Should Bin Laden have been taken alive?

[p4pking]

Yes, it seems that the woman was not his wife.

Leading article: The nagging questions that refuse to go away - Leading Articles, Opinion - The Independent

It appears false that he used human shields or died a coward though. He was unarmed and from what I have been reading it seems as though he could very well have been taken alive. To shoot him dead when a viable alternative was readily available, just sounds so wrong to me.

I am aware that my views are probably not in line with a lot of others. On conservative newpaper message boards the most typical messages are pretty much as follows: "He caused 9-11. I hope he burns in hell". I would love to see the hard evidence that he actually caused 9-11 or that there is a hell. Those are minor quibbles though.

Well first off regardless of the fashion he died it was as a coward, among many other terrible things. I no longer pretend to have any idea what his role in 9-11 actually was, it's very possible he was nowhere near the mastermind made out to be, but there is also no doubt he has orchestrated many other terrorist attacks and was utterly scum. I just don't see how on earth you could feel justice would have been better served by actually putting him to trial? Where would this have taken place? Obviously they would just kill him anyways, and he would bask in all the attention he received in the lead up as a martyr. Why give him any more time in the limelight for christs sake, not to mention dealing with Pakistan in the lead up to it all. Saddam Husseins show trial was bad enough, and the US was already occupying Iraq making it possible to try him there, however absurd it was. Would they have set up a tribunal in Pakistan, let him hire the best lawyers he could and give him months in the limelight praising Allah and inspiring more radical sentiments? Any way this happened it was not going to sit well with the Arab world, they did it the easiest way possible and I'm glad for that.

[p4pking]

Hahah CFH where do you find pictures like that? I agree this thread could get really nasty and probably isn't worth debating, but don't feel Miles or I have posted anything remotely uncivilized thus far.

[CFH]

Hahah CFH where do you find pictures like that? I agree this thread could get really nasty and probably isn't worth debating, but don't feel Miles or I have posted anything remotely uncivilized thus far.

I was looking for this pic, but when I did a Google search I was the other pic and, obviously, found it full of awesome:




And you guys are being perfectly civil, I've just seen enough of these threads to know where they lead.

[Gandalf]

You are right CFH, they usually go off in predictable directions. We could probably compile a "make your own Saddo boxing thread" program and all the appropriate parts will just compile themselves. I anticipate Lyle emerging as the 25th poster in this thread and Bilbo posting 73 times. There is a 7% chance of me announcing that I am leaving on page 17.

[Gandalf]

Yes, it seems that the woman was not his wife.

Leading article: The nagging questions that refuse to go away - Leading Articles, Opinion - The Independent

It appears false that he used human shields or died a coward though. He was unarmed and from what I have been reading it seems as though he could very well have been taken alive. To shoot him dead when a viable alternative was readily available, just sounds so wrong to me.

I am aware that my views are probably not in line with a lot of others. On conservative newpaper message boards the most typical messages are pretty much as follows: "He caused 9-11. I hope he burns in hell". I would love to see the hard evidence that he actually caused 9-11 or that there is a hell. Those are minor quibbles though.

Well first off regardless of the fashion he died it was as a coward, among many other terrible things. I no longer pretend to have any idea what his role in 9-11 actually was, it's very possible he was nowhere near the mastermind made out to be, but there is also no doubt he has orchestrated many other terrorist attacks and was utterly scum. I just don't see how on earth you could feel justice would have been better served by actually putting him to trial? Where would this have taken place? Obviously they would just kill him anyways, and he would bask in all the attention he received in the lead up as a martyr. Why give him any more time in the limelight for christs sake, not to mention dealing with Pakistan in the lead up to it all. Saddam Husseins show trial was bad enough, and the US was already occupying Iraq making it possible to try him there, however absurd it was. Would they have set up a tribunal in Pakistan, let him hire the best lawyers he could and give him months in the limelight praising Allah and inspiring more radical sentiments? Any way this happened it was not going to sit well with the Arab world, they did it the easiest way possible and I'm glad for that.

To assasinate someone is an act of terrorism in itself and to do it on sovereign soil quite outrageous. It is just that it is ordered by those who are supposedly legitimate. To just deal with problems using a trigger is self defeating because it shows us as being on the same moral level as the so called terrorists. You bring them to trial and produce your evidence. If you don't do that then you cannot claim the higher ground and it seems that America has been going down this slippery slope a long time now. The reaction to Wikileaks, the treatment of Bradley Manning and now this, suggest a moral decay and these are just issues from the past year or so.

[p4pking]

You make a very good point for sure Miles, fully understood. I just feel that in this case a judicial process would have done more harm than good globally, I guess I have a pretty slippery foothold on that though. Also Pakistan is about as sovereign as Botswana these days by everything I've been reading. They are supposed to be an American ally, and were less cooperative than practically any neutral country would have been in dealing with this by all accounts. They have been receiving hundreds of millions of dollars every year from America and couldn't bring us a 6'6 arab on a dialysis machine living a mile away from their top Military academy. It just stinks really.

