Why would anybody get upset by the drawn image of the prophet Mohammad?

[Gandalf]

BBC News - US cartoonist apologises over Facebook Muhammad row

I know this is another thread in the same vein as the flag t-shirts one and the one where the Muslims got angry about some guy who was trying to make a point about free speech, but I thought I would start another one and include a poll.

First off as in intelligent rational human being, I cannot bring myself to follow any kind of organised religion. I think religion has always existed as a means for those who desire power to try and maintain control and influence over the general population. It's interesting that they have continued to wield such influence despite our ability to understand the world around us ever more clearly. In a few hundred years we have gone from thinking the earth was flat and that we were the centre of the universe to realising that we are a miniscule globe in an ever expanding universe. Science has given us so much knowledge, and yet we cling to these peculiar faiths where logic and reason are largely absent. 'Take the leap of faith with me and you will get to heaven'...yeah right. What does this have to do with the prophet Mohammad? Well not too much in a direct sense, but I'm just trying to get across my general perception that organised religion is quite absurd. I don't believe in god and I certainly don't care about fanciful notions of going to heaven. Not that I care too much if others choose to follow a particular faith, that is their choice, but it does bother me when satire and cartoons can be used as the springboard to threaten death upon others.

Now this brings me onto this ongoing controversy about the problems with the drawn image of the prophet Mohammad. It's something that I find difficult to get my head around. Even if I was a Muslim, with my liberal sensibilities, I would find it very hard to get upset by an image of a human being. After all wasn't Mohammad just a messenger who was spreading the word of god? The christians seem much more chilled about this kind of thing. We see images of Jesus everywhere. Admittedly, they are probably not a good likeness with the blue eyes and snow white skin, but people are on the whole quite comfortable with the image. It isn't upsetting anyone nor are christians hacking people down with axes. The Muslims seem so much more more sensitive about things and are seemingly so much more inclined towards violence. There are protests and calls to murder if you draw a cartoon or try and put a face towards this mysterious figure.

Is it only me that finds this completely nuts? I am obviously not a religious man, but I find it downright strange how savage and simple some people can be when you dare to mock their religion or pass comment in a way that they deem unnaceptable. Religion is absurd, but so too is life and I really think that satire and comedy are some of the best ways of coming to terms with things. To get angry and want to hurt others over it is really weak IMO and makes me think very negatively about the intolerance of such a faith.

Thought

I'm an atheist also Miles, but as soon as you start trying to assert superiority because of your own belief system, you're as bad as all those up their own arse religious people who feel so morally superior. It would be much better to actually acknowledge that we have no fucking clue what is really going on with the world (guess what, people 200 years ago had science as well), so might as well just sit back, enjoy the ride. That goes for religious people and atheist who all think they exclusively have 'the answer'.

As it is, religious faith is no indication of a rational and logical mindset. I know many religious people who are far more informed and rational than myself. In fact, they certainly are more rational than almost any of us on here who are determined to see men beaten the shit out of because we dislike what we have seen of them in tv shows, rumoured quotes we believe them to have said or how they're ranked in boxing magazines. Boxing fans are the last people who should claim to have the book on being logical and rational.

My belief system works for me and I find it more logical to say that God does not exist considering that we have no proof of his role in creating man nor the earth. And when we get on to hocus pocus like immaculate conceptions and sons of god, that is where I much prefer the logic and reasoning that science has given us. If I have a medical problem I will go to a western hospital rather an oriental clinic. Why? Because I prefer the treatment backed by research over being told to eat twigs and berries for week. Fair enough that many would prefer the alternatives, but I am quite content in the knowledge that my choices make more sense to me. I don't believe in any organised religion as I find it extremely silly, but I will not force my views on others and will respect those who disagree, just as long as they don't try to force it down my throat.

Getting so offended by the content found in the western media or even individuals wishing to express themselves freely is stupid and a very base reflection of the mindset of some of those following the Muslim faith. If they don't like it then they shouldn't read the western media, they certainly shouldn't be living in free cultures. Nobody is asking to be friends, but the least you can expect is that we shouldn't be trying to phyisically harm each other. I may dislike Amir Khan, but I would never want to beat him with a stick for the silly things he does. See, you can dislike something without having to take it to the next level. Would I want to assasinate Amir Khan? No, because I am quite aware of how I come across regarding Khan. I really don't take it quite that seriously.

[HattonTheHammer]

I hate how americans genuinely come to this realisation that they are the ones with the true free society. They soon come to europe and realise thats of course complete tosh

If you go through the main countrys in europe (britain, france, spain, holland, germany) etc you`ll find that were the most relaxed and care free of all societys and dont take ourselves seriously.

