J.M. Marquez vs Mosely at 147

[CFH]

Mosley beats Marquez, but Marquez gives Pacquiao a tougher fight than Mosley .

[Gandalf]

Mosley beats Marquez, but Marquez gives Pacquiao a tougher fight than Mosley .

I think so too, boxing is really strange that way.

[CFH]

Mosley beats Marquez, but Marquez gives Pacquiao a tougher fight than Mosley .

I think so too, boxing is really strange that way.

Styles make fights and all that jazz.

[ruthless rocco]

i respectfully believe marquez should retire.
he's an amazing fighter and should get out before he gives too much.

[Kev]

Mosley beats Marquez, but Marquez gives Pacquiao a tougher fight than Mosley .

I think so too, boxing is really strange that way.

I just don't get this at all. How people can think Mosley is not finished enought to beat J M Marquez, but is too shot to beat Manny is such a weird contradiction.

I think BOTH fighters are a legitimate test for Manny.

Manny is far more to Mosley's liking than Floyd and Mora. I think Mosley would always have had trouble with Sergio Mora, and I don't think any version of Mosley beat Floyd either.

Pacquaio Mosley will be a very entertaining fight.

Marquez may yet get another shot if he keeps winning. But to me Marquez is scraping past guys like Diaz, Katsidis and Casamayor in wars, guys that Mosley would just destroy.

I think Marquez looks a much easier propositon for Pacquaio now at 147 than Mosley does.

And Manny sure as hell isn't going to move down another weight class to help Marquez out, and why should he? Mosley at 147 is a better fight than Marquez at 147 imo.

[Gandalf]

Mosley beats Marquez, but Marquez gives Pacquiao a tougher fight than Mosley .

I think so too, boxing is really strange that way.

I just don't get this at all. How people can think Mosley is not finished enought to beat J M Marquez, but is too shot to beat Manny is such a weird contradiction.

I think BOTH fighters are a legitimate test for Manny.

Manny is far more to Mosley's liking than Floyd and Mora. I think Mosley would always have had trouble with Sergio Mora, and I don't think any version of Mosley beat Floyd either.

Pacquaio Mosley will be a very entertaining fight.

Marquez may yet get another shot if he keeps winning. But to me Marquez is scraping past guys like Diaz, Katsidis and Casamayor in wars, guys that Mosley would just destroy.

I think Marquez looks a much easier propositon for Pacquaio now at 147 than Mosley does.

And Manny sure as hell isn't going to move down another weight class to help Marquez out, and why should he? Mosley at 147 is a better fight than Marquez at 147 imo.

Yes, it does sound weird and I said as much above, but based on the styles it is just the assumption that I come to.

Marquez knows how to win rounds against Manny. His counter punching style is the perfect counter to the type of style that Manny has. But having said that I don't think he has any business fighting at 147 at the age of 37. It's just too much for him. 140 is as far as he gets IMO.

Mosley hasn't really shown us all that much a long time now. Margarito was able to stay in the fight against Manny because he was so well conditioned and ready to withstand 12 rounds of hard boxing and throw 70 punches a round. Mosley is a better fighter than Margarito, but that was 3 years ago and unfortunately Mosley cannot condition himself to fight at the kind of pace Manny will set. At least Marquez knew how to neutralise the output somewhat, but Mosley hasn't been showing a ring IQ for a long time now. He gets frustrated, loads up and starts to wing his punches. Marquez would never do that.

Like CFH said, styles make fights. I just like the style of Marquez over that of Mosley when it comes to dealing with what Pac has to offer.

[LukeH]

Mosley beats Marquez, but Marquez gives Pacquiao a tougher fight than Mosley .

I think so too, boxing is really strange that way.

I just don't get this at all. How people can think Mosley is not finished enought to beat J M Marquez, but is too shot to beat Manny is such a weird contradiction.

I think BOTH fighters are a legitimate test for Manny.

Manny is far more to Mosley's liking than Floyd and Mora. I think Mosley would always have had trouble with Sergio Mora, and I don't think any version of Mosley beat Floyd either.

Pacquaio Mosley will be a very entertaining fight.

Marquez may yet get another shot if he keeps winning. But to me Marquez is scraping past guys like Diaz, Katsidis and Casamayor in wars, guys that Mosley would just destroy.

I think Marquez looks a much easier propositon for Pacquaio now at 147 than Mosley does.

