When was the last time Pacman faced a true boxer?

[rjj tszyu]

I know some will say ODLH but that wasn't a prime boxing Oscar. So take away that fight and when was the last time he faced a fighter that could truly box on a world class level?

When I say box, I mean that their initial strategy is to box first, fight second.

Marquez...without question. Marquez is a true technician...intelligent and skilled. That is why his timing and counter punching gave Pac fits.

Exactly. Which is the exact reason I have Mayweather to school Pac. Mayweather is the greatest counter puncher and has the best boxing brain of any fighter in the world today. For me that is what will make him dominate Pac who likes to pick off these fighter who just keep walking him down all night and being pummelled for their troubles.

Oscar was a great boxer in his day BUT I don't think he should have agreed to make Welter, and he had already shown he wasn't the force he once was when he fought Forbes. Don't want to take it away from Pac though as I think he is the greatest weight climber of all time, but I truly believe he will more than meet his match if he fights Floyd.

[ElTerribleMorales]

I know some will say ODLH but that wasn't a prime boxing Oscar. So take away that fight and when was the last time he faced a fighter that could truly box on a world class level?

When I say box, I mean that their initial strategy is to box first, fight second.

Marquez...without question. Marquez is a true technician...intelligent and skilled. That is why his timing and counter punching gave Pac fits.

Exactly. Which is the exact reason I have Mayweather to school Pac. Mayweather is the greatest counter puncher and has the best boxing brain of any fighter in the world today. For me that is what will make him dominate Pac who likes to pick off these fighter who just keep walking him down all night and being pummelled for their troubles.

Oscar was a great boxer in his day BUT I don't think he should have agreed to make Welter, and he had already shown he wasn't the force he once was when he fought Forbes. Don't want to take it away from Pac though as I think he is the greatest weight climber of all time, but I truly believe he will more than meet his match if he fights Floyd.

people keep saying this when honestly i think it's being played up too much, Pacquiao is doing what Jones already has done, difference is in the higher weight classes well the gaps between divisions are a bit wider therefore there are less weight classes than from jnr welter on down, both guys have spanned their careers 40 lbs, if anything Jones' accomplishment of winning a title should be even more praised since he didn't do it at a catch weight and Ruiz outweighed him by what? 40 lbs?

it's not a knock on Pacquiao, but i think what makes his accomplishments special is more WHO he has beaten rather than how many titles or weight classes he's jumped up in

[Majesty]

I know some will say ODLH but that wasn't a prime boxing Oscar. So take away that fight and when was the last time he faced a fighter that could truly box on a world class level?

When I say box, I mean that their initial strategy is to box first, fight second.

Marquez...without question. Marquez is a true technician...intelligent and skilled. That is why his timing and counter punching gave Pac fits.

Exactly. Which is the exact reason I have Mayweather to school Pac. Mayweather is the greatest counter puncher and has the best boxing brain of any fighter in the world today. For me that is what will make him dominate Pac who likes to pick off these fighter who just keep walking him down all night and being pummelled for their troubles.

Oscar was a great boxer in his day BUT I don't think he should have agreed to make Welter, and he had already shown he wasn't the force he once was when he fought Forbes. Don't want to take it away from Pac though as I think he is the greatest weight climber of all time, but I truly believe he will more than meet his match if he fights Floyd.

people keep saying this when honestly i think it's being played up too much, Pacquiao is doing what Jones already has done, difference is in the higher weight classes well the gaps between divisions are a bit wider therefore there are less weight classes than from jnr welter on down, both guys have spanned their careers 40 lbs, if anything Jones' accomplishment of winning a title should be even more praised since he didn't do it at a catch weight and Ruiz outweighed him by what? 40 lbs?

it's not a knock on Pacquiao, but i think what makes his accomplishments special is more WHO he has beaten rather than how many titles or weight classes he's jumped up in

the thing you have remember though is boxing fans are fickle.

Because Jones' losses since then have 'apparently' put into question how great he is, accomplishments of the past be darned its all flushed down the pike because anyone can pick apart a record.

If Jones had retired after he fought Tarver the first time you'd be hearing he was the greatest since Ray Robinson and when it came time to bite the bullet he faced it flawlessly. That didn't happen and people ignore his accomplishments and pick them apart instead.

Same thing will happen to Pacquiao(in america) if Mayweather beats him one sidedly.

I mean come on, Pacquiao is a guy HBO said Zahir Raheem would trouble after he lost to Morales and Raheem beat him. Remember HBO said that Raheem was a slick boxer counter puncher and someone to keep Pacquiao AWAY from.

But now, they are trying to make you believe he has the greatest chance of beating Mayweather.

If he loses, the same things will happen. One thing I will give a fighter that is fighting for their country like in the Phillipines. Is that they will stand behind Pacquiao even after if Mayweather dominated him. While I'm willing to bet here in the US all the picking apart of his record will begin on a much larger scale.

Sad, yes, but that's how its been going. You build a guy up for 10 years only to try to pick him apart in a manner of months.

