Who else could replicate Haye's performance?

[Dark Lord Al]

I always thought Calderon could beat Paulie Malignaggi. Valuev? Maybe but he would have to be real negative.

haha absolutely.

A lot would depend on whether the inevitable knockdowns were rule as legitimate or pushes.

But I think if Calderon just wanted to stay away for 12 rounds he probably could.

If guys like kessler ,Calderon and any other active fighters on your list , actually thought Valuev was that easy to beat , ( prior to the Haye fight ) then why didnt they step up and fight him.
We all know the money is with the HW's.
Basically yes , Valuev was poor , but if he was that easy to beat , then Kessler etc had the chance to step up and challenge him.
They didn't , so why did they not Bilbo please explain why ?

[OumaFan]

I've seen some of the fight (Skel's gif, etc.) and it doesn't look like Valuev takes a punch very well, so some of those guys on the list could probably not just win but stop him, Calderon doesn't knock down tiny people, half-humans, allegedly real people, so he'd have to work for it but its possible.

[Jimanuel Boogustus]

I've seen some of the fight (Skel's gif, etc.) and it doesn't look like Valuev takes a punch very well, so some of those guys on the list could probably not just win but stop him, Calderon doesn't knock down tiny people, half-humans, allegedly real people, so he'd have to work for it but its possible.

I'm sorry but Holyfield, even at this stage of the game, must have enough power to wobble someone who 'doesn't take a punch very well' and he hit Valuev flush with big overhand rights a good number of times yet Valuev never blinked.

With Haye, i'm not sold on his ability.. or he's chances in a fair number of match up's... but this IMO, he's power is 100% legit.

[Kev]

I always thought Calderon could beat Paulie Malignaggi. Valuev? Maybe but he would have to be real negative.

haha absolutely.

A lot would depend on whether the inevitable knockdowns were rule as legitimate or pushes.

But I think if Calderon just wanted to stay away for 12 rounds he probably could.

If guys like kessler ,Calderon and any other active fighters on your list , actually thought Valuev was that easy to beat , ( prior to the Haye fight ) then why didnt they step up and fight him.
We all know the money is with the HW's.
Basically yes , Valuev was poor , but if he was that easy to beat , then Kessler etc had the chance to step up and challenge him.
They didn't , so why did they not Bilbo please explain why ?

There is a minimum weight limit which is why they wouldn't move up and it would massively interfere with a boxers career (see how moving up to heavyweight effecitvely ruined Roy Jones) but there is no reason why any of those fighters mentioned couldn't last 12 rounds with Valuev.

John Ruiz came desperately close to beating Valuev twice, the first time he was blatently robbed yet this same Ruiz was beaten handily (completely schooled) by two middleweights in Toney and Jones.

A prime Roy Jones would dance rings around Valuev literally, the Toney that beat Holyfield would just beat him up.

Calzaghe is smart enough and fast enough to keep out way and Bernard Hopkins wouldn't be troubled by him at all.

Of the fighters I mentioned I'd be amazed if Valuev could stop ANY of them and I think most would do enough to win.

He's just shockingly poor. His size isn't an advantage to him because he's slow to the point of almost being immobile and he hits pathetically light for his size.

When was the last time he KO'd anybody? Even unknowns like Francois Bergerom can hang with Valuev.

He's only fought C grade heavyweights. Neither Chagaev, Ruiz or Holyfield were remotely near to being players in the heavyweight scene yet they represent Valuevs biggest opponents.

We saw how Chagaev did against a real heavyweight earlier this year and Holyfield has been a walking corpse for years. Certainly Ruiz and Holyfield are just journeymen at this stage in their careers and Chagaev is not really top 10 he just got promoted by cirtue of fighting Valuev.

Even Matt Skelton gave a good account of himself against Chagaev which says it all about how dangerous he was. Marty Rogan knocked Skleton the fuck out.

Valuev = pants.

[ninjaspy3]

I think the argument might be flawed. While the smaller guys on that list would be able to out manuver Valuev easily, I seriously doubt their ability to actually hit him enough to win. And if they did hit Valuev, Im pretty sure he wouldnt notice much.

[CFH]

This thread has some real entertainment potential.

I think the answer we're looking for is Linford Christie.

I don't know who that is.

[Mikkel_K]

There is a minimum weight limit which is why they wouldn't move up and it would massively interfere with a boxers career (see how moving up to heavyweight effecitvely ruined Roy Jones) but there is no reason why any of those fighters mentioned couldn't last 12 rounds with Valuev.

John Ruiz came desperately close to beating Valuev twice, the first time he was blatently robbed yet this same Ruiz was beaten handily (completely schooled) by two middleweights in Toney and Jones.

A prime Roy Jones would dance rings around Valuev literally, the Toney that beat Holyfield would just beat him up.

I was actually just about to post on that weight limit, as many of the fighters named would likely be much less effective (read: helluva lot slower) at 200+.

Imagine Ivan Calderon weighing in at 200

Other than that, I agree. Any decent cruiser with smartness and stamina should be able to beat Valuev the same way. Hell, any decent LHW could probably move up (RJJ style) and win as well.

[Kev]

There is a minimum weight limit which is why they wouldn't move up and it would massively interfere with a boxers career (see how moving up to heavyweight effecitvely ruined Roy Jones) but there is no reason why any of those fighters mentioned couldn't last 12 rounds with Valuev.