[Gandalf]

You make a very good point for sure Miles, fully understood. I just feel that in this case a judicial process would have done more harm than good globally, I guess I have a pretty slippery foothold on that though. Also Pakistan is about as sovereign as Botswana these days by everything I've been reading. They are supposed to be an American ally, and were less cooperative than practically any neutral country would have been in dealing with this by all accounts. They have been receiving hundreds of millions of dollars every year from America and couldn't bring us a 6'6 arab on a dialysis machine living a mile away from their top Military academy. It just stinks really.

I think he should have been taken alive, but have a feeling I might be in the minority. I am curious to know what other people think really, so am going to let this thread run for a few pages and just be a casual observer for a bit.

I agree that it was quite amazing for him to be located where he was. It seems all the local residents were equally surprised. Must have been an eye opener to find out that Bin Laden had been living next door for several years. Either Pakistan really is that inept in terms of security or Bin Laden had help. You would have to assume the latter.

[p4pking]

You make a very good point for sure Miles, fully understood. I just feel that in this case a judicial process would have done more harm than good globally, I guess I have a pretty slippery foothold on that though. Also Pakistan is about as sovereign as Botswana these days by everything I've been reading. They are supposed to be an American ally, and were less cooperative than practically any neutral country would have been in dealing with this by all accounts. They have been receiving hundreds of millions of dollars every year from America and couldn't bring us a 6'6 arab on a dialysis machine living a mile away from their top Military academy. It just stinks really.

I think he should have been taken alive, but have a feeling I might be in the minority. I am curious to know what other people think really, so am going to let this thread run for a few pages and just be a casual observer for a bit.

I agree that it was quite amazing for him to be located where he was. It seems all the local residents were equally surprised. Must have been an eye opener to find out that Bin Laden had been living next door for several years. Either Pakistan really is that inept in terms of security or Bin Laden had help. You would have to assume the latter.

I was watching an interview on TV yesterday with some journalist who made the point that Pakistani police are VERY strict in dealing with foreigners. If you move there and build yourself a house, you can bet damn well that they will knock on your door to find out who you are, in his words. It's ridiculous to think that Pakistani officials didn't know in my opinion.

[Mark TKO]

i would have liked to have seen him taken alive and suffer in captivity for a bit - then tortured and killed by Michael Madsen on a live tv free ppv event sometime in September.

But alas this was not to be.

We will never know the truth of what happened in that 'firefight' but like fuck did he deserve a fair trial so lets not even go there.

And yes the Pakistan govt knew he was there for sure.

The body photos should be released though to silence the doubters. Stand him up by a tape meausre as he was about 6 foot 6 or something ridiculous wasnt he.

or stand him next to Vitali Klitschko

[Kev]

He wasn't killed at all. He's been dead 9 years.

The Bin Ladens are a wealthy family, in cahoots with the leading American familes and a part of the Carlye group. This is all factual, google it.

Osama died of kidney failure in 2002, too soo for the US who were using him as the face of fear and a pretext for invading Iraq and Afghanistan. So they did not report his death, and preferred to keep him alive.

These kind of lies are something they have a history of doing, and I invite you to look up the proven factual fabrications of the Gulf of Tonkin incident, where they faked an attack on the USS Maddox by the Vietnamese in order to get justification to go to war with them, and Operation Northwoods where they planned attacks on their own people, including shooting down planes, to blame on the Cubans. This went as high as the US Army's chief of staff, and was only ruled out by JFK, who it has to be said, was assassinated in suspicious circumstances, maybe for refusing to carry out the whims of those really in charge.

Already Obama has covered himself in case of future revelations by revealing he did not actually witness the assassination live on cam in the control room himself. They have no body because they threw it in the ocean. They took no photo's becauase he's too badly mutilated, therefore the only thing we have to go on is their word.

Sorry but after Vietnam, Northwoods, Pearl Harbour, Saddam's WMD's, their word doesn't mean a whole lot.

They were just waiting for the best timing to announce his death and now with revolutions going on all around the Arab world and a very different Middle East emerging, it made sense to get rid of the face of fear and end the post 911 era. They will create a new story for the Arab world in the coming months and years.

What about my thread sounds so absurd? All you have is you assured belief that America wouldn't act in this way, even though it has been proven and documented that they do. They have given no evidence whatsoever that Bin Laded was killed, or that he has been alive for the last 10 years.

He made one video in 2004, contradicting his earlier denials of being involved in 911 and that's all we've heard of him. They claim they have a new video now, I guess they need to create the illusion he was still active and a threat.

Open your minds people, and start looking into this.

[El Kabong]

Bilbo stop being a douchebag

And hell no why would we want Bin Laden alive? THAT would incite attacks and kidnappings etc with the crazy muslims wanting to free their zealot leader.

OBL got what he deserved...better than he deserved actually.

[Spicoli]

I hope he shit himself badly