147 Pounds unification tournament - who is the man?

[smashup]

Tell you what ICB im AMAZED at your memory...

How the fuck do you remember all these facts so well?

[ICB]

I think that Pac v Floyd is too close to call really

Not really it isn't IMO i don't see why so many people are now thinking Manny Pacquiao, is a possible Floyd Mayweather Jr beater. Because he beat Ricky Hatton.

He is still the same Manny Pacquiao who had fits against JMM, in there 2nd fight a fight i think he lost. And Floyd Mayweather Jr is a better counter puncher than JMM, he is also faster with a better defense and he is also the bigger man.

Its funny almost no one on this forum thought Manny Pacquiao could even come close to beating Floyd Mayweather Jr last year, now most people think he has a legit chance its funny old game the boxing world.

As for people picking Shane Mosley over Floyd Mayweather Jr, i don't really get why Shane Mosley has always struggled against pure boxers. With a good jab and i haven't been impressed with him for along time.

Yes he beat Antonio Margarito but come on, how good was Antonio Margarito really without the loaded gloves ? i'd say he used it in the Miguel Cotto fight one of the Kermit Cintron fights, and for certain in the Sebastian Lujan fight.

Would he have got anywhere close to a title with his limited skills without cheating ? thats debatable other than that. Shane Mosley didn't look impressive against Ricardo Mayorga. Or against Miguel Cotto even though it was close, Shane Mosley didn't perform that well.

And his win over Luis Collazo has question marks over it, because Shane Mosley was losing until Luis Collazo broke his hand. So im wondering would Shane Mosley have won that easily without that incident ? i don't think so. And his fights against Fernando Vargas wern't that impressive by any means either.

Miguel Cotto and Paul Williams are the only fighters i think can beat Floyd Mayweather Jr, but now Paul Williams is doing his thing at the higher weightclasses. It looks like Miguel Cotto is the only one with a legit chance IMO.

But he isn't at all.

Different animal now and more complete as a fighter

He is though Smash how is he any different to the Manny Pacquiao of 2008 that fought JMM ? the first fight i would agree on yes he was one dimensional and nowhere near what he is now.

But in the 2nd fight he is the same fighter then than he is now, its just that JMM's counter punching style gives him fits. I mean if you would of stuck the 2004 version of Manny Pacquiao in the rematch with JMM.

He would of been beaten by atleast 8 rounds to 4, but because Manny Pacquiao had improved alot by that time. His extra skill sets helped him earn a close decision without needing a 4 point round to earn a draw.

I just don't see how Manny Pacquiao has changed, yes he beat ODLH but ODLH hadn't fought at Welterweight in years and years, and he was weight drained and rubbish and it was the worst performance of his career.

The win against Ricky Hatton does deserve alot of credit, but again i don't see how that win makes him a Floyd Mayweather Jr beater. Ricky Hatton is a come-forward fighter who has little defense and sticks his chin in the air waiting to get hit.

Manny Pacquiao didn't look impressive against MAB in there rematch, because MAB boxed and counter punched. The only problem was that MAB was too cautious and didn't let his hands go enough. But thats because MAB was past his prime obviously, but i still think he done well and made it pretty competitive for 9 rounds.

Also against Oscar Larios who moved up two weightclasses, was also able to have success by moving backwards and trying to box. He even badly stunned Manny Pacquiao in the 3rd round, he was dropped twice but he still gave a good account of himself.

The point im trying to make is yes Manny Pacquiao does look special, against fighters like Ricky Hatton, David Diaz. But styles make fights and he hasn't looked good in the past, against fighters who try and box and counter punch.

And i honestly don't see that beating Ricky Hatton makes him more of legit threat to Floyd Mayweather Jr, he is still the same fighter that had alot of trouble against JMM in 2008. And anything JMM can do Floyd Mayweather Jr can do better.

[smashup]

Not really it isn't IMO i don't see why so many people are now thinking Manny Pacquiao, is a possible Floyd Mayweather Jr beater. Because he beat Ricky Hatton.

