Naz-vs-Marquez? The greatest duck in history? Fact.

[Violent Demise]

Marquez was offered a career high payday of $400,000 to face Naz in the year 2000. He turned it down claiming he wasn't ready for Naz, even though he spent two years as WBO no.1 mandatory. Naz ruined the unfortunate Augie Sanchez instead.

The question is - where would Marquez be without this duck of Naz? It was clearly a great move. Fact.

Discuss

That right there says it all. Marquez waited and waited for Hamed to fight him. While Hamed begged and begged the WBO to let him fight some one else. After giving him so many passes the WBO was considering stripping him of the title. But Hamed promised he would fight Marquez after he fought Cesar Soto. He wanted to unify the titles first. Hamed beat Soto in one of the worst fights of 1999. Marquez canceled his fight with Roque Cassiani to prepare for Hamed. Than in one of the most skanless, cowardice moves ever in Boxing history Hamed backs out of the fight and in turn faces Vuyani Bungu. Now Bungu was a fine Super Bantamweight. But he had never fought as a Featherweight before. Not to mention he hadn't fought in over a year. Yet some how Hamed deemed him worthy of a title shot. Marquez considered legal action but decided against it. He was done with Hamed and his games. Hamed creamed Bungu while Marquez went on with the Cassiani fight. Afterwards Hamed for like the 10th time again told Marquez he would fight him. Marquez said if he was serious about fighting him give him $500,000. Hamed showed he wasn't serious and said no.

90% of your post is utter drivel.

This little snippet comes from Antonio Curtis, Marquez former matchmaker at Forum Boxing - "When the WBO said they were going to make a unification, I forgot who the hell they were supposed to be fighting. What happened is this, as soon as they told us no, we took another fight. As soon as we took another fight, then they called us when we had already signed for another fight and then they wanted us to fight Hamed, Curtis recalled, of those events. Now, I wanted to pull that fight, to fight Hamed. But Nacho said no. He would've gotten a half-million for the fight and Nacho turned that fight down." http://www.maxboxing.com/kim/kim031607.asp

There you go. Marquez shamelessly ducked Naz. Fact.

A link that leads no where. Just like your post. And I here i though you would actually provide something of substance. I'm disappointed in myself for thinking that. Anyway this is pretty easy standard stuff. The champion must defend against his mandatory within 6 months to a year. Hamed went over 2 years avoiding Marquez. In the mean time he fought an ancient fighter (Wilfredo Vazquez) a seriously out classed fighter (Wayne McCullough) and domestic club fighter (Paul Ingle). That's what you call ducking 101 there

All three much bigger names than Marquez back then. Anyway, i've something even better, straight from the horses mouth Juan Manuel Marquez admitting his duckage of the Naz fella.

Read and weep boy -

Featherweight Marquez said no to Hamed

Juan Manuel Marquez conceded Friday that he turned down a fight with Prince Naseem Hamed, the World Boxing Organization featherweight champion. "I had been waiting two years," said Marquez, speaking through a translator. "Now they want the fight. I wasn't prepared. They did not give me sufficient time to get prepared."

"Hamed is difficult to fight. Hamed is like a wrestler," Marquez said. "He will toss you around if he can. It is almost the same way with fighting (Freddie) Norwood. You have to knock him out to get the victory."

Marquez said he would like to fight Hamed as the champion of one of the other sanctioning bodies. Otherwise, Marquez said, fighting Hamed "is not on even terms."

Nacho Beristain, Marquez's manager, criticized the Hamed camp's negotiating tactics. "They want to get us when all of our energies are gone (from negotiating)," Beristain said. "They are only playing with our heads. We never want to fight (Hamed). Who do they think they are? They came out with an offer of $400,000. It is not worth it."

LAS VEGAS RJ:SPORTS: Featherweight Marquez said no to H...

There you go, you can't argue with the facts, Marquez turned down a career high payday because he didn't feel ready for Naz.

Marquez bottled the Naz fight. Fact.

Thank you. 2 years he waited and waited. But Hamed wanted none. You said it yourself. Can't argue facts. You provided the proof. For 2 years Hamed ducked him. He had no problem fighting chumps like Ingle. A fighter who'd own mother didn't know she had a son named Paul. But looked for every excuse not to fight Marquez

It's like this. Hamed was a good entertaining fighter. Fun to watch. But an ATG he is more certainly not. Facts don’t lie. And facts are Hamed never beat a real good fighter who was in his prime. All the fighters he fought who were a name came in with ridiculous amount of mileage on them. When Hamed fought Barrera. Barrera had already fought 55 times. Cesar Soto 63. Wilfredo Vazquez 59. Kevin Kelley 50. Vuyani Bungu 39. Tom Johnson 48. Manuel Medina 59. The ones that didn’t Paul Ingle and Wayne McCullough were not as good as the previous fighters mentioned. McCullough was average. Ingle was straight garbage.

[Fenster]

Marquez was offered a career high payday of $400,000 to face Naz in the year 2000. He turned it down claiming he wasn't ready for Naz, even though he spent two years as WBO no.1 mandatory. Naz ruined the unfortunate Augie Sanchez instead.

The question is - where would Marquez be without this duck of Naz? It was clearly a great move. Fact.

Discuss

That right there says it all. Marquez waited and waited for Hamed to fight him. While Hamed begged and begged the WBO to let him fight some one else. After giving him so many passes the WBO was considering stripping him of the title. But Hamed promised he would fight Marquez after he fought Cesar Soto. He wanted to unify the titles first. Hamed beat Soto in one of the worst fights of 1999. Marquez canceled his fight with Roque Cassiani to prepare for Hamed. Than in one of the most skanless, cowardice moves ever in Boxing history Hamed backs out of the fight and in turn faces Vuyani Bungu. Now Bungu was a fine Super Bantamweight. But he had never fought as a Featherweight before. Not to mention he hadn't fought in over a year. Yet some how Hamed deemed him worthy of a title shot. Marquez considered legal action but decided against it. He was done with Hamed and his games. Hamed creamed Bungu while Marquez went on with the Cassiani fight. Afterwards Hamed for like the 10th time again told Marquez he would fight him. Marquez said if he was serious about fighting him give him $500,000. Hamed showed he wasn't serious and said no.

90% of your post is utter drivel.

This little snippet comes from Antonio Curtis, Marquez former matchmaker at Forum Boxing - "When the WBO said they were going to make a unification, I forgot who the hell they were supposed to be fighting. What happened is this, as soon as they told us no, we took another fight. As soon as we took another fight, then they called us when we had already signed for another fight and then they wanted us to fight Hamed, Curtis recalled, of those events. Now, I wanted to pull that fight, to fight Hamed. But Nacho said no. He would've gotten a half-million for the fight and Nacho turned that fight down." http://www.maxboxing.com/kim/kim031607.asp

There you go. Marquez shamelessly ducked Naz. Fact.

A link that leads no where. Just like your post. And I here i though you would actually provide something of substance. I'm disappointed in myself for thinking that. Anyway this is pretty easy standard stuff. The champion must defend against his mandatory within 6 months to a year. Hamed went over 2 years avoiding Marquez. In the mean time he fought an ancient fighter (Wilfredo Vazquez) a seriously out classed fighter (Wayne McCullough) and domestic club fighter (Paul Ingle). That's what you call ducking 101 there

All three much bigger names than Marquez back then. Anyway, i've something even better, straight from the horses mouth Juan Manuel Marquez admitting his duckage of the Naz fella.

Read and weep boy -

Featherweight Marquez said no to Hamed

Juan Manuel Marquez conceded Friday that he turned down a fight with Prince Naseem Hamed, the World Boxing Organization featherweight champion. "I had been waiting two years," said Marquez, speaking through a translator. "Now they want the fight. I wasn't prepared. They did not give me sufficient time to get prepared."

"Hamed is difficult to fight. Hamed is like a wrestler," Marquez said. "He will toss you around if he can. It is almost the same way with fighting (Freddie) Norwood. You have to knock him out to get the victory."

Marquez said he would like to fight Hamed as the champion of one of the other sanctioning bodies. Otherwise, Marquez said, fighting Hamed "is not on even terms."

Nacho Beristain, Marquez's manager, criticized the Hamed camp's negotiating tactics. "They want to get us when all of our energies are gone (from negotiating)," Beristain said. "They are only playing with our heads. We never want to fight (Hamed). Who do they think they are? They came out with an offer of $400,000. It is not worth it."

LAS VEGAS RJ:SPORTS: Featherweight Marquez said no to H...

There you go, you can't argue with the facts, Marquez turned down a career high payday because he didn't feel ready for Naz.

Marquez bottled the Naz fight. Fact.

Thank you. 2 years he waited and waited. But Hamed wanted none. You said it yourself. Can't argue facts. You provided the proof. For 2 years Hamed ducked him. He had no problem fighting chumps like Ingle. A fighter who'd own mother didn't know she had a son named Paul. But looked for every excuse not to fight Marquez

It's like this. Hamed was a good entertaining fighter. Fun to watch. But an ATG he is more certainly not. Facts don’t lie. And facts are Hamed never beat a real good fighter who was in his prime. All the fighters he fought who were a name came in with ridiculous amount of mileage on them. When Hamed fought Barrera. Barrera had already fought 55 times. Cesar Soto 63. Wilfredo Vazquez 59. Kevin Kelley 50. Vuyani Bungu 39. Tom Johnson 48. Manuel Medina 59. The ones that didn’t Paul Ingle and Wayne McCullough were not as good as the previous fighters mentioned. McCullough was average. Ingle was straight garbage.