And Manny sure as hell isn't going to move down another weight class to help Marquez out, and why should he? Mosley at 147 is a better fight than Marquez at 147 imo.

Do people disagree with this? Mosley is 'comfortable' at welterweight (I dont think he struggles to get there, but he does dry himself up alot). Marquez isn't. JMM is a boxer getting old and obviously can't/doesn't want to cut weight anymore, so he's fighting in higher divisions while chasing Pac.

[Majesty]

Mosley beats Marquez, but Marquez gives Pacquiao a tougher fight than Mosley .

I think so too, boxing is really strange that way.

I just don't get this at all. How people can think Mosley is not finished enought to beat J M Marquez, but is too shot to beat Manny is such a weird contradiction.

I think BOTH fighters are a legitimate test for Manny.

Manny is far more to Mosley's liking than Floyd and Mora. I think Mosley would always have had trouble with Sergio Mora, and I don't think any version of Mosley beat Floyd either.

Pacquaio Mosley will be a very entertaining fight.

Marquez may yet get another shot if he keeps winning. But to me Marquez is scraping past guys like Diaz, Katsidis and Casamayor in wars, guys that Mosley would just destroy.

I think Marquez looks a much easier propositon for Pacquaio now at 147 than Mosley does.

And Manny sure as hell isn't going to move down another weight class to help Marquez out, and why should he? Mosley at 147 is a better fight than Marquez at 147 imo.

Do people disagree with this? Mosley is 'comfortable' at welterweight (I dont think he struggles to get there, but he does dry himself up alot). Marquez isn't. JMM is a boxer getting old and obviously can't/doesn't want to cut weight anymore, so he's fighting in higher divisions while chasing Pac.

See I think the problem is people compare "Well Mosley is a better fight at 147 for Pacquiao than Marquez"

But the real thing is, Pacquiao would ONLY fight Marquez if it was at 147, even though he can easily make 140 and probably make 138 too since he barely makes 147 and usually many pounds under it on fight day. So basically Pacquiao isn't going to fight Marquez unless he has an advantage of some type.

If the question was "Marquez at 138" or "Mosley at 147" who gives Pacquiao a tougher fight, then Marquez would be the obvious answer and fight choice. But Manny doesn't want any part of Marquez south of 147. thus why people are comparing Marquez at 147 and say if Pacquiao MUST fight at 147, then Mosley will give him a better challenge then Marquez would by moving up and putting himself at such a disadvantage for the fight.

I think that's the initial point people want to get to, but initially lose it so they say "Mosley would beat Marquez at 147 so he is better for Manny at 147" ignoring the whole styles make fights thing, when what all this really comes down to, is the weight. Manny doesn't want Marquez at any class south of 147. So if it comes down to that, then yes Mosley is the better fight because Mosley won't be entering the fight at a disadvantage or outside of his weight class.

But in terms of WHO would give Pacquiao a tougher fight, Marquez would always give him a tougher fight than Mosley would, but Pacquiao has to get the gull to want to fight him at 138 for that to happen, and he doesn't. So Mosley is what people shall get.

[generalbulldog]

Ah, here's the thing though. Many people believed that JMM is a better fighter than Pac in terms of skills. Remember when JMM fought Floyd and many people including myself said it had nothing to do with weight but skills? Well if JMM is better than Pac in terms of skills why not challenge him there at WW?

And this whole Pac has to accommodate JMM is a load of rubbish. In business and politics, the party that has the leverage will use it. In boxing this is weight class, ring size, glove size, fight purse, split of other revenues, etc. Did De La Hoya and Leonard accommodate their foes? No. It was on their terms, the same applies here, it's on Manny's terms because he is 1/2 the face of boxing. Just like he had to meet all of Oscar's demands when they fought, so should JMM meet Pac's demands if they fight.

That's how it is and that's how the game is played, it has been that way for decades now.

[JT Rock]

Tell me the last time JMM cherry picked an opponent, or even had a spec of controversy over his choice competition? In his move up in weight chasing PAC, had he picked the lowest hanging fruit and the softest over blown promotional hyped dangerous "in house challenges"?

My question is, would Freddy Roach have accepted a fight at 147 with DLH, Mosely, Trinidad, Quartey, Vargas in the late 90's or early 2000's or would he try fighting old welters like Whitaker and Chavez? I think we know the answer. PAC has done great things in his career and outside the ring he is a heck of a good guy and enough great things can't be said..