He is still the same Manny Pacquiao who had fits against JMM, in there 2nd fight a fight i think he lost. And Floyd Mayweather Jr is a better counter puncher than JMM, he is also faster with a better defense and he is also the bigger man.

Its funny almost no one on this forum thought Manny Pacquiao could even come close to beating Floyd Mayweather Jr last year, now most people think he has a legit chance its funny old game the boxing world.

As for people picking Shane Mosley over Floyd Mayweather Jr, i don't really get why Shane Mosley has always struggled against pure boxers. With a good jab and i haven't been impressed with him for along time.

Yes he beat Antonio Margarito but come on, how good was Antonio Margarito really without the loaded gloves ? i'd say he used it in the Miguel Cotto fight one of the Kermit Cintron fights, and for certain in the Sebastian Lujan fight.

Would he have got anywhere close to a title with his limited skills without cheating ? thats debatable other than that. Shane Mosley didn't look impressive against Ricardo Mayorga. Or against Miguel Cotto even though it was close, Shane Mosley didn't perform that well.

And his win over Luis Collazo has question marks over it, because Shane Mosley was losing until Luis Collazo broke his hand. So im wondering would Shane Mosley have won that easily without that incident ? i don't think so. And his fights against Fernando Vargas wern't that impressive by any means either.

Miguel Cotto and Paul Williams are the only fighters i think can beat Floyd Mayweather Jr, but now Paul Williams is doing his thing at the higher weightclasses. It looks like Miguel Cotto is the only one with a legit chance IMO.

But he isn't at all.

Different animal now and more complete as a fighter

He is though Smash how is he any different to the Manny Pacquiao of 2008 that fought JMM ? the first fight i would agree on yes he was one dimensional and nowhere near what he is now.

But in the 2nd fight he is the same fighter then than he is now, its just that JMM's counter punching style gives him fits. I mean if you would of stuck the 2004 version of Manny Pacquiao in the rematch with JMM.

He would of been beaten by atleast 8 rounds to 4, but because Manny Pacquiao had improved alot by that time. His extra skill sets helped him earn a close decision without needing a 4 point round to earn a draw.

I just don't see how Manny Pacquiao has changed, yes he beat ODLH but ODLH hadn't fought at Welterweight in years and years, and he was weight drained and rubbish and it was the worst performance of his career.

The win against Ricky Hatton does deserve alot of credit, but again i don't see how that win makes him a Floyd Mayweather Jr beater. Ricky Hatton is a come-forward fighter who has little defense and sticks his chin in the air waiting to get hit.

Manny Pacquiao didn't look impressive against MAB in there rematch, because MAB boxed and counter punched. The only problem was that MAB was too cautious and didn't let his hands go enough. But thats because MAB was past his prime obviously, but i still think he done well and made it pretty competitive for 9 rounds.

Also against Oscar Larios who moved up two weightclasses, was also able to have success by moving backwards and trying to box. He even badly stunned Manny Pacquiao in the 3rd round, he was dropped twice but he still gave a good account of himself.

The point im trying to make is yes Manny Pacquiao does look special, against fighters like Ricky Hatton, David Diaz. But styles make fights and he hasn't looked good in the past, against fighters who try and box and counter punch.

And i honestly don't see that beating Ricky Hatton makes him more of legit threat to Floyd Mayweather Jr, he is still the same fighter that had alot of trouble against JMM in 2008. And anything JMM can do Floyd Mayweather Jr can do better.

I'm convinced you have a photogenic memory even more now

I think he's a different animal now because he's fought and beat (Convincingly) bigger fighters which means he's "On One" confidence wise.

Let's not forget that Floyd's been inactive for a year too.

Not saying he'd beat PBF at all as it's too close to call but Manny is def a better fighter.

You learn by your mistakes (Some do some don't) and if you can use that to learn from you'll become better from it and boxing history is littered with fighters who have come back wiser and stronger after a defeat.