The two year wait just harms Marquez case for the duck. If he spent that long chasing Naz how come he said NO the first opportunity he got? Don't make sense. The truth is Marquez/Beristain never wanted any part of Naz.

Here's a little quiz for you.

What do these guys have in common - Coto, Johnson, Medina, Kelly, McCullough, Bungu and Vazquez? That's right, they had all won "world" titles before Naz bashed them. Even Paul Ingle won the IBF title in his very next fight after losing to Naz.

Marquez had how many world titles back in Naz day? That's right, ZERO!! Marquez didn't become a "world" champion until bascially TWO years AFTER Naz had retired.

Just like Marquez the man himself said - "I want to fight Naz when I have a world title to make it more fair"

Marquez simply wasn't ready for Naz back then. And Naz had bigger fish to fry unifying the featherweight divison.

The duck explained. Fact.

[jolz]

pacs,

yeah, just like pacroido pussied out when marquez humiliated him in his own country! remember?

haha pussied out?

anyways, naz is the topic here not Pacquiao..Quit trolling milmASScasASS...

[Mattyhitman]

Marquez was offered a career high payday of $400,000 to face Naz in the year 2000. He turned it down claiming he wasn't ready for Naz, even though he spent two years as WBO no.1 mandatory. Naz ruined the unfortunate Augie Sanchez instead.

The question is - where would Marquez be without this duck of Naz? It was clearly a great move. Fact.

Discuss

That right there says it all. Marquez waited and waited for Hamed to fight him. While Hamed begged and begged the WBO to let him fight some one else. After giving him so many passes the WBO was considering stripping him of the title. But Hamed promised he would fight Marquez after he fought Cesar Soto. He wanted to unify the titles first. Hamed beat Soto in one of the worst fights of 1999. Marquez canceled his fight with Roque Cassiani to prepare for Hamed. Than in one of the most skanless, cowardice moves ever in Boxing history Hamed backs out of the fight and in turn faces Vuyani Bungu. Now Bungu was a fine Super Bantamweight. But he had never fought as a Featherweight before. Not to mention he hadn't fought in over a year. Yet some how Hamed deemed him worthy of a title shot. Marquez considered legal action but decided against it. He was done with Hamed and his games. Hamed creamed Bungu while Marquez went on with the Cassiani fight. Afterwards Hamed for like the 10th time again told Marquez he would fight him. Marquez said if he was serious about fighting him give him $500,000. Hamed showed he wasn't serious and said no.

90% of your post is utter drivel.

This little snippet comes from Antonio Curtis, Marquez former matchmaker at Forum Boxing - "When the WBO said they were going to make a unification, I forgot who the hell they were supposed to be fighting. What happened is this, as soon as they told us no, we took another fight. As soon as we took another fight, then they called us when we had already signed for another fight and then they wanted us to fight Hamed, Curtis recalled, of those events. Now, I wanted to pull that fight, to fight Hamed. But Nacho said no. He would've gotten a half-million for the fight and Nacho turned that fight down." http://www.maxboxing.com/kim/kim031607.asp

There you go. Marquez shamelessly ducked Naz. Fact.

A link that leads no where. Just like your post. And I here i though you would actually provide something of substance. I'm disappointed in myself for thinking that. Anyway this is pretty easy standard stuff. The champion must defend against his mandatory within 6 months to a year. Hamed went over 2 years avoiding Marquez. In the mean time he fought an ancient fighter (Wilfredo Vazquez) a seriously out classed fighter (Wayne McCullough) and domestic club fighter (Paul Ingle). That's what you call ducking 101 there

All three much bigger names than Marquez back then. Anyway, i've something even better, straight from the horses mouth Juan Manuel Marquez admitting his duckage of the Naz fella.

Read and weep boy -

Featherweight Marquez said no to Hamed

Juan Manuel Marquez conceded Friday that he turned down a fight with Prince Naseem Hamed, the World Boxing Organization featherweight champion. "I had been waiting two years," said Marquez, speaking through a translator. "Now they want the fight. I wasn't prepared. They did not give me sufficient time to get prepared."

"Hamed is difficult to fight. Hamed is like a wrestler," Marquez said. "He will toss you around if he can. It is almost the same way with fighting (Freddie) Norwood. You have to knock him out to get the victory."

Marquez said he would like to fight Hamed as the champion of one of the other sanctioning bodies. Otherwise, Marquez said, fighting Hamed "is not on even terms."

Nacho Beristain, Marquez's manager, criticized the Hamed camp's negotiating tactics. "They want to get us when all of our energies are gone (from negotiating)," Beristain said. "They are only playing with our heads. We never want to fight (Hamed). Who do they think they are? They came out with an offer of $400,000. It is not worth it."

LAS VEGAS RJ:SPORTS: Featherweight Marquez said no to H...

There you go, you can't argue with the facts, Marquez turned down a career high payday because he didn't feel ready for Naz.

Marquez bottled the Naz fight. Fact.

Thank you. 2 years he waited and waited. But Hamed wanted none. You said it yourself. Can't argue facts. You provided the proof. For 2 years Hamed ducked him. He had no problem fighting chumps like Ingle. A fighter who'd own mother didn't know she had a son named Paul. But looked for every excuse not to fight Marquez

It's like this. Hamed was a good entertaining fighter. Fun to watch. But an ATG he is more certainly not. Facts don’t lie. And facts are Hamed never beat a real good fighter who was in his prime. All the fighters he fought who were a name came in with ridiculous amount of mileage on them. When Hamed fought Barrera. Barrera had already fought 55 times. Cesar Soto 63. Wilfredo Vazquez 59. Kevin Kelley 50. Vuyani Bungu 39. Tom Johnson 48. Manuel Medina 59. The ones that didn’t Paul Ingle and Wayne McCullough were not as good as the previous fighters mentioned. McCullough was average. Ingle was straight garbage.

The two year wait just harms Marquez case for the duck. If he spent that long chasing Naz how come he said NO the first opportunity he got? Don't make sense. The truth is Marquez/Beristain never wanted any part of Naz.

Here's a little quiz for you.

What do these guys have in common - Coto, Johnson, Medina, Kelly, McCullough, Bungu and Vazquez? That's right, they had all won "world" titles before Naz bashed them. Even Paul Ingle won the IBF title in his very next fight after losing to Naz.

Marquez had how many world titles back in Naz day? That's right, ZERO!! Marquez didn't become a "world" champion until bascially TWO years AFTER Naz had retired.

Just like Marquez the man himself said - "I want to fight Naz when I have a world title to make it more fair"

Marquez simply wasn't ready for Naz back then. And Naz had bigger fish to fry unifying the featherweight divison.

The duck explained. Fact.

Awesome thread.


Im with you Fenster at the moment, ya putting forward a great case

[ICB]

Marquez was offered a career high payday of $400,000 to face Naz in the year 2000. He turned it down claiming he wasn't ready for Naz, even though he spent two years as WBO no.1 mandatory. Naz ruined the unfortunate Augie Sanchez instead.

The question is - where would Marquez be without this duck of Naz? It was clearly a great move. Fact.

Discuss

That right there says it all. Marquez waited and waited for Hamed to fight him. While Hamed begged and begged the WBO to let him fight some one else. After giving him so many passes the WBO was considering stripping him of the title. But Hamed promised he would fight Marquez after he fought Cesar Soto. He wanted to unify the titles first. Hamed beat Soto in one of the worst fights of 1999. Marquez canceled his fight with Roque Cassiani to prepare for Hamed. Than in one of the most skanless, cowardice moves ever in Boxing history Hamed backs out of the fight and in turn faces Vuyani Bungu. Now Bungu was a fine Super Bantamweight. But he had never fought as a Featherweight before. Not to mention he hadn't fought in over a year. Yet some how Hamed deemed him worthy of a title shot. Marquez considered legal action but decided against it. He was done with Hamed and his games. Hamed creamed Bungu while Marquez went on with the Cassiani fight. Afterwards Hamed for like the 10th time again told Marquez he would fight him. Marquez said if he was serious about fighting him give him $500,000. Hamed showed he wasn't serious and said no.

90% of your post is utter drivel.

This little snippet comes from Antonio Curtis, Marquez former matchmaker at Forum Boxing - "When the WBO said they were going to make a unification, I forgot who the hell they were supposed to be fighting. What happened is this, as soon as they told us no, we took another fight. As soon as we took another fight, then they called us when we had already signed for another fight and then they wanted us to fight Hamed, Curtis recalled, of those events. Now, I wanted to pull that fight, to fight Hamed. But Nacho said no. He would've gotten a half-million for the fight and Nacho turned that fight down." http://www.maxboxing.com/kim/kim031607.asp

There you go. Marquez shamelessly ducked Naz. Fact.

A link that leads no where. Just like your post. And I here i though you would actually provide something of substance. I'm disappointed in myself for thinking that. Anyway this is pretty easy standard stuff. The champion must defend against his mandatory within 6 months to a year. Hamed went over 2 years avoiding Marquez. In the mean time he fought an ancient fighter (Wilfredo Vazquez) a seriously out classed fighter (Wayne McCullough) and domestic club fighter (Paul Ingle). That's what you call ducking 101 there

All three much bigger names than Marquez back then. Anyway, i've something even better, straight from the horses mouth Juan Manuel Marquez admitting his duckage of the Naz fella.