Its why this new found muslim ideaology sweeping our shores is going down like a fat bird at a brothel. We`ll never accept theyre ways of oppresion and if they dont like how we live our lives the obvious answer is that they should just go back to the hell whole they fought like mad to escape from!!

[JazMerkin]

BBC News - US cartoonist apologises over Facebook Muhammad row

I know this is another thread in the same vein as the flag t-shirts one and the one where the Muslims got angry about some guy who was trying to make a point about free speech, but I thought I would start another one and include a poll.

First off as in intelligent rational human being, I cannot bring myself to follow any kind of organised religion. I think religion has always existed as a means for those who desire power to try and maintain control and influence over the general population. It's interesting that they have continued to wield such influence despite our ability to understand the world around us ever more clearly. In a few hundred years we have gone from thinking the earth was flat and that we were the centre of the universe to realising that we are a miniscule globe in an ever expanding universe. Science has given us so much knowledge, and yet we cling to these peculiar faiths where logic and reason are largely absent. 'Take the leap of faith with me and you will get to heaven'...yeah right. What does this have to do with the prophet Mohammad? Well not too much in a direct sense, but I'm just trying to get across my general perception that organised religion is quite absurd. I don't believe in god and I certainly don't care about fanciful notions of going to heaven. Not that I care too much if others choose to follow a particular faith, that is their choice, but it does bother me when satire and cartoons can be used as the springboard to threaten death upon others.

Now this brings me onto this ongoing controversy about the problems with the drawn image of the prophet Mohammad. It's something that I find difficult to get my head around. Even if I was a Muslim, with my liberal sensibilities, I would find it very hard to get upset by an image of a human being. After all wasn't Mohammad just a messenger who was spreading the word of god? The christians seem much more chilled about this kind of thing. We see images of Jesus everywhere. Admittedly, they are probably not a good likeness with the blue eyes and snow white skin, but people are on the whole quite comfortable with the image. It isn't upsetting anyone nor are christians hacking people down with axes. The Muslims seem so much more more sensitive about things and are seemingly so much more inclined towards violence. There are protests and calls to murder if you draw a cartoon or try and put a face towards this mysterious figure.

Is it only me that finds this completely nuts? I am obviously not a religious man, but I find it downright strange how savage and simple some people can be when you dare to mock their religion or pass comment in a way that they deem unnaceptable. Religion is absurd, but so too is life and I really think that satire and comedy are some of the best ways of coming to terms with things. To get angry and want to hurt others over it is really weak IMO and makes me think very negatively about the intolerance of such a faith.

Thought

I'm an atheist also Miles, but as soon as you start trying to assert superiority because of your own belief system, you're as bad as all those up their own arse religious people who feel so morally superior. It would be much better to actually acknowledge that we have no fucking clue what is really going on with the world (guess what, people 200 years ago had science as well), so might as well just sit back, enjoy the ride. That goes for religious people and atheist who all think they exclusively have 'the answer'.

As it is, religious faith is no indication of a rational and logical mindset. I know many religious people who are far more informed and rational than myself. In fact, they certainly are more rational than almost any of us on here who are determined to see men beaten the shit out of because we dislike what we have seen of them in tv shows, rumoured quotes we believe them to have said or how they're ranked in boxing magazines. Boxing fans are the last people who should claim to have the book on being logical and rational.

My belief system works for me and I find it more logical to say that God does not exist considering that we have no proof of his role in creating man nor the earth. And when we get on to hocus pocus like immaculate conceptions and sons of god, that is where I much prefer the logic and reasoning that science has given us. If I have a medical problem I will go to a western hospital rather an oriental clinic. Why? Because I prefer the treatment backed by research over being told to eat twigs and berries for week. Fair enough that many would prefer the alternatives, but I am quite content in the knowledge that my choices make more sense to me. I don't believe in any organised religion as I find it extremely silly, but I will not force my views on others and will respect those who disagree, just as long as they don't try to force it down my throat.

Getting so offended by the content found in the western media or even individuals wishing to express themselves freely is stupid and a very base reflection of the mindset of some of those following the Muslim faith. If they don't like it then they shouldn't read the western media, they certainly shouldn't be living in free cultures. Nobody is asking to be friends, but the least you can expect is that we shouldn't be trying to phyisically harm each other. I may dislike Amir Khan, but I would never want to beat him with a stick for the silly things he does. See, you can dislike something without having to take it to the next level. Would I want to assasinate Amir Khan? No, because I am quite aware of how I come across regarding Khan. I really don't take it quite that seriously.

