Nobel Prize goes to Obama...

[AdamGB]

You're giving a bunch of cells more rights than a women yet wanting to say they're all equal. BS Bilbo - as usual.


Maybe men should be more responsible when they go out to shag anything that moves...oh wait, that's right, YOU don't get pregnant.

Where we disagree is that I don't regard a developing child as a bunch of cells.

It's not about giving a bunch of cells more rights but rather protecting the rights of the unborn. Once the featus is developing its a human being right now imo and so abortion is morally wrong.

However I don't blame the woman as much as I blame society as a whole.

And I do appreciate what you say about women being the ones who actually deal with the process of pregnancy etc whereas men don't have any real responsibility at all.

It's a tough issue but the rights of the unborn need to be protected. The argument that they are just a bunch of cells only holds any force for the first few weeks at the very most.

Howdy, by saying a foetus can not be terminated - even if the woman wishes it - you are placing the rights of a potential human above that of a real-life walking/talking one.

That's the real issue to all of this though IMO... when do you decide that life is life.

I couldn't answer that question myself tbh... and with the world having so many different beliefs/theories/research etc I can't see people ever agreeing.... not when I'm alive anyway

[Kev]

Where we disagree is that I don't regard a developing child as a bunch of cells.

It's not about giving a bunch of cells more rights but rather protecting the rights of the unborn. Once the featus is developing its a human being right now imo and so abortion is morally wrong.

However I don't blame the woman as much as I blame society as a whole.

And I do appreciate what you say about women being the ones who actually deal with the process of pregnancy etc whereas men don't have any real responsibility at all.

It's a tough issue but the rights of the unborn need to be protected. The argument that they are just a bunch of cells only holds any force for the first few weeks at the very most.

Howdy, by saying a foetus can not be terminated - even if the woman wishes it - you are placing the rights of a potential human above that of a real-life walking/talking one.

That's the real issue to all of this though IMO... when do you decide that life is life.

I couldn't answer that question myself tbh... and with the world having so many different beliefs/theories/research etc I can't see people ever agreeing.... not when I'm alive anyway

That was my point Adam, it really depends on your worldview and your beliefs about where we come from.

If you believe we are created by God then life is sacred and abortion is self evidently wrong, if you believe we evolved then there is no such thing as right or wrong, but only societal norms, and hence abortion is fine,

The two camps will never agree.

@Missy, I don't see how giving a featus human rights elavates it above the woman, it places their rights on a par with them.

A woman couldn't decide to kill any other human because they didn't want them in their live so why should be able to choose to kill of their own child?

Granted other people arn't living and growing inside a women's womb, but they still need protection. The women does have free choice, she has the choice NOT to get pregnant if she doesn't want a child.

They arn't virgin births that are happening here, these women are getting pregnant because of their own actions, and part of life is that we have to accept the consequences of our actions.

But I do understand this is an extremely complicated issue and neither solution is ideal.

I am not against abortion in a legal sense, but I believe that education and support should be geared towards encouraging women, firstsly not to get pregnant if they don't want a child, and secondly that giving birth is given precendence and encouraged at all costs.

But it's an issue that will never really get solved as ultimately it depends on human nature changing, and that won't ever happen.

[Howlin Mad Missy]

If you believe we are created by God then life is sacred and abortion is self evidently wrong, if you believe we evolved then there is no such thing as right or wrong, but only societal norms, and hence abortion is fine,

Does this mean because I don' believe in god I can do as I please?

The two camps will never agree.

@Missy, I don't see how giving a featus human rights elavates it above the woman, it places their rights on a par with them.

Because by saying she can't abort means the foetus's welfare overrides that of the mother. You are taking away her right to abort and replacing it with a foetus's right to life.

A woman couldn't decide to kill any other human because they didn't want them in their live so why should be able to choose to kill of their own child?

Because its not a living breathing thing. There are more premature babies surviving than before but only with massive medical intervention even then it is likley to have health problems because it wasn't fully developed before birth.

Granted other people arn't living and growing inside a women's womb, but they still need protection. The women does have free choice, she has the choice NOT to get pregnant if she doesn't want a child.

The only 100% effective method is to not have sex.

They arn't virgin births that are happening here, these women are getting pregnant because of their own actions, and part of life is that we have to accept the consequences of our actions.

If they're getting pregnant on their own you better start praying.

Good to see you'd force women to have kids they don't want, let's fill up our world with more unwanted. Great.

I am not against abortion in a legal sense, but I believe that education and support should be geared towards encouraging women, firstsly not to get pregnant if they don't want a child, and secondly that giving birth is given precendence and encouraged at all costs.

Education needs to be for both men and women.

I think you want to return to the 1950's and 60's where women were shunned for being bad girls.