Read and weep boy -

Featherweight Marquez said no to Hamed

Juan Manuel Marquez conceded Friday that he turned down a fight with Prince Naseem Hamed, the World Boxing Organization featherweight champion. "I had been waiting two years," said Marquez, speaking through a translator. "Now they want the fight. I wasn't prepared. They did not give me sufficient time to get prepared."

"Hamed is difficult to fight. Hamed is like a wrestler," Marquez said. "He will toss you around if he can. It is almost the same way with fighting (Freddie) Norwood. You have to knock him out to get the victory."

Marquez said he would like to fight Hamed as the champion of one of the other sanctioning bodies. Otherwise, Marquez said, fighting Hamed "is not on even terms."

Nacho Beristain, Marquez's manager, criticized the Hamed camp's negotiating tactics. "They want to get us when all of our energies are gone (from negotiating)," Beristain said. "They are only playing with our heads. We never want to fight (Hamed). Who do they think they are? They came out with an offer of $400,000. It is not worth it."

LAS VEGAS RJ:SPORTS: Featherweight Marquez said no to H...

There you go, you can't argue with the facts, Marquez turned down a career high payday because he didn't feel ready for Naz.

Marquez bottled the Naz fight. Fact.

Thank you. 2 years he waited and waited. But Hamed wanted none. You said it yourself. Can't argue facts. You provided the proof. For 2 years Hamed ducked him. He had no problem fighting chumps like Ingle. A fighter who'd own mother didn't know she had a son named Paul. But looked for every excuse not to fight Marquez

It's like this. Hamed was a good entertaining fighter. Fun to watch. But an ATG he is more certainly not. Facts don’t lie. And facts are Hamed never beat a real good fighter who was in his prime. All the fighters he fought who were a name came in with ridiculous amount of mileage on them. When Hamed fought Barrera. Barrera had already fought 55 times. Cesar Soto 63. Wilfredo Vazquez 59. Kevin Kelley 50. Vuyani Bungu 39. Tom Johnson 48. Manuel Medina 59. The ones that didn’t Paul Ingle and Wayne McCullough were not as good as the previous fighters mentioned. McCullough was average. Ingle was straight garbage.

The two year wait just harms Marquez case for the duck. If he spent that long chasing Naz how come he said NO the first opportunity he got? Don't make sense. The truth is Marquez/Beristain never wanted any part of Naz.

Here's a little quiz for you.

What do these guys have in common - Coto, Johnson, Medina, Kelly, McCullough, Bungu and Vazquez? That's right, they had all won "world" titles before Naz bashed them. Even Paul Ingle won the IBF title in his very next fight after losing to Naz.

Marquez had how many world titles back in Naz day? That's right, ZERO!! Marquez didn't become a "world" champion until bascially TWO years AFTER Naz had retired.

Just like Marquez the man himself said - "I want to fight Naz when I have a world title to make it more fair"

Marquez simply wasn't ready for Naz back then. And Naz had bigger fish to fry unifying the featherweight divison.

The duck explained. Fact.

I haven't ever seen Manuel Medina vs Paul Ingle, that sounded like a cracking fight. 4 knockdowns with Paul Ingle going down in the last round, Paul Ingle was one of my favorites when i was young.

I still remember him beating Junior Jones, i remember how proud i was of him that night. Because i'd heard of Junior Jones reputation. Obviously i wasn't as clued up then, because i was very young.

I know now that Junior Jones was on his last legs and was ready to be taken, but still Paul Ingle had to get up from a terrific right hand from Junior Jones, the same type of right hand that layed out MAB.

And he recovered quickly and stopped Junior Jones shortly after, and the last thing to go is your power. It was such a shame what happened to Paul Ingle, i remember i was really cut up about it i hope he's doing well now.

[Master]

JMM was ducked, so he was give one opportunity in 2 years at short notice and low pay does not mean he avoided the fight because he was probably expected to say no under those conditions.

Low pay? That offer was probably 10X his biggest previous payday. He was a chump change fighter. HBO didn't want to know him.

Short notice? He fought a week later against Daniel Jimenez (probably for 100 bucks and a crate of sols).

He needed more time to fight Naz, to prepare.

[Violent Demise]

Marquez was offered a career high payday of $400,000 to face Naz in the year 2000. He turned it down claiming he wasn't ready for Naz, even though he spent two years as WBO no.1 mandatory. Naz ruined the unfortunate Augie Sanchez instead.

The question is - where would Marquez be without this duck of Naz? It was clearly a great move. Fact.

Discuss

That right there says it all. Marquez waited and waited for Hamed to fight him. While Hamed begged and begged the WBO to let him fight some one else. After giving him so many passes the WBO was considering stripping him of the title. But Hamed promised he would fight Marquez after he fought Cesar Soto. He wanted to unify the titles first. Hamed beat Soto in one of the worst fights of 1999. Marquez canceled his fight with Roque Cassiani to prepare for Hamed. Than in one of the most skanless, cowardice moves ever in Boxing history Hamed backs out of the fight and in turn faces Vuyani Bungu. Now Bungu was a fine Super Bantamweight. But he had never fought as a Featherweight before. Not to mention he hadn't fought in over a year. Yet some how Hamed deemed him worthy of a title shot. Marquez considered legal action but decided against it. He was done with Hamed and his games. Hamed creamed Bungu while Marquez went on with the Cassiani fight. Afterwards Hamed for like the 10th time again told Marquez he would fight him. Marquez said if he was serious about fighting him give him $500,000. Hamed showed he wasn't serious and said no.

90% of your post is utter drivel.

This little snippet comes from Antonio Curtis, Marquez former matchmaker at Forum Boxing - "When the WBO said they were going to make a unification, I forgot who the hell they were supposed to be fighting. What happened is this, as soon as they told us no, we took another fight. As soon as we took another fight, then they called us when we had already signed for another fight and then they wanted us to fight Hamed, Curtis recalled, of those events. Now, I wanted to pull that fight, to fight Hamed. But Nacho said no. He would've gotten a half-million for the fight and Nacho turned that fight down." http://www.maxboxing.com/kim/kim031607.asp

There you go. Marquez shamelessly ducked Naz. Fact.

A link that leads no where. Just like your post. And I here i though you would actually provide something of substance. I'm disappointed in myself for thinking that. Anyway this is pretty easy standard stuff. The champion must defend against his mandatory within 6 months to a year. Hamed went over 2 years avoiding Marquez. In the mean time he fought an ancient fighter (Wilfredo Vazquez) a seriously out classed fighter (Wayne McCullough) and domestic club fighter (Paul Ingle). That's what you call ducking 101 there

All three much bigger names than Marquez back then. Anyway, i've something even better, straight from the horses mouth Juan Manuel Marquez admitting his duckage of the Naz fella.

Read and weep boy -

Featherweight Marquez said no to Hamed

Juan Manuel Marquez conceded Friday that he turned down a fight with Prince Naseem Hamed, the World Boxing Organization featherweight champion. "I had been waiting two years," said Marquez, speaking through a translator. "Now they want the fight. I wasn't prepared. They did not give me sufficient time to get prepared."

"Hamed is difficult to fight. Hamed is like a wrestler," Marquez said. "He will toss you around if he can. It is almost the same way with fighting (Freddie) Norwood. You have to knock him out to get the victory."

Marquez said he would like to fight Hamed as the champion of one of the other sanctioning bodies. Otherwise, Marquez said, fighting Hamed "is not on even terms."

Nacho Beristain, Marquez's manager, criticized the Hamed camp's negotiating tactics. "They want to get us when all of our energies are gone (from negotiating)," Beristain said. "They are only playing with our heads. We never want to fight (Hamed). Who do they think they are? They came out with an offer of $400,000. It is not worth it."

LAS VEGAS RJ:SPORTS: Featherweight Marquez said no to H...

There you go, you can't argue with the facts, Marquez turned down a career high payday because he didn't feel ready for Naz.

Marquez bottled the Naz fight. Fact.

Thank you. 2 years he waited and waited. But Hamed wanted none. You said it yourself. Can't argue facts. You provided the proof. For 2 years Hamed ducked him. He had no problem fighting chumps like Ingle. A fighter who'd own mother didn't know she had a son named Paul. But looked for every excuse not to fight Marquez

It's like this. Hamed was a good entertaining fighter. Fun to watch. But an ATG he is more certainly not. Facts don’t lie. And facts are Hamed never beat a real good fighter who was in his prime. All the fighters he fought who were a name came in with ridiculous amount of mileage on them. When Hamed fought Barrera. Barrera had already fought 55 times. Cesar Soto 63. Wilfredo Vazquez 59. Kevin Kelley 50. Vuyani Bungu 39. Tom Johnson 48. Manuel Medina 59. The ones that didn’t Paul Ingle and Wayne McCullough were not as good as the previous fighters mentioned. McCullough was average. Ingle was straight garbage.

The two year wait just harms Marquez case for the duck. If he spent that long chasing Naz how come he said NO the first opportunity he got? Don't make sense. The truth is Marquez/Beristain never wanted any part of Naz.

Here's a little quiz for you.

What do these guys have in common - Coto, Johnson, Medina, Kelly, McCullough, Bungu and Vazquez? That's right, they had all won "world" titles before Naz bashed them. Even Paul Ingle won the IBF title in his very next fight after losing to Naz.

Marquez had how many world titles back in Naz day? That's right, ZERO!! Marquez didn't become a "world" champion until bascially TWO years AFTER Naz had retired.