Apparently around here your victories mean absolutely squat if there is a reason to criticize you for them, win or loss. No fighter out there has flawless performances, no one. But tell that to the people that hate on every performance they've had where they faced adversity.

I kind of find it hilarious how people always refuse to give credit to a fighter until they've faced adversity. And then once they've faced adversity, use it as a reason of weakness against them.

[KKisser]

I know some will say ODLH but that wasn't a prime boxing Oscar. So take away that fight and when was the last time he faced a fighter that could truly box on a world class level?

When I say box, I mean that their initial strategy is to box first, fight second.

Marquez...without question. Marquez is a true technician...intelligent and skilled. That is why his timing and counter punching gave Pac fits.

Exactly. Which is the exact reason I have Mayweather to school Pac. Mayweather is the greatest counter puncher and has the best boxing brain of any fighter in the world today. For me that is what will make him dominate Pac who likes to pick off these fighter who just keep walking him down all night and being pummelled for their troubles.

Oscar was a great boxer in his day BUT I don't think he should have agreed to make Welter, and he had already shown he wasn't the force he once was when he fought Forbes. Don't want to take it away from Pac though as I think he is the greatest weight climber of all time, but I truly believe he will more than meet his match if he fights Floyd.

that could very well be, but if you've seen almost all of pac's fight there's just no quit in him. i remember the sasakul fight when pacquiao was being schooled all throughout the match but he kept attacking the thai fighter landing only now and then and finally knocking him out. it's possible a fight with floyd would be like that, only at a highest level.

that what makes pac-floyd matchup intriguing. i'm rooting for pac but no one can be totally sure how it will turn out.

[generalbulldog]

I know some will say ODLH but that wasn't a prime boxing Oscar. So take away that fight and when was the last time he faced a fighter that could truly box on a world class level?

When I say box, I mean that their initial strategy is to box first, fight second.

Marquez...without question. Marquez is a true technician...intelligent and skilled. That is why his timing and counter punching gave Pac fits.

Exactly. Which is the exact reason I have Mayweather to school Pac. Mayweather is the greatest counter puncher and has the best boxing brain of any fighter in the world today. For me that is what will make him dominate Pac who likes to pick off these fighter who just keep walking him down all night and being pummelled for their troubles.

Oscar was a great boxer in his day BUT I don't think he should have agreed to make Welter, and he had already shown he wasn't the force he once was when he fought Forbes. Don't want to take it away from Pac though as I think he is the greatest weight climber of all time, but I truly believe he will more than meet his match if he fights Floyd.

that could very well be, but if you've seen almost all of pac's fight there's just no quit in him. i remember the sasakul fight when pacquiao was being schooled all throughout the match but he kept attacking the thai fighter landing only now and then and finally knocking him out. it's possible a fight with floyd would be like that, only at a highest level.

that what makes pac-floyd matchup intriguing. i'm rooting for pac but no one can be totally sure how it will turn out.

I think to this day his win against Sasakul is his most impressive victory. To be a lineal champ in your teenage years is very rare. He beat Sasakul for the lineal flyweight championship at 19. In boxing history you can only count on 1 hand of the other guys accomplishing that feat. I can only name Benitez and Canzoneri as the other 2, there could possibly be more but that's all I can think of right now.

[rjj tszyu]

I know some will say ODLH but that wasn't a prime boxing Oscar. So take away that fight and when was the last time he faced a fighter that could truly box on a world class level?

When I say box, I mean that their initial strategy is to box first, fight second.

Marquez...without question. Marquez is a true technician...intelligent and skilled. That is why his timing and counter punching gave Pac fits.

Exactly. Which is the exact reason I have Mayweather to school Pac. Mayweather is the greatest counter puncher and has the best boxing brain of any fighter in the world today. For me that is what will make him dominate Pac who likes to pick off these fighter who just keep walking him down all night and being pummelled for their troubles.

Oscar was a great boxer in his day BUT I don't think he should have agreed to make Welter, and he had already shown he wasn't the force he once was when he fought Forbes. Don't want to take it away from Pac though as I think he is the greatest weight climber of all time, but I truly believe he will more than meet his match if he fights Floyd.

that could very well be, but if you've seen almost all of pac's fight there's just no quit in him. i remember the sasakul fight when pacquiao was being schooled all throughout the match but he kept attacking the thai fighter landing only now and then and finally knocking him out. it's possible a fight with floyd would be like that, only at a highest level.

that what makes pac-floyd matchup intriguing. i'm rooting for pac but no one can be totally sure how it will turn out.

I think to this day his win against Sasakul is his most impressive victory. To be a lineal champ in your teenage years is very rare. He beat Sasakul for the lineal flyweight championship at 19. In boxing history you can only count on 1 hand of the other guys accomplishing that feat. I can only name Benitez and Canzoneri as the other 2, there could possibly be more but that's all I can think of right now.

Bulldog. This could actually make a great thread in itself. I immediately thought Salvador Sanchez MUST have been in his teens but thank god I checked it out first as he was an ancient 21 and 1 month when he won his world title.

