown over here at all

Feel bad for frochy as he deserves better than that and will no doubt i`ll somehow find a way to watch the fight sunday morning and cheer him on to what i suspect will indeed be a hard earned points victory!!

Taylor has the power and the reach but carls just too clever a fighter for the likes of jermain.

Froch taking either a 116-112 or a 117-111

HMMM...interesting - So that would make Carl more clever than Bernard Hopkins??

There is no way Carl will be too clever for Taylor. Froch's only chance of beating Taylor is to wear him down and beat him up but with Froch's shaky defense and with Taylor seemingly more determined and training harder than ever I dont see it happening.....

[Memphis]

I''ll be very surprised if Froch gets a decision in Taylor's backyard.

Taylor has a big speed advantage. He'll be bombing eye-catching crowd-whoopers, especially early doors, onto Froch's bonce, which will influence the judges greatly.

Froch has to stop him. I doubt he can do that unless Taylor fades badly.

Mate you should enter the prediction comp, you'd be there or there abouts every time