Just like Marquez the man himself said - "I want to fight Naz when I have a world title to make it more fair"

Marquez simply wasn't ready for Naz back then. And Naz had bigger fish to fry unifying the featherweight divison.

The duck explained. Fact.

What big fish? Cesar Soto? Come on now. Hamed didn't care about unifiying. But trying to unify was the only excuse he had left that the WBO was going to buy. They were set to strip him for his shameful ducking of Marquez. That's a fact. Hamed backed himself into a unification bout when he used it as an excuse. Why you think he never went after the other 2 titles?

It wasn't only Marquez either. Hamed ducked just about every fighter capable of beating him. Check it. I'm about to give you privileged information that people have gone great lengths to keep under wraps. Consider yourself lucky that I'm even telling you. You don't really deserve it. But I like to deal in facts. And these are stone cold facts regarding Hamed's retirement. After being embarrassed by a past his prime Barrera, Hamed went back to his locker room and openly discussed his future with his team. Despite all his arrogance and brash talk Hamed was really a very insecure fighter. He had a lot of self doubt. But beating the right type of hand picked opponents and a bunch of yes men and Hamed was able to fool himself into thinking he was everything he said he was. The Barrera loss destroyed his whole charade. His whole manufactured rep that he so carefully build was crumpling. Being seen as a fraud was not something he could live with. What now? If he couldn't beat a declining Barrera than who could he beat? HBO wasn't going to allow him to fight scrubs like Paul Ingle any more. They wanted him against the top dogs. Who else was out there? Erik Morales? Fuck no. Never Hamed said. Juan Manuel Marquez? He ducked him for 2 years for a reason. With those 2 and Barrera at Featherweight Hamed knew he would never be King at 126 again. How about moving up? Who runs things at 130? Who the big names? Floyd Mayweather Jr, Joel Casamayor, Diego Corrales and Acelino Freitas were the title holders he was told. Reality was brutal to Hamed. He knew he stood no chance against either of them title holders. Having no desire to be embarrassed again he elected to retire. He didn't want to end things with a loss. So he took one last fight against a D level fighter and left. He knew he would take hits for leaving the way he did. So many things that could still be done would never be. But he felt it was better to leave with an incomplete career than to continue on and endure more embarrassment and in the process rack up the losses. Smart move

[Master]

Ingle was a respectable fighter, he beat Jones and he gave Hamed hell in the latter rounds. Hamed was certainly slipping by the time he lost to MAB, he had tasted the canvas a number of time before that loss and not against good fighter either.

[Violent Demise]

Ingle was a respectable fighter, he beat Jones and he gave Hamed hell in the latter rounds. Hamed was certainly slipping by the time he lost to MAB, he had tasted the canvas a number of time before that loss and not against good fighter either.

Ingle was passable. Lets leave it at that. He beat Manuel Medina who came in with 10 losses and had seen better days. Ingle still barely hung on for the win. Junior Jones was already done by the time Ingle fought him. Even the bias as fuck UK announcers acknowledge that. The first prime opponent he faced the very good Mbulelo Botile damn near kills him and ends his career. Says it all for me

[ono]

Marquez was offered a career high payday of $400,000 to face Naz in the year 2000. He turned it down claiming he wasn't ready for Naz, even though he spent two years as WBO no.1 mandatory. Naz ruined the unfortunate Augie Sanchez instead.

The question is - where would Marquez be without this duck of Naz? It was clearly a great move. Fact.

Discuss

That right there says it all. Marquez waited and waited for Hamed to fight him. While Hamed begged and begged the WBO to let him fight some one else. After giving him so many passes the WBO was considering stripping him of the title. But Hamed promised he would fight Marquez after he fought Cesar Soto. He wanted to unify the titles first. Hamed beat Soto in one of the worst fights of 1999. Marquez canceled his fight with Roque Cassiani to prepare for Hamed. Than in one of the most skanless, cowardice moves ever in Boxing history Hamed backs out of the fight and in turn faces Vuyani Bungu. Now Bungu was a fine Super Bantamweight. But he had never fought as a Featherweight before. Not to mention he hadn't fought in over a year. Yet some how Hamed deemed him worthy of a title shot. Marquez considered legal action but decided against it. He was done with Hamed and his games. Hamed creamed Bungu while Marquez went on with the Cassiani fight. Afterwards Hamed for like the 10th time again told Marquez he would fight him. Marquez said if he was serious about fighting him give him $500,000. Hamed showed he wasn't serious and said no.

90% of your post is utter drivel.

This little snippet comes from Antonio Curtis, Marquez former matchmaker at Forum Boxing - "When the WBO said they were going to make a unification, I forgot who the hell they were supposed to be fighting. What happened is this, as soon as they told us no, we took another fight. As soon as we took another fight, then they called us when we had already signed for another fight and then they wanted us to fight Hamed, Curtis recalled, of those events. Now, I wanted to pull that fight, to fight Hamed. But Nacho said no. He would've gotten a half-million for the fight and Nacho turned that fight down." http://www.maxboxing.com/kim/kim031607.asp

There you go. Marquez shamelessly ducked Naz. Fact.

A link that leads no where. Just like your post. And I here i though you would actually provide something of substance. I'm disappointed in myself for thinking that. Anyway this is pretty easy standard stuff. The champion must defend against his mandatory within 6 months to a year. Hamed went over 2 years avoiding Marquez. In the mean time he fought an ancient fighter (Wilfredo Vazquez) a seriously out classed fighter (Wayne McCullough) and domestic club fighter (Paul Ingle). That's what you call ducking 101 there

All three much bigger names than Marquez back then. Anyway, i've something even better, straight from the horses mouth Juan Manuel Marquez admitting his duckage of the Naz fella.

Read and weep boy -

Featherweight Marquez said no to Hamed

Juan Manuel Marquez conceded Friday that he turned down a fight with Prince Naseem Hamed, the World Boxing Organization featherweight champion. "I had been waiting two years," said Marquez, speaking through a translator. "Now they want the fight. I wasn't prepared. They did not give me sufficient time to get prepared."

"Hamed is difficult to fight. Hamed is like a wrestler," Marquez said. "He will toss you around if he can. It is almost the same way with fighting (Freddie) Norwood. You have to knock him out to get the victory."

Marquez said he would like to fight Hamed as the champion of one of the other sanctioning bodies. Otherwise, Marquez said, fighting Hamed "is not on even terms."

Nacho Beristain, Marquez's manager, criticized the Hamed camp's negotiating tactics. "They want to get us when all of our energies are gone (from negotiating)," Beristain said. "They are only playing with our heads. We never want to fight (Hamed). Who do they think they are? They came out with an offer of $400,000. It is not worth it."

LAS VEGAS RJ:SPORTS: Featherweight Marquez said no to H...

There you go, you can't argue with the facts, Marquez turned down a career high payday because he didn't feel ready for Naz.

Marquez bottled the Naz fight. Fact.

Thank you. 2 years he waited and waited. But Hamed wanted none. You said it yourself. Can't argue facts. You provided the proof. For 2 years Hamed ducked him. He had no problem fighting chumps like Ingle. A fighter who'd own mother didn't know she had a son named Paul. But looked for every excuse not to fight Marquez

It's like this. Hamed was a good entertaining fighter. Fun to watch. But an ATG he is more certainly not. Facts don’t lie. And facts are Hamed never beat a real good fighter who was in his prime. All the fighters he fought who were a name came in with ridiculous amount of mileage on them. When Hamed fought Barrera. Barrera had already fought 55 times. Cesar Soto 63. Wilfredo Vazquez 59. Kevin Kelley 50. Vuyani Bungu 39. Tom Johnson 48. Manuel Medina 59. The ones that didn’t Paul Ingle and Wayne McCullough were not as good as the previous fighters mentioned. McCullough was average. Ingle was straight garbage.

The two year wait just harms Marquez case for the duck. If he spent that long chasing Naz how come he said NO the first opportunity he got? Don't make sense. The truth is Marquez/Beristain never wanted any part of Naz.

Here's a little quiz for you.

What do these guys have in common - Coto, Johnson, Medina, Kelly, McCullough, Bungu and Vazquez? That's right, they had all won "world" titles before Naz bashed them. Even Paul Ingle won the IBF title in his very next fight after losing to Naz.

Marquez had how many world titles back in Naz day? That's right, ZERO!! Marquez didn't become a "world" champion until bascially TWO years AFTER Naz had retired.

Just like Marquez the man himself said - "I want to fight Naz when I have a world title to make it more fair"

Marquez simply wasn't ready for Naz back then. And Naz had bigger fish to fry unifying the featherweight divison.

The duck explained. Fact.

I haven't ever seen Manuel Medina vs Paul Ingle, that sounded like a cracking fight. 4 knockdowns with Paul Ingle going down in the last round, Paul Ingle was one of my favorites when i was young.

I still remember him beating Junior Jones, i remember how proud i was of him that night. Because i'd heard of Junior Jones reputation. Obviously i wasn't as clued up then, because i was very young.

I know now that Junior Jones was on his last legs and was ready to be taken, but still Paul Ingle had to get up from a terrific right hand from Junior Jones, the same type of right hand that layed out MAB.

And he recovered quickly and stopped Junior Jones shortly after, and the last thing to go is your power. It was such a shame what happened to Paul Ingle, i remember i was really cut up about it i hope he's doing well now.

You were proud of someone when you were about 8?