Not all do but the wise ones do and Manny/Roach are a clever duo

[ICB]

But he isn't at all.

Different animal now and more complete as a fighter

He is though Smash how is he any different to the Manny Pacquiao of 2008 that fought JMM ? the first fight i would agree on yes he was one dimensional and nowhere near what he is now.

But in the 2nd fight he is the same fighter then than he is now, its just that JMM's counter punching style gives him fits. I mean if you would of stuck the 2004 version of Manny Pacquiao in the rematch with JMM.

He would of been beaten by atleast 8 rounds to 4, but because Manny Pacquiao had improved alot by that time. His extra skill sets helped him earn a close decision without needing a 4 point round to earn a draw.

I just don't see how Manny Pacquiao has changed, yes he beat ODLH but ODLH hadn't fought at Welterweight in years and years, and he was weight drained and rubbish and it was the worst performance of his career.

The win against Ricky Hatton does deserve alot of credit, but again i don't see how that win makes him a Floyd Mayweather Jr beater. Ricky Hatton is a come-forward fighter who has little defense and sticks his chin in the air waiting to get hit.

Manny Pacquiao didn't look impressive against MAB in there rematch, because MAB boxed and counter punched. The only problem was that MAB was too cautious and didn't let his hands go enough. But thats because MAB was past his prime obviously, but i still think he done well and made it pretty competitive for 9 rounds.

Also against Oscar Larios who moved up two weightclasses, was also able to have success by moving backwards and trying to box. He even badly stunned Manny Pacquiao in the 3rd round, he was dropped twice but he still gave a good account of himself.

The point im trying to make is yes Manny Pacquiao does look special, against fighters like Ricky Hatton, David Diaz. But styles make fights and he hasn't looked good in the past, against fighters who try and box and counter punch.

And i honestly don't see that beating Ricky Hatton makes him more of legit threat to Floyd Mayweather Jr, he is still the same fighter that had alot of trouble against JMM in 2008. And anything JMM can do Floyd Mayweather Jr can do better.

I'm convinced you have a photogenic memory even more now

I think he's a different animal now because he's fought and beat (Convincingly) bigger fighters which means he's "On One" confidence wise.

Let's not forget that Floyd's been inactive for a year too.

Not saying he'd beat PBF at all as it's too close to call but Manny is def a better fighter.

You learn by your mistakes (Some do some don't) and if you can use that to learn from you'll become better from it and boxing history is littered with fighters who have come back wiser and stronger after a defeat.

Not all do but the wise ones do and Manny/Roach are a clever duo

Why mate LOL and thats fair enough thats your opinion, i just don't think personally he has changed since he fought JMM in 2008. But the Floyd Mayweather Jr's inactivity worries me a bit aswell. But Floyd Mayweather Jr is a gymrat he's in the gym all year round, so im thinking positive. But i'll tell you what maybe we should have this discussion again, after Floyd Mayweather Jr's fight against Juan Manuel Marquez. Because i think that fight will tell us alot.

[smashup]

But with that type of thinking Manny should smash Floyd to bits No?

I mean he crushed Hatton and Oscar much quicker than Floyd did.....

Are you saying if Floyd beats Marquez then he should beat Manny because he (Manny) lost to Marquez?

[ICB]

But with that type of thinking Manny should smash Floyd to bits No?

I mean he crushed Hatton and Oscar much quicker than Floyd did.....

Are you saying if Floyd beats Marquez then he should beat Manny because he (Manny) lost to Marquez?

But with that type of thinking Manny should smash Floyd to bits No?

As i said we'll have to wait and see, if Floyd Mayweather Jr is showing any ring rust.

I mean he crushed Hatton and Oscar much quicker than Floyd did.....

