Ted Kennedy was a bastard and now he's dead!

[El Kabong]

Yes the Contra's were soooo much more evil than the Sandinista's

How about the time Teddy Kennedy tried to work with the Soviets keep American missle defense systems out of Europe in 1983 at the height of the Cold War? Wasn't that patriotic of him

[RozzySean]

Yes the Contra's were soooo much more evil than the Sandinista's

How about the time Teddy Kennedy tried to work with the Soviets keep American missle defense systems out of Europe in 1983 at the height of the Cold War? Wasn't that patriotic of him

Actually, they were. Did you know that the only things the Sandinistas nationalisted was the personal holding of the Somoza family and his cronies? Fact. Your average personal in Nicaragua was much better off under the Sandinistas. They only reason they lost the election was that they wanted the US funded Civil War to stop, and they knew they old regime was gone for good. Oh, and Ortega was democratically re-elected in 2006. Sit down. You don't know crap about Central American politics.

Turn off Rush and Laura.

[VictorCharlie]

Ouch!!!...Where the hell have you been hiding Rozzy? Haven't seen you in these talks till recently.

[RozzySean]

Ouch!!!...Where the hell have you been hiding Rozzy? Haven't seen you in these talks till recently.

It was a slow summer for boxing, and I was busy as hell, first with my summer job, then getting reading to launch the new student program that I helped develop this spring.

[El Kabong]

Actually, they were. Did you know that the only things the Sandinistas nationalisted was the personal holding of the Somoza family and his cronies? Fact. Your average personal in Nicaragua was much better off under the Sandinistas. They only reason they lost the election was that they wanted the US funded Civil War to stop, and they knew they old regime was gone for good. Oh, and Ortega was democratically re-elected in 2006. Sit down. You don't know crap about Central American politics.

Turn off Rush and Laura.

I know enough about Central American politics to tell you they are all trying to be Che Guavera. And I know enough about American politics to admit we usually support people who help us out and usually those people are ok in the begining and then become corrupted.

Continue to bitch about anyone you want to, alll you can take from this little thread is that Ted Kennedy is dead and Lyle's happy about it. I know Reagan wasn't perfect, but he didn't kill anyone (personally) and he didn't sell out his country.

[killersheep]

Actually, they were. Did you know that the only things the Sandinistas nationalisted was the personal holding of the Somoza family and his cronies? Fact. Your average personal in Nicaragua was much better off under the Sandinistas. They only reason they lost the election was that they wanted the US funded Civil War to stop, and they knew they old regime was gone for good. Oh, and Ortega was democratically re-elected in 2006. Sit down. You don't know crap about Central American politics.

Turn off Rush and Laura.

I know enough about Central American politics to tell you they are all trying to be Che Guavera. And I know enough about American politics to admit we usually support people who help us out and usually those people are ok in the begining and then become corrupted.

Continue to bitch about anyone you want to, alll you can take from this little thread is that Ted Kennedy is dead and Lyle's happy about it. I know Reagan wasn't perfect, but he didn't kill anyone (personally) and he didn't sell out his country.

What does that even mean?

[RozzySean]

Actually, they were. Did you know that the only things the Sandinistas nationalisted was the personal holding of the Somoza family and his cronies? Fact. Your average personal in Nicaragua was much better off under the Sandinistas. They only reason they lost the election was that they wanted the US funded Civil War to stop, and they knew they old regime was gone for good. Oh, and Ortega was democratically re-elected in 2006. Sit down. You don't know crap about Central American politics.

Turn off Rush and Laura.

I know enough about Central American politics to tell you they are all trying to be Che Guavera. And I know enough about American politics to admit we usually support people who help us out and usually those people are ok in the begining and then become corrupted.

Continue to bitch about anyone you want to, alll you can take from this little thread is that Ted Kennedy is dead and Lyle's happy about it. I know Reagan wasn't perfect, but he didn't kill anyone (personally) and he didn't sell out his country.

What does that even mean?

That just shows his complete and utter ignorance about the history of Latin American, Sheep.

[El Kabong]

What does that even mean?

That just shows his complete and utter ignorance about the history of Latin American, Sheep.

It means they are all Socialists which is why the populations they govern will always be poor or dumb or both.

Let's put my accusation to the test shall we?

What national leader of a Central American country was not or is not a Socialist in the style of Che Guavera? Hugo Chavez, I know that's South America rather than Central America, but still, my point still holds water. Daniel Ortega of Nicaragua is a Sandinista. Roberto Michaletti who is trying to retain power in Honduras is no different than any of the other assholes I have mentioned. Costa Rican President and Nobel Prize Winner Oscar Arias is as liberal/socialist as they come. Manuel Esquivel of Belize....liberal. Mauricio Fuenes of El Salvador? He's no different than the rest. And finally Ricardo Martinelli of Panama? He's another lefty....so where exactly am I wrong in my assertion that basically the entirety of Central America is run by Che Guavera wannabes? The leaders are no different, and the outcomes they acheive are rarely any different, they rule over poor ignorant people and the leaders see no need to change that because it keeps them in check. What has socialism done for these people? It's driven the rich away and now they are left with farmers and sweat shops....bravo socialism, man where can I get some of that action .