[Fenster]

Marquez was offered a career high payday of $400,000 to face Naz in the year 2000. He turned it down claiming he wasn't ready for Naz, even though he spent two years as WBO no.1 mandatory. Naz ruined the unfortunate Augie Sanchez instead.

The question is - where would Marquez be without this duck of Naz? It was clearly a great move. Fact.

Discuss

That right there says it all. Marquez waited and waited for Hamed to fight him. While Hamed begged and begged the WBO to let him fight some one else. After giving him so many passes the WBO was considering stripping him of the title. But Hamed promised he would fight Marquez after he fought Cesar Soto. He wanted to unify the titles first. Hamed beat Soto in one of the worst fights of 1999. Marquez canceled his fight with Roque Cassiani to prepare for Hamed. Than in one of the most skanless, cowardice moves ever in Boxing history Hamed backs out of the fight and in turn faces Vuyani Bungu. Now Bungu was a fine Super Bantamweight. But he had never fought as a Featherweight before. Not to mention he hadn't fought in over a year. Yet some how Hamed deemed him worthy of a title shot. Marquez considered legal action but decided against it. He was done with Hamed and his games. Hamed creamed Bungu while Marquez went on with the Cassiani fight. Afterwards Hamed for like the 10th time again told Marquez he would fight him. Marquez said if he was serious about fighting him give him $500,000. Hamed showed he wasn't serious and said no.

90% of your post is utter drivel.

This little snippet comes from Antonio Curtis, Marquez former matchmaker at Forum Boxing - "When the WBO said they were going to make a unification, I forgot who the hell they were supposed to be fighting. What happened is this, as soon as they told us no, we took another fight. As soon as we took another fight, then they called us when we had already signed for another fight and then they wanted us to fight Hamed, Curtis recalled, of those events. Now, I wanted to pull that fight, to fight Hamed. But Nacho said no. He would've gotten a half-million for the fight and Nacho turned that fight down." http://www.maxboxing.com/kim/kim031607.asp

There you go. Marquez shamelessly ducked Naz. Fact.

A link that leads no where. Just like your post. And I here i though you would actually provide something of substance. I'm disappointed in myself for thinking that. Anyway this is pretty easy standard stuff. The champion must defend against his mandatory within 6 months to a year. Hamed went over 2 years avoiding Marquez. In the mean time he fought an ancient fighter (Wilfredo Vazquez) a seriously out classed fighter (Wayne McCullough) and domestic club fighter (Paul Ingle). That's what you call ducking 101 there

All three much bigger names than Marquez back then. Anyway, i've something even better, straight from the horses mouth Juan Manuel Marquez admitting his duckage of the Naz fella.

Read and weep boy -

Featherweight Marquez said no to Hamed

Juan Manuel Marquez conceded Friday that he turned down a fight with Prince Naseem Hamed, the World Boxing Organization featherweight champion. "I had been waiting two years," said Marquez, speaking through a translator. "Now they want the fight. I wasn't prepared. They did not give me sufficient time to get prepared."

"Hamed is difficult to fight. Hamed is like a wrestler," Marquez said. "He will toss you around if he can. It is almost the same way with fighting (Freddie) Norwood. You have to knock him out to get the victory."

Marquez said he would like to fight Hamed as the champion of one of the other sanctioning bodies. Otherwise, Marquez said, fighting Hamed "is not on even terms."

Nacho Beristain, Marquez's manager, criticized the Hamed camp's negotiating tactics. "They want to get us when all of our energies are gone (from negotiating)," Beristain said. "They are only playing with our heads. We never want to fight (Hamed). Who do they think they are? They came out with an offer of $400,000. It is not worth it."

LAS VEGAS RJ:SPORTS: Featherweight Marquez said no to H...

There you go, you can't argue with the facts, Marquez turned down a career high payday because he didn't feel ready for Naz.

Marquez bottled the Naz fight. Fact.

Thank you. 2 years he waited and waited. But Hamed wanted none. You said it yourself. Can't argue facts. You provided the proof. For 2 years Hamed ducked him. He had no problem fighting chumps like Ingle. A fighter who'd own mother didn't know she had a son named Paul. But looked for every excuse not to fight Marquez

It's like this. Hamed was a good entertaining fighter. Fun to watch. But an ATG he is more certainly not. Facts don’t lie. And facts are Hamed never beat a real good fighter who was in his prime. All the fighters he fought who were a name came in with ridiculous amount of mileage on them. When Hamed fought Barrera. Barrera had already fought 55 times. Cesar Soto 63. Wilfredo Vazquez 59. Kevin Kelley 50. Vuyani Bungu 39. Tom Johnson 48. Manuel Medina 59. The ones that didn’t Paul Ingle and Wayne McCullough were not as good as the previous fighters mentioned. McCullough was average. Ingle was straight garbage.

The two year wait just harms Marquez case for the duck. If he spent that long chasing Naz how come he said NO the first opportunity he got? Don't make sense. The truth is Marquez/Beristain never wanted any part of Naz.

Here's a little quiz for you.

What do these guys have in common - Coto, Johnson, Medina, Kelly, McCullough, Bungu and Vazquez? That's right, they had all won "world" titles before Naz bashed them. Even Paul Ingle won the IBF title in his very next fight after losing to Naz.

Marquez had how many world titles back in Naz day? That's right, ZERO!! Marquez didn't become a "world" champion until bascially TWO years AFTER Naz had retired.

Just like Marquez the man himself said - "I want to fight Naz when I have a world title to make it more fair"

Marquez simply wasn't ready for Naz back then. And Naz had bigger fish to fry unifying the featherweight divison.

The duck explained. Fact.

What big fish? Cesar Soto? Come on now. Hamed didn't care about unifiying. But trying to unify was the only excuse he had left that the WBO was going to buy. They were set to strip him for his shameful ducking of Marquez. That's a fact. Hamed backed himself into a unification bout when he used it as an excuse. Why you think he never went after the other 2 titles?

As usual you display an astounding lack of knowledge of the boxing business.

Now get prepared to be educated some more. Ready?

1. Why would the WBO want a chump change fighter as their champion when they have a millionaire megastar reigning? The bigger the fighter, the bigger the purses, the bigger the SANCTION FEES. Why do you think the WBO didn't give a fuck about Marquez languishing as the no.1 contender? Marquez was a nobody.

2. The WBO never stripped Naz of anything, he chucked the title to fight Barrera.

3. Tom Johnson - IBF champion
Wilfredo Vazquez - Lineal and WBA champion (stripped for unifying with Naz)
Cesar Soto - WBC champion

Now let me make this easy - whilst Naz held the WBO title he beat the current lineal, WBC, WBA and IBF champion. That makes him the lineal, unified king of the featherweight division.

So what two titles you on about?

[Violent Demise]

Marquez was offered a career high payday of $400,000 to face Naz in the year 2000. He turned it down claiming he wasn't ready for Naz, even though he spent two years as WBO no.1 mandatory. Naz ruined the unfortunate Augie Sanchez instead.

The question is - where would Marquez be without this duck of Naz? It was clearly a great move. Fact.

Discuss

That right there says it all. Marquez waited and waited for Hamed to fight him. While Hamed begged and begged the WBO to let him fight some one else. After giving him so many passes the WBO was considering stripping him of the title. But Hamed promised he would fight Marquez after he fought Cesar Soto. He wanted to unify the titles first. Hamed beat Soto in one of the worst fights of 1999. Marquez canceled his fight with Roque Cassiani to prepare for Hamed. Than in one of the most skanless, cowardice moves ever in Boxing history Hamed backs out of the fight and in turn faces Vuyani Bungu. Now Bungu was a fine Super Bantamweight. But he had never fought as a Featherweight before. Not to mention he hadn't fought in over a year. Yet some how Hamed deemed him worthy of a title shot. Marquez considered legal action but decided against it. He was done with Hamed and his games. Hamed creamed Bungu while Marquez went on with the Cassiani fight. Afterwards Hamed for like the 10th time again told Marquez he would fight him. Marquez said if he was serious about fighting him give him $500,000. Hamed showed he wasn't serious and said no.

90% of your post is utter drivel.

This little snippet comes from Antonio Curtis, Marquez former matchmaker at Forum Boxing - "When the WBO said they were going to make a unification, I forgot who the hell they were supposed to be fighting. What happened is this, as soon as they told us no, we took another fight. As soon as we took another fight, then they called us when we had already signed for another fight and then they wanted us to fight Hamed, Curtis recalled, of those events. Now, I wanted to pull that fight, to fight Hamed. But Nacho said no. He would've gotten a half-million for the fight and Nacho turned that fight down." http://www.maxboxing.com/kim/kim031607.asp

There you go. Marquez shamelessly ducked Naz. Fact.

A link that leads no where. Just like your post. And I here i though you would actually provide something of substance. I'm disappointed in myself for thinking that. Anyway this is pretty easy standard stuff. The champion must defend against his mandatory within 6 months to a year. Hamed went over 2 years avoiding Marquez. In the mean time he fought an ancient fighter (Wilfredo Vazquez) a seriously out classed fighter (Wayne McCullough) and domestic club fighter (Paul Ingle). That's what you call ducking 101 there

All three much bigger names than Marquez back then. Anyway, i've something even better, straight from the horses mouth Juan Manuel Marquez admitting his duckage of the Naz fella.

Read and weep boy -

Featherweight Marquez said no to Hamed

Juan Manuel Marquez conceded Friday that he turned down a fight with Prince Naseem Hamed, the World Boxing Organization featherweight champion. "I had been waiting two years," said Marquez, speaking through a translator. "Now they want the fight. I wasn't prepared. They did not give me sufficient time to get prepared."