Floyd Mayweather Jr beat a much better version of ODLH, Manny Pacquiao fought the worse version of ODLH who was weight drained. And Floyd Mayweather Jr is purely a defensive boxer now. Just because he doesn't destroy fighters in 2 rounds or ETC, doesn't mean it isn't impressive that he pretty much shut out Ricky Hatton and KO'ed him in 10 rounds, except for one moment Ricky Hatton had when he knocked Floyd Mayweather Jr off balance with a jab.

Are you saying if Floyd beats Marquez then he should beat Manny because he (Manny) lost to Marquez?

No im not saying that, i think JMM is a bit undersized but i still think it will be competitive enough to tell how much Floyd Mayweather Jr has left. And if he is showing any ring rust. I still think JMM will make Floyd Mayweather Jr go into another gear. Like ODLH did and then Floyd Mayweather Jr just looked leagues above ODLH in the later rounds.

[Fenster]

I think that Pac v Floyd is too close to call really

Not really it isn't IMO i don't see why so many people are now thinking Manny Pacquiao, is a possible Floyd Mayweather Jr beater. Because he beat Ricky Hatton.

He is still the same Manny Pacquiao who had fits against JMM, in there 2nd fight a fight i think he lost. And Floyd Mayweather Jr is a better counter puncher than JMM, he is also faster with a better defense and he is also the bigger man.

Its funny almost no one on this forum thought Manny Pacquiao could even come close to beating Floyd Mayweather Jr last year, now most people think he has a legit chance its funny old game the boxing world.

As for people picking Shane Mosley over Floyd Mayweather Jr, i don't really get why Shane Mosley has always struggled against pure boxers. With a good jab and i haven't been impressed with him for along time.

Yes he beat Antonio Margarito but come on, how good was Antonio Margarito really without the loaded gloves ? i'd say he used it in the Miguel Cotto fight one of the Kermit Cintron fights, and for certain in the Sebastian Lujan fight.

Would he have got anywhere close to a title with his limited skills without cheating ? thats debatable other than that. Shane Mosley didn't look impressive against Ricardo Mayorga. Or against Miguel Cotto even though it was close, Shane Mosley didn't perform that well.

And his win over Luis Collazo has question marks over it, because Shane Mosley was losing until Luis Collazo broke his hand. So im wondering would Shane Mosley have won that easily without that incident ? i don't think so. And his fights against Fernando Vargas wern't that impressive by any means either.

Miguel Cotto and Paul Williams are the only fighters i think can beat Floyd Mayweather Jr, but now Paul Williams is doing his thing at the higher weightclasses. It looks like Miguel Cotto is the only one with a legit chance IMO.

That's because he has looked devastating against Oscar and Hatton. Hardly anyone thought he'd beat those two a year ago either.

That's the way boxing works. So now Pac-Floyd becomes a superfight.

[bzkfn]

So tough. Mosley I'm not at all convinced on. I doubt you would see him and Pac in the same ring, and I saw nothing in the first Cotto fight that makes me think Cotto won't beat him again. I think Floyd would be too quick for him.

As for Manny vs. Floyd, I still think that Floyd is too quick. I watched the Oscar fight again last night and I can't believe just how go Floyd Mayweather really is. That was a much better performance than I remember it being and I think his counter punching would end up being too good for Manny.

Floyd vs. Cotto is a quality fight and I used to believe Cotto was the only man to beat Floyd. I'm not so sure now, but I'll reserve my prediction till the fight is made.

I know its not the fight most want to see, but I think Pacquiao vs. Cotto is the closest fight of all of them. The both have the ability to adapt to the opponent during a fight and they both have their vunerabilities and both have skill in abundance. I think it would make for a cracking fight that would swing both ways. Hope it happens.

[JT Rock]

People forget that Floyd is on a whole other stratosphere. The mentioned fighters have all been shown to have flaws and weakness, where Floyd has ALWAYS showed he has the superior intellect and game plan to go with an outstanding virtuoso Boxing style than shows 0 chinks in its armor.