I will be thinking all night now about who else was a world champ in their teens lol.

[:::PSL:::]

I know some will say ODLH but that wasn't a prime boxing Oscar. So take away that fight and when was the last time he faced a fighter that could truly box on a world class level?

When I say box, I mean that their initial strategy is to box first, fight second.

Marquez...without question. Marquez is a true technician...intelligent and skilled. That is why his timing and counter punching gave Pac fits.

Exactly. Which is the exact reason I have Mayweather to school Pac. Mayweather is the greatest counter puncher and has the best boxing brain of any fighter in the world today. For me that is what will make him dominate Pac who likes to pick off these fighter who just keep walking him down all night and being pummelled for their troubles.

Oscar was a great boxer in his day BUT I don't think he should have agreed to make Welter, and he had already shown he wasn't the force he once was when he fought Forbes. Don't want to take it away from Pac though as I think he is the greatest weight climber of all time, but I truly believe he will more than meet his match if he fights Floyd.

that could very well be, but if you've seen almost all of pac's fight there's just no quit in him. i remember the sasakul fight when pacquiao was being schooled all throughout the match but he kept attacking the thai fighter landing only now and then and finally knocking him out. it's possible a fight with floyd would be like that, only at a highest level.

that what makes pac-floyd matchup intriguing. i'm rooting for pac but no one can be totally sure how it will turn out.

I think to this day his win against Sasakul is his most impressive victory. To be a lineal champ in your teenage years is very rare. He beat Sasakul for the lineal flyweight championship at 19. In boxing history you can only count on 1 hand of the other guys accomplishing that feat. I can only name Benitez and Canzoneri as the other 2, there could possibly be more but that's all I can think of right now.

Bulldog. This could actually make a great thread in itself. I immediately thought Salvador Sanchez MUST have been in his teens but thank god I checked it out first as he was an ancient 21 and 1 month when he won his world title.

I will be thinking all night now about who else was a world champ in their teens lol.

Marvin Sonsona.

[rjj tszyu]

I know some will say ODLH but that wasn't a prime boxing Oscar. So take away that fight and when was the last time he faced a fighter that could truly box on a world class level?

When I say box, I mean that their initial strategy is to box first, fight second.

Marquez...without question. Marquez is a true technician...intelligent and skilled. That is why his timing and counter punching gave Pac fits.

Exactly. Which is the exact reason I have Mayweather to school Pac. Mayweather is the greatest counter puncher and has the best boxing brain of any fighter in the world today. For me that is what will make him dominate Pac who likes to pick off these fighter who just keep walking him down all night and being pummelled for their troubles.

Oscar was a great boxer in his day BUT I don't think he should have agreed to make Welter, and he had already shown he wasn't the force he once was when he fought Forbes. Don't want to take it away from Pac though as I think he is the greatest weight climber of all time, but I truly believe he will more than meet his match if he fights Floyd.

that could very well be, but if you've seen almost all of pac's fight there's just no quit in him. i remember the sasakul fight when pacquiao was being schooled all throughout the match but he kept attacking the thai fighter landing only now and then and finally knocking him out. it's possible a fight with floyd would be like that, only at a highest level.

that what makes pac-floyd matchup intriguing. i'm rooting for pac but no one can be totally sure how it will turn out.

I think to this day his win against Sasakul is his most impressive victory. To be a lineal champ in your teenage years is very rare. He beat Sasakul for the lineal flyweight championship at 19. In boxing history you can only count on 1 hand of the other guys accomplishing that feat. I can only name Benitez and Canzoneri as the other 2, there could possibly be more but that's all I can think of right now.

Bulldog. This could actually make a great thread in itself. I immediately thought Salvador Sanchez MUST have been in his teens but thank god I checked it out first as he was an ancient 21 and 1 month when he won his world title.

I will be thinking all night now about who else was a world champ in their teens lol.

Marvin Sonsona.

He can't be seen as the Lineal champ surely though. Darchinyan was the real man then wasn't he?

[KananKrus]

Raheem was a lightweight, fighting at the 135lb limit during these period in question. Pac's trilogy with Erik Morales, more or less in the same time frame, were all fought at the weight limit of 130lb or less.

These two statements will make a liar if not delusional, of people claiming and in so doing, indirectly accuse Manny Pacquiao of ducking slick fighter, Zahir Raheem. These claims makes no sense whatsoever, for simply at the time, Pac was still too smallish to campaign as a full pledged lightweight.

Funny how the mind works overtime for some people, conjuring scenarios less than factual, much ala Bernard Hopkins, just to dull and diminish whatever it is, Pacq's accomplishments in boxing.

We can all just laugh this off, and call it banter, but we could also turn the other way, and be rightful... by just simply being factual!

[rjj tszyu]

Hiroki Ioka was only 19 when he became the first man to hold the WBC Minimumweight world title in 1987

Do we count this as Lineal? The WBA didn't have a title until the following year but the IBF's champion had won his title a few months earlier than Ioka only to then lose to Ioka 22 days after Iokas 20th birthday.