"Hamed is difficult to fight. Hamed is like a wrestler," Marquez said. "He will toss you around if he can. It is almost the same way with fighting (Freddie) Norwood. You have to knock him out to get the victory."

Marquez said he would like to fight Hamed as the champion of one of the other sanctioning bodies. Otherwise, Marquez said, fighting Hamed "is not on even terms."

Nacho Beristain, Marquez's manager, criticized the Hamed camp's negotiating tactics. "They want to get us when all of our energies are gone (from negotiating)," Beristain said. "They are only playing with our heads. We never want to fight (Hamed). Who do they think they are? They came out with an offer of $400,000. It is not worth it."

LAS VEGAS RJ:SPORTS: Featherweight Marquez said no to H...

There you go, you can't argue with the facts, Marquez turned down a career high payday because he didn't feel ready for Naz.

Marquez bottled the Naz fight. Fact.

Thank you. 2 years he waited and waited. But Hamed wanted none. You said it yourself. Can't argue facts. You provided the proof. For 2 years Hamed ducked him. He had no problem fighting chumps like Ingle. A fighter who'd own mother didn't know she had a son named Paul. But looked for every excuse not to fight Marquez

It's like this. Hamed was a good entertaining fighter. Fun to watch. But an ATG he is more certainly not. Facts don’t lie. And facts are Hamed never beat a real good fighter who was in his prime. All the fighters he fought who were a name came in with ridiculous amount of mileage on them. When Hamed fought Barrera. Barrera had already fought 55 times. Cesar Soto 63. Wilfredo Vazquez 59. Kevin Kelley 50. Vuyani Bungu 39. Tom Johnson 48. Manuel Medina 59. The ones that didn’t Paul Ingle and Wayne McCullough were not as good as the previous fighters mentioned. McCullough was average. Ingle was straight garbage.

The two year wait just harms Marquez case for the duck. If he spent that long chasing Naz how come he said NO the first opportunity he got? Don't make sense. The truth is Marquez/Beristain never wanted any part of Naz.

Here's a little quiz for you.

What do these guys have in common - Coto, Johnson, Medina, Kelly, McCullough, Bungu and Vazquez? That's right, they had all won "world" titles before Naz bashed them. Even Paul Ingle won the IBF title in his very next fight after losing to Naz.

Marquez had how many world titles back in Naz day? That's right, ZERO!! Marquez didn't become a "world" champion until bascially TWO years AFTER Naz had retired.

Just like Marquez the man himself said - "I want to fight Naz when I have a world title to make it more fair"

Marquez simply wasn't ready for Naz back then. And Naz had bigger fish to fry unifying the featherweight divison.

The duck explained. Fact.

What big fish? Cesar Soto? Come on now. Hamed didn't care about unifiying. But trying to unify was the only excuse he had left that the WBO was going to buy. They were set to strip him for his shameful ducking of Marquez. That's a fact. Hamed backed himself into a unification bout when he used it as an excuse. Why you think he never went after the other 2 titles?

As usual you display an astounding lack of knowledge of the boxing business.

Now get prepared to be educated some more. Ready?

1. Why would the WBO want a chump change fighter as their champion when they have a millionaire megastar reigning? The bigger the fighter, the bigger the purses, the bigger the SANCTION FEES. Why do you think the WBO didn't give a fuck about Marquez languishing as the no.1 contender? Marquez was a nobody.

2. The WBO never stripped Naz of anything, he chucked the title to fight Barrera.

3. Tom Johnson - IBF champion
Wilfredo Vazquez - Lineal and WBA champion (stripped for unifying with Naz)
Cesar Soto - WBC champion

Now let me make this easy - whilst Naz held the WBO title he beat the current lineal, WBC, WBA and IBF champion. That makes him the lineal, unified king of the featherweight division.

So what two titles you on about?

It's obvious you copied and paste somebody else post from where ever the hell you read it from and are trying to pass it off as your own. While you got the right words in. And the key phrases. You ain't using them right. Cuz you don't really know what you talking about. Let me fix your inconsistencies with straight facts.

Hamed became the lineal Featherweight champion when he beat Wilfredo Vazquez. Cuz that's how the lineal tree goes. So there was never no need to fight Cesar Soto. Unless it was to duck Marquez. He didn't care about his belt or unifying. If he did he would of never gave up the IBF title. And would of made sure Vazquez some how would of kept his WBA title. Or at least gone after who ever had the WBA title at the time. That's what unifying means. Collecting all belts. It wasn't to be considered the man at featherweight. Cuz he got that distinction when he beat Vazquez. Learn the difference. Fighting Soto was for one reason. And one reason only. To avoid fighting Marquez. Facts don't lie. Hamed ducked Marquez. Ducking was his nature. I'll prove it. Name me an elite fighter Hamed beat that was in his prime. Just one. And I said elite. So save your Paul Ingle and Wayne McCullough. Neither was ever elite.

[Fenster]

Marquez was offered a career high payday of $400,000 to face Naz in the year 2000. He turned it down claiming he wasn't ready for Naz, even though he spent two years as WBO no.1 mandatory. Naz ruined the unfortunate Augie Sanchez instead.

The question is - where would Marquez be without this duck of Naz? It was clearly a great move. Fact.

Discuss

That right there says it all. Marquez waited and waited for Hamed to fight him. While Hamed begged and begged the WBO to let him fight some one else. After giving him so many passes the WBO was considering stripping him of the title. But Hamed promised he would fight Marquez after he fought Cesar Soto. He wanted to unify the titles first. Hamed beat Soto in one of the worst fights of 1999. Marquez canceled his fight with Roque Cassiani to prepare for Hamed. Than in one of the most skanless, cowardice moves ever in Boxing history Hamed backs out of the fight and in turn faces Vuyani Bungu. Now Bungu was a fine Super Bantamweight. But he had never fought as a Featherweight before. Not to mention he hadn't fought in over a year. Yet some how Hamed deemed him worthy of a title shot. Marquez considered legal action but decided against it. He was done with Hamed and his games. Hamed creamed Bungu while Marquez went on with the Cassiani fight. Afterwards Hamed for like the 10th time again told Marquez he would fight him. Marquez said if he was serious about fighting him give him $500,000. Hamed showed he wasn't serious and said no.

90% of your post is utter drivel.

This little snippet comes from Antonio Curtis, Marquez former matchmaker at Forum Boxing - "When the WBO said they were going to make a unification, I forgot who the hell they were supposed to be fighting. What happened is this, as soon as they told us no, we took another fight. As soon as we took another fight, then they called us when we had already signed for another fight and then they wanted us to fight Hamed, Curtis recalled, of those events. Now, I wanted to pull that fight, to fight Hamed. But Nacho said no. He would've gotten a half-million for the fight and Nacho turned that fight down." http://www.maxboxing.com/kim/kim031607.asp

There you go. Marquez shamelessly ducked Naz. Fact.

A link that leads no where. Just like your post. And I here i though you would actually provide something of substance. I'm disappointed in myself for thinking that. Anyway this is pretty easy standard stuff. The champion must defend against his mandatory within 6 months to a year. Hamed went over 2 years avoiding Marquez. In the mean time he fought an ancient fighter (Wilfredo Vazquez) a seriously out classed fighter (Wayne McCullough) and domestic club fighter (Paul Ingle). That's what you call ducking 101 there

All three much bigger names than Marquez back then. Anyway, i've something even better, straight from the horses mouth Juan Manuel Marquez admitting his duckage of the Naz fella.

Read and weep boy -

Featherweight Marquez said no to Hamed

Juan Manuel Marquez conceded Friday that he turned down a fight with Prince Naseem Hamed, the World Boxing Organization featherweight champion. "I had been waiting two years," said Marquez, speaking through a translator. "Now they want the fight. I wasn't prepared. They did not give me sufficient time to get prepared."

"Hamed is difficult to fight. Hamed is like a wrestler," Marquez said. "He will toss you around if he can. It is almost the same way with fighting (Freddie) Norwood. You have to knock him out to get the victory."

Marquez said he would like to fight Hamed as the champion of one of the other sanctioning bodies. Otherwise, Marquez said, fighting Hamed "is not on even terms."

Nacho Beristain, Marquez's manager, criticized the Hamed camp's negotiating tactics. "They want to get us when all of our energies are gone (from negotiating)," Beristain said. "They are only playing with our heads. We never want to fight (Hamed). Who do they think they are? They came out with an offer of $400,000. It is not worth it."

LAS VEGAS RJ:SPORTS: Featherweight Marquez said no to H...

There you go, you can't argue with the facts, Marquez turned down a career high payday because he didn't feel ready for Naz.

Marquez bottled the Naz fight. Fact.

Thank you. 2 years he waited and waited. But Hamed wanted none. You said it yourself. Can't argue facts. You provided the proof. For 2 years Hamed ducked him. He had no problem fighting chumps like Ingle. A fighter who'd own mother didn't know she had a son named Paul. But looked for every excuse not to fight Marquez

It's like this. Hamed was a good entertaining fighter. Fun to watch. But an ATG he is more certainly not. Facts don’t lie. And facts are Hamed never beat a real good fighter who was in his prime. All the fighters he fought who were a name came in with ridiculous amount of mileage on them. When Hamed fought Barrera. Barrera had already fought 55 times. Cesar Soto 63. Wilfredo Vazquez 59. Kevin Kelley 50. Vuyani Bungu 39. Tom Johnson 48. Manuel Medina 59. The ones that didn’t Paul Ingle and Wayne McCullough were not as good as the previous fighters mentioned. McCullough was average. Ingle was straight garbage.