But let's not be fooled into thinking all the risks he took weren't 100% controlled and measured.. Because there is no way in he'll he fights the Cotto at 147 who beat Mosely or the Mosely who beat Margarito or a prime Delahoya

[Kev]

Mosley beats Marquez, but Marquez gives Pacquiao a tougher fight than Mosley .

I think so too, boxing is really strange that way.

I just don't get this at all. How people can think Mosley is not finished enought to beat J M Marquez, but is too shot to beat Manny is such a weird contradiction.

I think BOTH fighters are a legitimate test for Manny.

Manny is far more to Mosley's liking than Floyd and Mora. I think Mosley would always have had trouble with Sergio Mora, and I don't think any version of Mosley beat Floyd either.

Pacquaio Mosley will be a very entertaining fight.

Marquez may yet get another shot if he keeps winning. But to me Marquez is scraping past guys like Diaz, Katsidis and Casamayor in wars, guys that Mosley would just destroy.

I think Marquez looks a much easier propositon for Pacquaio now at 147 than Mosley does.

And Manny sure as hell isn't going to move down another weight class to help Marquez out, and why should he? Mosley at 147 is a better fight than Marquez at 147 imo.

Do people disagree with this? Mosley is 'comfortable' at welterweight (I dont think he struggles to get there, but he does dry himself up alot). Marquez isn't. JMM is a boxer getting old and obviously can't/doesn't want to cut weight anymore, so he's fighting in higher divisions while chasing Pac.

See I think the problem is people compare "Well Mosley is a better fight at 147 for Pacquiao than Marquez"

But the real thing is, Pacquiao would ONLY fight Marquez if it was at 147, even though he can easily make 140 and probably make 138 too since he barely makes 147 and usually many pounds under it on fight day. So basically Pacquiao isn't going to fight Marquez unless he has an advantage of some type.

If the question was "Marquez at 138" or "Mosley at 147" who gives Pacquiao a tougher fight, then Marquez would be the obvious answer and fight choice. But Manny doesn't want any part of Marquez south of 147. thus why people are comparing Marquez at 147 and say if Pacquiao MUST fight at 147, then Mosley will give him a better challenge then Marquez would by moving up and putting himself at such a disadvantage for the fight.

I think that's the initial point people want to get to, but initially lose it so they say "Mosley would beat Marquez at 147 so he is better for Manny at 147" ignoring the whole styles make fights thing, when what all this really comes down to, is the weight. Manny doesn't want Marquez at any class south of 147. So if it comes down to that, then yes Mosley is the better fight because Mosley won't be entering the fight at a disadvantage or outside of his weight class.

But in terms of WHO would give Pacquiao a tougher fight, Marquez would always give him a tougher fight than Mosley would, but Pacquiao has to get the gull to want to fight him at 138 for that to happen, and he doesn't. So Mosley is what people shall get.

I think this is a ridiculous viewpoint frankly. Manny has had to move to where the challenges are so why not Marquez? When Manny fought Miguel Cotto, he negotiated a catchweight where Cotto gave up one single pound from his ideal fighting weight, and the haters wents nuts and screamed that Manny was forcing his opponents to lose on the scales.

Yet for Marquez they expect Manny to move down two divisions to give J Manuel the best possible chance and don't see the sheer hypocrisy of such a position.

Manny is fighting at welterweight now. He's the guy with holding all the cards so why in the world should he move back down to lightweight or light welter to give Marquez a rematch with a better chance? People literally hate on Manny for asking Cotto to drop a single pound, and believe he is weight draining his opponents, yet because he won't drop two entire divisions to face Marquez in a rematch they see him as forcing Marquez up to a weight where he is too heavy, thus losing on the scales again.

He cannot win. You expect Manny to be a yoyo who goes up and down the weight classes fighting opponents at the best weight for them.

He is the champion and the guy that everybody wants to beat. They want him they have to go to where he is.

[Majesty]

Mosley beats Marquez, but Marquez gives Pacquiao a tougher fight than Mosley .

I think so too, boxing is really strange that way.

I just don't get this at all. How people can think Mosley is not finished enought to beat J M Marquez, but is too shot to beat Manny is such a weird contradiction.

I think BOTH fighters are a legitimate test for Manny.