Fair enough, we probably have almost the exact same belief system, but I think it just comes across as arrogant and hypocritical to treat it as superior to others just because it works for us. It's also not fair to try and posit the argument that those who are religious are thickos or illogical.

People always get offended by others mocking their beliefs. We had a thread up about some Muslim on a forum getting offended by the South Park episode a while back. Well, I've seen Christians, Scientoligists and even Atheists offended by certain episodes. I do agree violence is unacceptable, but I also think doing a real-life version of trolling like that Lars Dick guy does is also unacceptable. If you stood there trying to wind someone up to violence, would you then be surprised and appalled when they hit you? Certainly wouldn't get my sympathy.

[Gandalf]

BBC News - US cartoonist apologises over Facebook Muhammad row

I know this is another thread in the same vein as the flag t-shirts one and the one where the Muslims got angry about some guy who was trying to make a point about free speech, but I thought I would start another one and include a poll.

First off as in intelligent rational human being, I cannot bring myself to follow any kind of organised religion. I think religion has always existed as a means for those who desire power to try and maintain control and influence over the general population. It's interesting that they have continued to wield such influence despite our ability to understand the world around us ever more clearly. In a few hundred years we have gone from thinking the earth was flat and that we were the centre of the universe to realising that we are a miniscule globe in an ever expanding universe. Science has given us so much knowledge, and yet we cling to these peculiar faiths where logic and reason are largely absent. 'Take the leap of faith with me and you will get to heaven'...yeah right. What does this have to do with the prophet Mohammad? Well not too much in a direct sense, but I'm just trying to get across my general perception that organised religion is quite absurd. I don't believe in god and I certainly don't care about fanciful notions of going to heaven. Not that I care too much if others choose to follow a particular faith, that is their choice, but it does bother me when satire and cartoons can be used as the springboard to threaten death upon others.

Now this brings me onto this ongoing controversy about the problems with the drawn image of the prophet Mohammad. It's something that I find difficult to get my head around. Even if I was a Muslim, with my liberal sensibilities, I would find it very hard to get upset by an image of a human being. After all wasn't Mohammad just a messenger who was spreading the word of god? The christians seem much more chilled about this kind of thing. We see images of Jesus everywhere. Admittedly, they are probably not a good likeness with the blue eyes and snow white skin, but people are on the whole quite comfortable with the image. It isn't upsetting anyone nor are christians hacking people down with axes. The Muslims seem so much more more sensitive about things and are seemingly so much more inclined towards violence. There are protests and calls to murder if you draw a cartoon or try and put a face towards this mysterious figure.

Is it only me that finds this completely nuts? I am obviously not a religious man, but I find it downright strange how savage and simple some people can be when you dare to mock their religion or pass comment in a way that they deem unnaceptable. Religion is absurd, but so too is life and I really think that satire and comedy are some of the best ways of coming to terms with things. To get angry and want to hurt others over it is really weak IMO and makes me think very negatively about the intolerance of such a faith.

Thought

I'm an atheist also Miles, but as soon as you start trying to assert superiority because of your own belief system, you're as bad as all those up their own arse religious people who feel so morally superior. It would be much better to actually acknowledge that we have no fucking clue what is really going on with the world (guess what, people 200 years ago had science as well), so might as well just sit back, enjoy the ride. That goes for religious people and atheist who all think they exclusively have 'the answer'.

As it is, religious faith is no indication of a rational and logical mindset. I know many religious people who are far more informed and rational than myself. In fact, they certainly are more rational than almost any of us on here who are determined to see men beaten the shit out of because we dislike what we have seen of them in tv shows, rumoured quotes we believe them to have said or how they're ranked in boxing magazines. Boxing fans are the last people who should claim to have the book on being logical and rational.

My belief system works for me and I find it more logical to say that God does not exist considering that we have no proof of his role in creating man nor the earth. And when we get on to hocus pocus like immaculate conceptions and sons of god, that is where I much prefer the logic and reasoning that science has given us. If I have a medical problem I will go to a western hospital rather an oriental clinic. Why? Because I prefer the treatment backed by research over being told to eat twigs and berries for week. Fair enough that many would prefer the alternatives, but I am quite content in the knowledge that my choices make more sense to me. I don't believe in any organised religion as I find it extremely silly, but I will not force my views on others and will respect those who disagree, just as long as they don't try to force it down my throat.