The two year wait just harms Marquez case for the duck. If he spent that long chasing Naz how come he said NO the first opportunity he got? Don't make sense. The truth is Marquez/Beristain never wanted any part of Naz.

Here's a little quiz for you.

What do these guys have in common - Coto, Johnson, Medina, Kelly, McCullough, Bungu and Vazquez? That's right, they had all won "world" titles before Naz bashed them. Even Paul Ingle won the IBF title in his very next fight after losing to Naz.

Marquez had how many world titles back in Naz day? That's right, ZERO!! Marquez didn't become a "world" champion until bascially TWO years AFTER Naz had retired.

Just like Marquez the man himself said - "I want to fight Naz when I have a world title to make it more fair"

Marquez simply wasn't ready for Naz back then. And Naz had bigger fish to fry unifying the featherweight divison.

The duck explained. Fact.

What big fish? Cesar Soto? Come on now. Hamed didn't care about unifiying. But trying to unify was the only excuse he had left that the WBO was going to buy. They were set to strip him for his shameful ducking of Marquez. That's a fact. Hamed backed himself into a unification bout when he used it as an excuse. Why you think he never went after the other 2 titles?

As usual you display an astounding lack of knowledge of the boxing business.

Now get prepared to be educated some more. Ready?

1. Why would the WBO want a chump change fighter as their champion when they have a millionaire megastar reigning? The bigger the fighter, the bigger the purses, the bigger the SANCTION FEES. Why do you think the WBO didn't give a fuck about Marquez languishing as the no.1 contender? Marquez was a nobody.

2. The WBO never stripped Naz of anything, he chucked the title to fight Barrera.

3. Tom Johnson - IBF champion
Wilfredo Vazquez - Lineal and WBA champion (stripped for unifying with Naz)
Cesar Soto - WBC champion

Now let me make this easy - whilst Naz held the WBO title he beat the current lineal, WBC, WBA and IBF champion. That makes him the lineal, unified king of the featherweight division.

So what two titles you on about?

It's obvious you copied and paste somebody else post from where ever the hell you read it from and are trying to pass it off as your own. While you got the right words in. And the key phrases. You ain't using them right. Cuz you don't really know what you talking about. Let me fix your inconsistencies with straight facts.

((Accusing me of plagiarism ))

Yet again you show a shocking naivety in all matters boxing.

Marquez lost to Norwood (in a fight so ugly HBO were appalled) 4 weeks before Naz beat Soto. So explain how Naz-Marquez was gonna happen at that time?

Only hardcore fans understand lineal. Alphabet unifications SELL!!! HBO paid Naz $5million for the Soto unification.

Now, as anyone can see, i've already unequivocally proven that Marquez ducked Naz. Marquez said it. Beristain said it. Their former match maker said it.

But you answer me this - name me an elite fighter Marquez beat that was in his prime. Just one. And I said elite. Or a world title Marquez had won. Just one. And I said one world title. Back in the day that would warrant him a shot at Naz?

[Mattyhitman]

Marquez was offered a career high payday of $400,000 to face Naz in the year 2000. He turned it down claiming he wasn't ready for Naz, even though he spent two years as WBO no.1 mandatory. Naz ruined the unfortunate Augie Sanchez instead.

The question is - where would Marquez be without this duck of Naz? It was clearly a great move. Fact.

Discuss

That right there says it all. Marquez waited and waited for Hamed to fight him. While Hamed begged and begged the WBO to let him fight some one else. After giving him so many passes the WBO was considering stripping him of the title. But Hamed promised he would fight Marquez after he fought Cesar Soto. He wanted to unify the titles first. Hamed beat Soto in one of the worst fights of 1999. Marquez canceled his fight with Roque Cassiani to prepare for Hamed. Than in one of the most skanless, cowardice moves ever in Boxing history Hamed backs out of the fight and in turn faces Vuyani Bungu. Now Bungu was a fine Super Bantamweight. But he had never fought as a Featherweight before. Not to mention he hadn't fought in over a year. Yet some how Hamed deemed him worthy of a title shot. Marquez considered legal action but decided against it. He was done with Hamed and his games. Hamed creamed Bungu while Marquez went on with the Cassiani fight. Afterwards Hamed for like the 10th time again told Marquez he would fight him. Marquez said if he was serious about fighting him give him $500,000. Hamed showed he wasn't serious and said no.

90% of your post is utter drivel.

This little snippet comes from Antonio Curtis, Marquez former matchmaker at Forum Boxing - "When the WBO said they were going to make a unification, I forgot who the hell they were supposed to be fighting. What happened is this, as soon as they told us no, we took another fight. As soon as we took another fight, then they called us when we had already signed for another fight and then they wanted us to fight Hamed, Curtis recalled, of those events. Now, I wanted to pull that fight, to fight Hamed. But Nacho said no. He would've gotten a half-million for the fight and Nacho turned that fight down." http://www.maxboxing.com/kim/kim031607.asp

There you go. Marquez shamelessly ducked Naz. Fact.

A link that leads no where. Just like your post. And I here i though you would actually provide something of substance. I'm disappointed in myself for thinking that. Anyway this is pretty easy standard stuff. The champion must defend against his mandatory within 6 months to a year. Hamed went over 2 years avoiding Marquez. In the mean time he fought an ancient fighter (Wilfredo Vazquez) a seriously out classed fighter (Wayne McCullough) and domestic club fighter (Paul Ingle). That's what you call ducking 101 there

All three much bigger names than Marquez back then. Anyway, i've something even better, straight from the horses mouth Juan Manuel Marquez admitting his duckage of the Naz fella.

Read and weep boy -

Featherweight Marquez said no to Hamed

Juan Manuel Marquez conceded Friday that he turned down a fight with Prince Naseem Hamed, the World Boxing Organization featherweight champion. "I had been waiting two years," said Marquez, speaking through a translator. "Now they want the fight. I wasn't prepared. They did not give me sufficient time to get prepared."

"Hamed is difficult to fight. Hamed is like a wrestler," Marquez said. "He will toss you around if he can. It is almost the same way with fighting (Freddie) Norwood. You have to knock him out to get the victory."

Marquez said he would like to fight Hamed as the champion of one of the other sanctioning bodies. Otherwise, Marquez said, fighting Hamed "is not on even terms."

Nacho Beristain, Marquez's manager, criticized the Hamed camp's negotiating tactics. "They want to get us when all of our energies are gone (from negotiating)," Beristain said. "They are only playing with our heads. We never want to fight (Hamed). Who do they think they are? They came out with an offer of $400,000. It is not worth it."

LAS VEGAS RJ:SPORTS: Featherweight Marquez said no to H...

There you go, you can't argue with the facts, Marquez turned down a career high payday because he didn't feel ready for Naz.

Marquez bottled the Naz fight. Fact.

Thank you. 2 years he waited and waited. But Hamed wanted none. You said it yourself. Can't argue facts. You provided the proof. For 2 years Hamed ducked him. He had no problem fighting chumps like Ingle. A fighter who'd own mother didn't know she had a son named Paul. But looked for every excuse not to fight Marquez

It's like this. Hamed was a good entertaining fighter. Fun to watch. But an ATG he is more certainly not. Facts don’t lie. And facts are Hamed never beat a real good fighter who was in his prime. All the fighters he fought who were a name came in with ridiculous amount of mileage on them. When Hamed fought Barrera. Barrera had already fought 55 times. Cesar Soto 63. Wilfredo Vazquez 59. Kevin Kelley 50. Vuyani Bungu 39. Tom Johnson 48. Manuel Medina 59. The ones that didn’t Paul Ingle and Wayne McCullough were not as good as the previous fighters mentioned. McCullough was average. Ingle was straight garbage.

The two year wait just harms Marquez case for the duck. If he spent that long chasing Naz how come he said NO the first opportunity he got? Don't make sense. The truth is Marquez/Beristain never wanted any part of Naz.

Here's a little quiz for you.

What do these guys have in common - Coto, Johnson, Medina, Kelly, McCullough, Bungu and Vazquez? That's right, they had all won "world" titles before Naz bashed them. Even Paul Ingle won the IBF title in his very next fight after losing to Naz.

Marquez had how many world titles back in Naz day? That's right, ZERO!! Marquez didn't become a "world" champion until bascially TWO years AFTER Naz had retired.

Just like Marquez the man himself said - "I want to fight Naz when I have a world title to make it more fair"

Marquez simply wasn't ready for Naz back then. And Naz had bigger fish to fry unifying the featherweight divison.

The duck explained. Fact.

What big fish? Cesar Soto? Come on now. Hamed didn't care about unifiying. But trying to unify was the only excuse he had left that the WBO was going to buy. They were set to strip him for his shameful ducking of Marquez. That's a fact. Hamed backed himself into a unification bout when he used it as an excuse. Why you think he never went after the other 2 titles?

As usual you display an astounding lack of knowledge of the boxing business.

Now get prepared to be educated some more. Ready?

1. Why would the WBO want a chump change fighter as their champion when they have a millionaire megastar reigning? The bigger the fighter, the bigger the purses, the bigger the SANCTION FEES. Why do you think the WBO didn't give a fuck about Marquez languishing as the no.1 contender? Marquez was a nobody.