Manny is far more to Mosley's liking than Floyd and Mora. I think Mosley would always have had trouble with Sergio Mora, and I don't think any version of Mosley beat Floyd either.

Pacquaio Mosley will be a very entertaining fight.

Marquez may yet get another shot if he keeps winning. But to me Marquez is scraping past guys like Diaz, Katsidis and Casamayor in wars, guys that Mosley would just destroy.

I think Marquez looks a much easier propositon for Pacquaio now at 147 than Mosley does.

And Manny sure as hell isn't going to move down another weight class to help Marquez out, and why should he? Mosley at 147 is a better fight than Marquez at 147 imo.

Do people disagree with this? Mosley is 'comfortable' at welterweight (I dont think he struggles to get there, but he does dry himself up alot). Marquez isn't. JMM is a boxer getting old and obviously can't/doesn't want to cut weight anymore, so he's fighting in higher divisions while chasing Pac.

See I think the problem is people compare "Well Mosley is a better fight at 147 for Pacquiao than Marquez"

But the real thing is, Pacquiao would ONLY fight Marquez if it was at 147, even though he can easily make 140 and probably make 138 too since he barely makes 147 and usually many pounds under it on fight day. So basically Pacquiao isn't going to fight Marquez unless he has an advantage of some type.

If the question was "Marquez at 138" or "Mosley at 147" who gives Pacquiao a tougher fight, then Marquez would be the obvious answer and fight choice. But Manny doesn't want any part of Marquez south of 147. thus why people are comparing Marquez at 147 and say if Pacquiao MUST fight at 147, then Mosley will give him a better challenge then Marquez would by moving up and putting himself at such a disadvantage for the fight.

I think that's the initial point people want to get to, but initially lose it so they say "Mosley would beat Marquez at 147 so he is better for Manny at 147" ignoring the whole styles make fights thing, when what all this really comes down to, is the weight. Manny doesn't want Marquez at any class south of 147. So if it comes down to that, then yes Mosley is the better fight because Mosley won't be entering the fight at a disadvantage or outside of his weight class.

But in terms of WHO would give Pacquiao a tougher fight, Marquez would always give him a tougher fight than Mosley would, but Pacquiao has to get the gull to want to fight him at 138 for that to happen, and he doesn't. So Mosley is what people shall get.

I think this is a ridiculous viewpoint frankly. Manny has had to move to where the challenges are so why not Marquez? When Manny fought Miguel Cotto, he negotiated a catchweight where Cotto gave up one single pound from his ideal fighting weight, and the haters wents nuts and screamed that Manny was forcing his opponents to lose on the scales.

Yet for Marquez they expect Manny to move down two divisions to give J Manuel the best possible chance and don't see the sheer hypocrisy of such a position.

Manny is fighting at welterweight now. He's the guy with holding all the cards so why in the world should he move back down to lightweight or light welter to give Marquez a rematch with a better chance? People literally hate on Manny for asking Cotto to drop a single pound, and believe he is weight draining his opponents, yet because he won't drop two entire divisions to face Marquez in a rematch they see him as forcing Marquez up to a weight where he is too heavy, thus losing on the scales again.

He cannot win. You expect Manny to be a yoyo who goes up and down the weight classes fighting opponents at the best weight for them.

He is the champion and the guy that everybody wants to beat. They want him they have to go to where he is.

Manny had to over-eat to make 144, so he doesn't have to be a full welterweight, they use this to hype his fights like he can barely even make weight that high, yet if he is asked to move down in weight its a stretch for him? How does that make sense? All of his fights at welterweight, the astounding hype about them is that he barely makes 144, and that he not a welterweight, but if you say "why not a fight at 140 or even 138" its a stretch too far and a disadvantage for Pacquiao? How is that? he can move down with no problem while not disadvantaging himself and if anything he'd be fighting people more his size instead of the 'more dangerous bigger guys' as they are hyped. He can obviously make that weight, to say that Marquez "has" to move up to get a fight with him otherwise he is at a disadvantage is basically like saying that being on even terms with Marquez is a disadvantage for him.