If you want to run a Central American country you only need a couple things:
1. Bravado...you have to rattle your saber like no other and thumb your nose in America's collective face.

2. Out dated Aviator glasses (I've actually got a pair so when you notice that their National Anthem is officially changed to http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-NshzYK9y0 then you will know I've succeeded in my coup)

3. A snazzy Military cover (a hat for you civilians out there) to protect your bald head OR curly semi-fro'ed out hair.

4. Various speeches (made in soaring yet bellicose tone) about land reform and agriculture and how you are "of the people" and that you empathize with their "struggle vs the capitalist pigs"

5. The ability to manipulate large groups of people, but of course every politician needs that.

But back on topic, I don't like the nepotism of the Kennedy family, I think America is better than that and there are idiot people out there now, who get swept up in the celebrity of a person instead of what electing them means for the people...for example Sarah Palin(or Obama, but to be fair and balanced PALIN), I am not a fan of hers, her daughter might be hot as hell but I wouldn't vote for her just on account of that. I did vote for McCain, but hell I would have voted for him in 2000 as well but didn't get the chance and there is no way on Earth that I would ever vote for Al Gore. I would have rather McCain had chosen a different VP candidate, maybe Charlie Crist or Tim Pawlenty or Richard Burr or JC Watt, but oh well hindsight is 20/20.

I think the problem with the good guys is they get overshaddowed by the egomaniacal, glad handing, you scratch my back I'll scratch your back bastards. And that goes for both sides. Sorry I have to vent like this but NEVER does the left get called out unless they really fuck up and even then it's a crap shoot and maybe in a couple years everyone forgets, like when Sandy Berger tried to sneak classified material out of the National Archives in his pants. And then people just laugh about it instead of sending him to jail or something.

[CFH]

What does that even mean?

That just shows his complete and utter ignorance about the history of Latin American, Sheep.

It means they are all Socialists which is why the populations they govern will always be poor or dumb or both.

Let's put my accusation to the test shall we?

What national leader of a Central American country was not or is not a Socialist in the style of Che Guavera? Hugo Chavez, I know that's South America rather than Central America, but still, my point still holds water. Daniel Ortega of Nicaragua is a Sandinista. Roberto Michaletti who is trying to retain power in Honduras is no different than any of the other assholes I have mentioned. Costa Rican President and Nobel Prize Winner Oscar Arias is as liberal/socialist as they come. Manuel Esquivel of Belize....liberal. Mauricio Fuenes of El Salvador? He's no different than the rest. And finally Ricardo Martinelli of Panama? He's another lefty....so where exactly am I wrong in my assertion that basically the entirety of Central America is run by Che Guavera wannabes? The leaders are no different, and the outcomes they acheive are rarely any different, they rule over poor ignorant people and the leaders see no need to change that because it keeps them in check. What has socialism done for these people? It's driven the rich away and now they are left with farmers and sweat shops....bravo socialism, man where can I get some of that action .

If you want to run a Central American country you only need a couple things:
1. Bravado...you have to rattle your saber like no other and thumb your nose in America's collective face.

2. Out dated Aviator glasses (I've actually got a pair so when you notice that their National Anthem is officially changed to http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-NshzYK9y0 then you will know I've succeeded in my coup)

3. A snazzy Military cover (a hat for you civilians out there) to protect your bald head OR curly semi-fro'ed out hair.

4. Various speeches (made in soaring yet bellicose tone) about land reform and agriculture and how you are "of the people" and that you empathize with their "struggle vs the capitalist pigs"

5. The ability to manipulate large groups of people, but of course every politician needs that.

But back on topic, I don't like the nepotism of the Kennedy family, I think America is better than that and there are idiot people out there now, who get swept up in the celebrity of a person instead of what electing them means for the people...for example Sarah Palin(or Obama, but to be fair and balanced PALIN), I am not a fan of hers, her daughter might be hot as hell but I wouldn't vote for her just on account of that. I did vote for McCain, but hell I would have voted for him in 2000 as well but didn't get the chance and there is no way on Earth that I would ever vote for Al Gore. I would have rather McCain had chosen a different VP candidate, maybe Charlie Crist or Tim Pawlenty or Richard Burr or JC Watt, but oh well hindsight is 20/20.

I think the problem with the good guys is they get overshaddowed by the egomaniacal, glad handing, you scratch my back I'll scratch your back bastards. And that goes for both sides. Sorry I have to vent like this but NEVER does the left get called out unless they really fuck up and even then it's a crap shoot and maybe in a couple years everyone forgets, like when Sandy Berger tried to sneak classified material out of the National Archives in his pants. And then people just laugh about it instead of sending him to jail or something.

You know, I almost went against my policy of not replying to threads like this anymore. I had a fairly long-winded response almost completely typed out, but what's the point of trying discussing things with someone who possesses such profound ignorance of the matters they love to shout about?

[RozzySean]

What does that even mean?

That just shows his complete and utter ignorance about the history of Latin American, Sheep.