2. The WBO never stripped Naz of anything, he chucked the title to fight Barrera.

3. Tom Johnson - IBF champion
Wilfredo Vazquez - Lineal and WBA champion (stripped for unifying with Naz)
Cesar Soto - WBC champion

Now let me make this easy - whilst Naz held the WBO title he beat the current lineal, WBC, WBA and IBF champion. That makes him the lineal, unified king of the featherweight division.

So what two titles you on about?

It's obvious you copied and paste somebody else post from where ever the hell you read it from and are trying to pass it off as your own. While you got the right words in. And the key phrases. You ain't using them right. Cuz you don't really know what you talking about. Let me fix your inconsistencies with straight facts.

((Accusing me of plagiarism ))

Yet again you show a shocking naivety in all matters boxing.

Marquez lost to Norwood (in a fight so ugly HBO were appalled) 4 weeks before Naz beat Soto. So explain how Naz-Marquez was gonna happen at that time?

Only hardcore fans understand lineal. Alphabet unifications SELL!!! HBO paid Naz $5million for the Soto unification.

Now, as anyone can see, i've already unequivocally proven that Marquez ducked Naz. Marquez said it. Beristain said it. Their former match maker said it.

But you answer me this - name me an elite fighter Marquez beat that was in his prime. Just one. And I said elite. Or a world title Marquez had won. Just one. And I said one world title. Back in the day that would warrant him a shot at Naz?

Hmmm


It seems to me the FACTS Fenster is putting forward are by far the superior. I really carnt see a way out of this for ya VD

[Fenster]

Marquez was offered a career high payday of $400,000 to face Naz in the year 2000. He turned it down claiming he wasn't ready for Naz, even though he spent two years as WBO no.1 mandatory. Naz ruined the unfortunate Augie Sanchez instead.

The question is - where would Marquez be without this duck of Naz? It was clearly a great move. Fact.

Discuss

That right there says it all. Marquez waited and waited for Hamed to fight him. While Hamed begged and begged the WBO to let him fight some one else. After giving him so many passes the WBO was considering stripping him of the title. But Hamed promised he would fight Marquez after he fought Cesar Soto. He wanted to unify the titles first. Hamed beat Soto in one of the worst fights of 1999. Marquez canceled his fight with Roque Cassiani to prepare for Hamed. Than in one of the most skanless, cowardice moves ever in Boxing history Hamed backs out of the fight and in turn faces Vuyani Bungu. Now Bungu was a fine Super Bantamweight. But he had never fought as a Featherweight before. Not to mention he hadn't fought in over a year. Yet some how Hamed deemed him worthy of a title shot. Marquez considered legal action but decided against it. He was done with Hamed and his games. Hamed creamed Bungu while Marquez went on with the Cassiani fight. Afterwards Hamed for like the 10th time again told Marquez he would fight him. Marquez said if he was serious about fighting him give him $500,000. Hamed showed he wasn't serious and said no.

90% of your post is utter drivel.

This little snippet comes from Antonio Curtis, Marquez former matchmaker at Forum Boxing - "When the WBO said they were going to make a unification, I forgot who the hell they were supposed to be fighting. What happened is this, as soon as they told us no, we took another fight. As soon as we took another fight, then they called us when we had already signed for another fight and then they wanted us to fight Hamed, Curtis recalled, of those events. Now, I wanted to pull that fight, to fight Hamed. But Nacho said no. He would've gotten a half-million for the fight and Nacho turned that fight down." http://www.maxboxing.com/kim/kim031607.asp

There you go. Marquez shamelessly ducked Naz. Fact.

A link that leads no where. Just like your post. And I here i though you would actually provide something of substance. I'm disappointed in myself for thinking that. Anyway this is pretty easy standard stuff. The champion must defend against his mandatory within 6 months to a year. Hamed went over 2 years avoiding Marquez. In the mean time he fought an ancient fighter (Wilfredo Vazquez) a seriously out classed fighter (Wayne McCullough) and domestic club fighter (Paul Ingle). That's what you call ducking 101 there

All three much bigger names than Marquez back then. Anyway, i've something even better, straight from the horses mouth Juan Manuel Marquez admitting his duckage of the Naz fella.

Read and weep boy -

Featherweight Marquez said no to Hamed

Juan Manuel Marquez conceded Friday that he turned down a fight with Prince Naseem Hamed, the World Boxing Organization featherweight champion. "I had been waiting two years," said Marquez, speaking through a translator. "Now they want the fight. I wasn't prepared. They did not give me sufficient time to get prepared."

"Hamed is difficult to fight. Hamed is like a wrestler," Marquez said. "He will toss you around if he can. It is almost the same way with fighting (Freddie) Norwood. You have to knock him out to get the victory."

Marquez said he would like to fight Hamed as the champion of one of the other sanctioning bodies. Otherwise, Marquez said, fighting Hamed "is not on even terms."

Nacho Beristain, Marquez's manager, criticized the Hamed camp's negotiating tactics. "They want to get us when all of our energies are gone (from negotiating)," Beristain said. "They are only playing with our heads. We never want to fight (Hamed). Who do they think they are? They came out with an offer of $400,000. It is not worth it."

LAS VEGAS RJ:SPORTS: Featherweight Marquez said no to H...

There you go, you can't argue with the facts, Marquez turned down a career high payday because he didn't feel ready for Naz.

Marquez bottled the Naz fight. Fact.

Thank you. 2 years he waited and waited. But Hamed wanted none. You said it yourself. Can't argue facts. You provided the proof. For 2 years Hamed ducked him. He had no problem fighting chumps like Ingle. A fighter who'd own mother didn't know she had a son named Paul. But looked for every excuse not to fight Marquez

It's like this. Hamed was a good entertaining fighter. Fun to watch. But an ATG he is more certainly not. Facts don’t lie. And facts are Hamed never beat a real good fighter who was in his prime. All the fighters he fought who were a name came in with ridiculous amount of mileage on them. When Hamed fought Barrera. Barrera had already fought 55 times. Cesar Soto 63. Wilfredo Vazquez 59. Kevin Kelley 50. Vuyani Bungu 39. Tom Johnson 48. Manuel Medina 59. The ones that didn’t Paul Ingle and Wayne McCullough were not as good as the previous fighters mentioned. McCullough was average. Ingle was straight garbage.

The two year wait just harms Marquez case for the duck. If he spent that long chasing Naz how come he said NO the first opportunity he got? Don't make sense. The truth is Marquez/Beristain never wanted any part of Naz.

Here's a little quiz for you.

What do these guys have in common - Coto, Johnson, Medina, Kelly, McCullough, Bungu and Vazquez? That's right, they had all won "world" titles before Naz bashed them. Even Paul Ingle won the IBF title in his very next fight after losing to Naz.

Marquez had how many world titles back in Naz day? That's right, ZERO!! Marquez didn't become a "world" champion until bascially TWO years AFTER Naz had retired.

Just like Marquez the man himself said - "I want to fight Naz when I have a world title to make it more fair"

Marquez simply wasn't ready for Naz back then. And Naz had bigger fish to fry unifying the featherweight divison.

The duck explained. Fact.

What big fish? Cesar Soto? Come on now. Hamed didn't care about unifiying. But trying to unify was the only excuse he had left that the WBO was going to buy. They were set to strip him for his shameful ducking of Marquez. That's a fact. Hamed backed himself into a unification bout when he used it as an excuse. Why you think he never went after the other 2 titles?

As usual you display an astounding lack of knowledge of the boxing business.

Now get prepared to be educated some more. Ready?

1. Why would the WBO want a chump change fighter as their champion when they have a millionaire megastar reigning? The bigger the fighter, the bigger the purses, the bigger the SANCTION FEES. Why do you think the WBO didn't give a fuck about Marquez languishing as the no.1 contender? Marquez was a nobody.

2. The WBO never stripped Naz of anything, he chucked the title to fight Barrera.

3. Tom Johnson - IBF champion
Wilfredo Vazquez - Lineal and WBA champion (stripped for unifying with Naz)
Cesar Soto - WBC champion

Now let me make this easy - whilst Naz held the WBO title he beat the current lineal, WBC, WBA and IBF champion. That makes him the lineal, unified king of the featherweight division.

So what two titles you on about?

It's obvious you copied and paste somebody else post from where ever the hell you read it from and are trying to pass it off as your own. While you got the right words in. And the key phrases. You ain't using them right. Cuz you don't really know what you talking about. Let me fix your inconsistencies with straight facts.

((Accusing me of plagiarism ))

Yet again you show a shocking naivety in all matters boxing.

Marquez lost to Norwood (in a fight so ugly HBO were appalled) 4 weeks before Naz beat Soto. So explain how Naz-Marquez was gonna happen at that time?

Only hardcore fans understand lineal. Alphabet unifications SELL!!! HBO paid Naz $5million for the Soto unification.

Now, as anyone can see, i've already unequivocally proven that Marquez ducked Naz. Marquez said it. Beristain said it. Their former match maker said it.

But you answer me this - name me an elite fighter Marquez beat that was in his prime. Just one. And I said elite. Or a world title Marquez had won. Just one. And I said one world title. Back in the day that would warrant him a shot at Naz?

Hmmm


It seems to me the FACTS Fenster is putting forward are by far the superior. I really carnt see a way out of this for ya VD

Clearly you're a smart fella Mattyhitman.

Fenster deals in facts, VD deals in fantasy. It's really no contest. Fact.