Getting so offended by the content found in the western media or even individuals wishing to express themselves freely is stupid and a very base reflection of the mindset of some of those following the Muslim faith. If they don't like it then they shouldn't read the western media, they certainly shouldn't be living in free cultures. Nobody is asking to be friends, but the least you can expect is that we shouldn't be trying to phyisically harm each other. I may dislike Amir Khan, but I would never want to beat him with a stick for the silly things he does. See, you can dislike something without having to take it to the next level. Would I want to assasinate Amir Khan? No, because I am quite aware of how I come across regarding Khan. I really don't take it quite that seriously.

Fair enough, we probably have almost the exact same belief system, but I think it just comes across as arrogant and hypocritical to treat it as superior to others just because it works for us. It's also not fair to try and posit the argument that those who are religious are thickos or illogical.

People always get offended by others mocking their beliefs. We had a thread up about some Muslim on a forum getting offended by the South Park episode a while back. Well, I've seen Christians, Scientoligists and even Atheists offended by certain episodes. I do agree violence is unacceptable, but I also think doing a real-life version of trolling like that Lars Dick guy does is also unacceptable. If you stood there trying to wind someone up to violence, would you then be surprised and appalled when they hit you? Certainly wouldn't get my sympathy.

I suppose in my OP I was mainly trying to get across how difficult it is for me to come to terms with any form of organised religion. Admittedly, it probably came across as somewhat condescending. I don't actually see myself as superior, but I do regard them as peaceful beliefs and could never lead to me wanting to impose myself on others nor trying to physically harm anyone. My belief system works for me, and I think a peaceful belief system is preferable to one where people are inclined to break the peaceful conduct of society and start threatening people. It blows my mind that people can be so easily incited to violence by a bit of mocking and that does come across to me as somewhat uncivilised. But not all Muslims are like that and I genuinely believe that some probably don't even see the big deal. There are those in any faith who go over edge in the name of their belief system and give it a bad name.

But for sure, I really am tolerant of anyone following whatever faith they will and don't regard them as stupid. But my opinion is lowered when it leads to Salmon Rushdie having to hide out for years. There is just no need for that kind of carry on. Bilbo is a man that takes his Bible quite seriously and I read with interest when he posts about it. Obviously we don't share the same faith, but that doesn't mean I respect him any less. He is obviously a smart (though rather perverted ) chap and it works for him. On the whole I can't and don't want to knock others for that. We can all co-exist quite peacefully and that's cool.

[Dark Lord Al]

I don't see how being ignorant towards the feelings of those who hold religion dear is any more reasonable though.

Fair enough religion is not important to you but it is to them so why offend them by creating caricatures and drawings in the first place?

Respect should be mutual.

They all respect the none believers I think not actually Bilbo , you live in an idealistic world.
We even have Muslim clerics on the streets of the UK preaching that any none Muslims are INFIDELS .thats mutual respect.

[mattboxingfan]

This seems appropriate.

[ono]

This seems appropriate.

What's this thread got to do with England?

[HattonTheHammer]

does matt now take my title of saddos biggest BNP sympathiser?

[ono]

does matt now take my title of saddos biggest BNP sympathiser?

He's like you but without the wit.

[mattboxingfan]

does matt now take my title of saddos biggest BNP sympathiser?

I could take the title i suppose.........Nick will be pleased with my work mwwaahhh!

[ono]

does matt now take my title of saddos biggest BNP sympathiser?

I could take the title i suppose.........Nick will be pleased with my work mwwaahhh!

Well he's stepping down in 2013. Career opportunity for you

[mattboxingfan]

does matt now take my title of saddos biggest BNP sympathiser?

I could take the title i suppose.........Nick will be pleased with my work mwwaahhh!

Well he's stepping down in 2013. Career opportunity for you

Really? Thats just around the time ill be wanting a job!

[ono]

does matt now take my title of saddos biggest BNP sympathiser?

I could take the title i suppose.........Nick will be pleased with my work mwwaahhh!

Well he's stepping down in 2013. Career opportunity for you

Really? Thats just around the time ill be wanting a job!

It's a match made in Heaven. They're after appointing someone who is more racist than Nick Griffin, but who doesn't have the criminal record or background to back it up. It's no good people taking him as a serious politician only to find out he once was given a caution for beating up a 'Porch Monkey'.

[boozeboxer]

What a surprise more muslim rubbish all they seem to do is cause trouble! EDL!

what is EDL??


I agree. Pretty fucking primitive they can't see a picture of the old boy.

[ono]

What a surprise more muslim rubbish all they seem to do is cause trouble! EDL!

what is EDL??


I agree. Pretty fucking primitive they can't see a picture of the old boy.

The best way to describe the EDL is with pictures



Ironically pissing against the very English and very historical Nottingham castle. Beautifully ironic.











They're like the BNP, but nowhere near as funny.