It means they are all Socialists which is why the populations they govern will always be poor or dumb or both.

Let's put my accusation to the test shall we?

What national leader of a Central American country was not or is not a Socialist in the style of Che Guavera? Hugo Chavez, I know that's South America rather than Central America, but still, my point still holds water. Daniel Ortega of Nicaragua is a Sandinista. Roberto Michaletti who is trying to retain power in Honduras is no different than any of the other assholes I have mentioned. Costa Rican President and Nobel Prize Winner Oscar Arias is as liberal/socialist as they come. Manuel Esquivel of Belize....liberal. Mauricio Fuenes of El Salvador? He's no different than the rest. And finally Ricardo Martinelli of Panama? He's another lefty....so where exactly am I wrong in my assertion that basically the entirety of Central America is run by Che Guavera wannabes? The leaders are no different, and the outcomes they acheive are rarely any different, they rule over poor ignorant people and the leaders see no need to change that because it keeps them in check. What has socialism done for these people? It's driven the rich away and now they are left with farmers and sweat shops....bravo socialism, man where can I get some of that action .

If you want to run a Central American country you only need a couple things:
1. Bravado...you have to rattle your saber like no other and thumb your nose in America's collective face.

2. Out dated Aviator glasses (I've actually got a pair so when you notice that their National Anthem is officially changed to http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-NshzYK9y0 then you will know I've succeeded in my coup)

3. A snazzy Military cover (a hat for you civilians out there) to protect your bald head OR curly semi-fro'ed out hair.

4. Various speeches (made in soaring yet bellicose tone) about land reform and agriculture and how you are "of the people" and that you empathize with their "struggle vs the capitalist pigs"

5. The ability to manipulate large groups of people, but of course every politician needs that.

But back on topic, I don't like the nepotism of the Kennedy family, I think America is better than that and there are idiot people out there now, who get swept up in the celebrity of a person instead of what electing them means for the people...for example Sarah Palin(or Obama, but to be fair and balanced PALIN), I am not a fan of hers, her daughter might be hot as hell but I wouldn't vote for her just on account of that. I did vote for McCain, but hell I would have voted for him in 2000 as well but didn't get the chance and there is no way on Earth that I would ever vote for Al Gore. I would have rather McCain had chosen a different VP candidate, maybe Charlie Crist or Tim Pawlenty or Richard Burr or JC Watt, but oh well hindsight is 20/20.

I think the problem with the good guys is they get overshaddowed by the egomaniacal, glad handing, you scratch my back I'll scratch your back bastards. And that goes for both sides. Sorry I have to vent like this but NEVER does the left get called out unless they really fuck up and even then it's a crap shoot and maybe in a couple years everyone forgets, like when Sandy Berger tried to sneak classified material out of the National Archives in his pants. And then people just laugh about it instead of sending him to jail or something.

That last paragraph was a great rant, but I don't think it applies any more to the left than the right, at least not much more. Lyle, the fact that you would have voted for McCain in 2000 and support guys like Pawlenty or Crist is a good sign. If you can just get away from the cold war mentality that afflicts so many people, you'll have a better chance of getting your good points across. In the past, you didn't sound like a Rush/Fox news robot, and in this thread, you do, right up until a few lucid points buried in this last post.

Listen, I'm not saying the leftists in Central America are all that great. I know many people who have suffered at their hands and lost family to those revolutions. The problem is that you make blanket statements about leaders being so called Che wannabes, when each country has it's own unique situation, and you don't reallly understand the context. One of the main reasons all theses leftists are in power is a reaction to the oppression of US-backed, right wing regimes.

Because the US supported repressive regimes, people could turn nowhere except Cuba/and/Soviets for aid fund revolution against evil, evil, regimes. So they became a pawn in the Cold War. Now this crap has taken on a life of its own after 50 years of political unrest. Unfortunately, many American leaders don't apply Jeffersonian principles to other nations and people.

If you read or re-read my long post from last week, you will see that I'm offended by many things Kennedy related. Trust me, if Joe Kennedy gets appointed or elected to the Senate, your rage will not be a 10th of mine. It have had plenty of rants of my own against the Kennedy clan.

I only argue with you, Lyle, because I know that we are actually not far apart in our views, but I don't think you help the cause when you come at things like you do from time to time, including this thread. I voted for McCain, but as much as I don't care for Obama, the idea of Palin being president scares me more than anything and I gave McCain a pass on his poor judgement about it. I voted in 2008 for McCain from 2000.

As much as you hate Al Gore, it's amazing in hindsight you would still rather have Bush. I can't quite understand that. Maybe I do. Maybe you, like Rumsfield, Bush, and Cheney, are still stuck in the Cold War mentality and don't recognize it for the folly those policies created. If we could just get you out of that mentality....I'm not a fan of Gore, but seriously, Bush was one of the worst presidents in history. Gore couldn't have been worse. It's impossible.

Four years of Gore followed by a McCain presidency would have been so much better. Obama was a backlash against 8 years of Bush. No Bush, no Obama....things would be so much better. I can't see how you could disagree.