THAT is not such a ridiculous notion, this is why he will not fight Marquez on even terms, because he is playing the same game other boxers are criticized for by wanting to make a fighter like Marquez come up to fight him instead of fighting him on even terms. If he is the "best" as people say he is for the love of challenge and number 1 p4p then shouldnt he be able to fight Marquez at any weight he can make without a disadvantage? You can't tell me Pacquiao can't make 138 or at LEAST 140 and be weight drained. it's just the simple fact that on even terms, Marquez is a bigger problem for Pacquiao and he doesn't want to take that risk given the position he's in and the demands he can make. That's just how it is. And he should be criticized like the rest of the boxers that have been in his position and been guilty of the same things.

[Julius Rain]

Mosley beats Marquez, but Marquez gives Pacquiao a tougher fight than Mosley .

I think so too, boxing is really strange that way.

I just don't get this at all. How people can think Mosley is not finished enought to beat J M Marquez, but is too shot to beat Manny is such a weird contradiction.

I think BOTH fighters are a legitimate test for Manny.

Manny is far more to Mosley's liking than Floyd and Mora. I think Mosley would always have had trouble with Sergio Mora, and I don't think any version of Mosley beat Floyd either.

Pacquaio Mosley will be a very entertaining fight.

Marquez may yet get another shot if he keeps winning. But to me Marquez is scraping past guys like Diaz, Katsidis and Casamayor in wars, guys that Mosley would just destroy.

I think Marquez looks a much easier propositon for Pacquaio now at 147 than Mosley does.

And Manny sure as hell isn't going to move down another weight class to help Marquez out, and why should he? Mosley at 147 is a better fight than Marquez at 147 imo.

Do people disagree with this? Mosley is 'comfortable' at welterweight (I dont think he struggles to get there, but he does dry himself up alot). Marquez isn't. JMM is a boxer getting old and obviously can't/doesn't want to cut weight anymore, so he's fighting in higher divisions while chasing Pac.

See I think the problem is people compare "Well Mosley is a better fight at 147 for Pacquiao than Marquez"

But the real thing is, Pacquiao would ONLY fight Marquez if it was at 147, even though he can easily make 140 and probably make 138 too since he barely makes 147 and usually many pounds under it on fight day. So basically Pacquiao isn't going to fight Marquez unless he has an advantage of some type.

If the question was "Marquez at 138" or "Mosley at 147" who gives Pacquiao a tougher fight, then Marquez would be the obvious answer and fight choice. But Manny doesn't want any part of Marquez south of 147. thus why people are comparing Marquez at 147 and say if Pacquiao MUST fight at 147, then Mosley will give him a better challenge then Marquez would by moving up and putting himself at such a disadvantage for the fight.

I think that's the initial point people want to get to, but initially lose it so they say "Mosley would beat Marquez at 147 so he is better for Manny at 147" ignoring the whole styles make fights thing, when what all this really comes down to, is the weight. Manny doesn't want Marquez at any class south of 147. So if it comes down to that, then yes Mosley is the better fight because Mosley won't be entering the fight at a disadvantage or outside of his weight class.

But in terms of WHO would give Pacquiao a tougher fight, Marquez would always give him a tougher fight than Mosley would, but Pacquiao has to get the gull to want to fight him at 138 for that to happen, and he doesn't. So Mosley is what people shall get.

You guys are giving JMM way too much credit for beating the guys he had recently.

Are there any fighter that JMM recently fought that Pac wouldn't smash? Now think what chance would JMM have against the guys pac recently fought? Dont say well weight is going to determine results. No just think if JMM would also do what Pac has done. Do you think JMM will still be in the mix, if JMM even tried to do what Pac did and win at 140,145,147,150? Now think, if pac would fight the same guys JMM had fought recently, what chance do you think those guys will have against pac? None.

I think JMM is only in the mix now because he continues to win over guys Pac would assault to death. I would really like to see JMM try and come up to 140 and get a win there over anybody let alone against the best p4p fighter today.

Also why would you expect pac to come down for JMM at 138? What chance did you think that happening with floyd then?

Honestly the weight shouldn't matter with this fight - JMM vs Pac III. People just know for a fact that pac would demolish JMM anywhere above 140. So they dont even want to see that, they preferto see it below 141. Where they believe JMM has a chance.

[:::PSL:::]

Why 138 Majesty? Why not just make it 135 for 5th lineal belt?

I don't like Pac-Mosely matchup either. But it is what it is now. And the funny thing is, no matter how people will bitch about it... it will still earn a million ppv buys. Lol





Anyways. Arum is a scum of the earth. But I kinda agree with him on this one... Arum: Berto-Marquez Should Happen For Pacquiao Shot