[BIG H]

People forget that Floyd is on a whole other stratosphere. The mentioned fighters have all been shown to have flaws and weakness, where Floyd has ALWAYS showed he has the superior intellect and game plan to go with an outstanding virtuoso Boxing style than shows 0 chinks in its armor.

Not ALWAYS - he showed 'Chinks' against JLC, albeit a long time ago

[Kirkland Laing]

How do you see these fights going and who would end up the eventual champion?


Cotto v Mosely

Cotto v Mayweather

Mayweather v Mosely

Cotto v Pac

Pac v Mayweather

Pac v Mosely

Cotto v Mosely X

Cotto v Mayweather X

Mayweather X v Mosely

Cotto v Pac X

Pac v Mayweather X

Pac v Mosely X

[ICB]

People forget that Floyd is on a whole other stratosphere. The mentioned fighters have all been shown to have flaws and weakness, where Floyd has ALWAYS showed he has the superior intellect and game plan to go with an outstanding virtuoso Boxing style than shows 0 chinks in its armor.

Not ALWAYS - he showed 'Chinks' against JLC, albeit a long time ago

Thats when he had a shoulder injury quite a bad one aswell. The rematch proved when he is 100 percent he is quite clearly better than JLC.

[DaxxKahn]

My 2 Cents for what it is worth..

Cotto v Mosely--I pick Cotto by SD

Cotto v Mayweather- I go with Floyd by UD, he stays away from Cotto to get banged up

Mayweather v Mosely- If they fought tommorow I pick Shane

Cotto v Pac- Pac unless he gets caught early

Pac v Mayweather- Pac Floyd has yet to meet a man at that pace

Pac v Mosely- Mosley

[ICB]

My 2 Cents for what it is worth..

Cotto v Mosely--I pick Cotto by SD

Cotto v Mayweather- I go with Floyd by UD, he stays away from Cotto to get banged up

Mayweather v Mosely- If they fought tommorow I pick Shane

Cotto v Pac- Pac unless he gets caught early

Pac v Mayweather- Pac Floyd has yet to meet a man at that pace

Pac v Mosely- Mosley

Just thought i'd point out Jesus Chavez threw over 100 punches, in almost every round against Floyd Mayweather and it didn't do much to Floyd Mayweather Jr. Yes i know Manny Pacquiao is obviously better than Jesus Chavez, but i was just saying Floyd Mayweather Jr can deal with that kind of pace, and plus Jesus Chavez was a very good fighter he won plenty of rounds off a prime Erik Morales with one arm.

[DaxxKahn]

My 2 Cents for what it is worth..

Cotto v Mosely--I pick Cotto by SD

Cotto v Mayweather- I go with Floyd by UD, he stays away from Cotto to get banged up

Mayweather v Mosely- If they fought tommorow I pick Shane

Cotto v Pac- Pac unless he gets caught early

Pac v Mayweather- Pac Floyd has yet to meet a man at that pace

Pac v Mosely- Mosley

Just thought i'd point out Jesus Chavez threw over 100 punches, in almost every round against Floyd Mayweather and it didn't do much to Floyd Mayweather Jr. Yes i know Manny Pacquiao is obviously better than Jesus Chavez, but i was just saying Floyd Mayweather Jr can deal with that kind of pace, and plus Jesus Chavez was a very good fighter he won plenty of rounds off a prime Erik Morales with one arm.

Well you answered a lot there, Yes that is true about Chavez but Floyd has slowed a bit he too gets older, Chavez threw a different typ of shot , Manny throws bad intention punches, there are almost non lulls in his attack, he keeps spinning, spinning, spinning making it even hard to counter more then one shot at a time, he pops in and out, and again the fast pace is brutal....

Floyd has not been in a fast paced fight since Judah and that steamed out by round 5,,,it also was no whhere the pace Manny puts out...

Manny will not allow Floyd to just lay on the ropes and counter....Floyd is not an overly hard puncher though he does get guys out of there....

You have valid points but I stick with my picks