John Ruiz came desperately close to beating Valuev twice, the first time he was blatently robbed yet this same Ruiz was beaten handily (completely schooled) by two middleweights in Toney and Jones.

A prime Roy Jones would dance rings around Valuev literally, the Toney that beat Holyfield would just beat him up.

I was actually just about to post on that weight limit, as many of the fighters named would likely be much less effective (read: helluva lot slower) at 200+.

Imagine Ivan Calderon weighing in at 200

Other than that, I agree. Any decent cruiser with smartness and stamina should be able to beat Valuev the same way. Hell, any decent LHW could probably move up (RJJ style) and win as well.

Yeah my point isn't about lightweight boxers bulking up and trying to fight Valuev though, I'm just asking if they could survive?

I mean put a Bernard Hopkins weighing in at maybe 180 lbs how would he do? He may not land enough to win but I have no doubt he could survive the 12 rounds and not get touched.

That is scandalous though, I mean a real heavyweight a Klitschko, a Lewis, Ali, Foreman, Tyson etc would kill B Hop. But Valuev is soooo slow that if somebody wanted to just survive and not get hit, most of the lower weight guys could do it.

I really think even guys like Floyd and Mosely weighing in at 150 lbs could go 12 rounds if they just tried to survive. How would he hit them? Yes they would have to run the whole night and fight with Haye like negativtiy but my point is I believe most of them would come through unscathed.

You couldn't say that about practically any other heavyweight in history.

Hayes win was entirely expected, it was spectactular, impressive or even acceptable imo. He should have dominated every round but instead he fought a fight that apart from rattling him in the last round could have gone either way.

Ruiz, Holyfield and Chagaev all did a better job imo than Haye.

[OumaFan]

I doubt Calderon would bulk up past 112 or so. Why would he?

[Kev]

I doubt Calderon would bulk up past 112 or so. Why would he?

You're cracking me up with these Calderon quips Ouma.

I'd LOVE to see this fight. Make it a really big ring so Calderon has room to run and watch Valuev aimlessly amble around like a giant zombie from Shaun of the Dead whilst Calderon just darts in between his legs and dances around him.

If they made below the belt shots legal for this fight only Calderon could win.

[gest12645]

let's not over due this, Valuev is shit but he's big. he ALMOST got a draw with Haye and most those guys wouldn't do it

[amat]

I agree %100 percent with Hattonthehammer's post. It's completely impossible for any of these guys to actually win fights with Valuev. Valuev is heavy like timber and moves forward almost constantly! Never have the terms "unstoppable force" and "immovable object" come together so perfectly to describe a Heavyweight champion (always in memory) of our era. He's simply huge and because of this can literally only move forward in one directtion with very direct and honest approach to his opponent. Because of this constant stomping forward, the ring generalship department of scoring fights is always in his favor. One time back when he fought Jameel McCline, in the time it took Valuev to take one monstrous step straight ahead, McCline had shuffled his feet over a dozen times whilst throwing only 2 punches. It was a crude attempt to distract an eye less keen then mine on what the sport actually was. Because of all McCline's excessive foot movements, I had him down 6 points entering the 3rd round and all his negativity was only costing him more in the third before his knee exploded out of it's socket. It had been fooled into thinking it was entering a fight but McCline seemed not to want to use his fists. His knees couldn't handle it. Don't tell me that wasn't an impressive victory.

McCline was a monster-man himself and even he costs himself the fight with his feet. Calzaghe is much to small of a man to beat Valuev! Could you imagine how much more negative he would have to be?!?!

I think if Valuev can throw like 19 punches in all these fights combined it should be enough for him to win every round.

[WelshDevilRob]

Bilbo you have lost the plot again, my friend.

I can see some logic behind the madness but to post it is a clear sign of insanity. (I mean that as a friend)

Joe Calzaghe said he could beat Wladimir Klitschko and most rubbished his thoughts.

Drop Valuev or Wladimir in a cell with Ike Ibeabuchi and neither comes out alive.

[Kev]

I agree %100 percent with Hattonthehammer's post. It's completely impossible for any of these guys to actually win fights with Valuev. Valuev is heavy like timber and moves forward almost constantly! Never have the terms "unstoppable force" and "immovable object" come together so perfectly to describe a Heavyweight champion (always in memory) of our era. He's simply huge and because of this can literally only move forward in one directtion with very direct and honest approach to his opponent. Because of this constant stomping forward, the ring generalship department of scoring fights is always in his favor. One time back when he fought Jameel McCline, in the time it took Valuev to take one monstrous step straight ahead, McCline had shuffled his feet over a dozen times whilst throwing only 2 punches. It was a crude attempt to distract an eye less keen then mine on what the sport actually was. Because of all McCline's excessive foot movements, I had him down 6 points entering the 3rd round and all his negativity was only costing him more in the third before his knee exploded out of it's socket. It had been fooled into thinking it was entering a fight but McCline seemed not to want to use his fists. His knees couldn't handle it. Don't tell me that wasn't an impressive victory.

McCline was a monster-man himself and even he costs himself the fight with his feet. Calzaghe is much to small of a man to beat Valuev! Could you imagine how much more negative he would have to be?!?!

I think if Valuev can throw like 19 punches in all these fights combined it should be enough for him to win every round.

But do you think Valuev would stop any of these guys is the question?

Basically Haye ran away for 12 rounds and jogged passed with a light punch to sound each bell.

Of the fighters I mentioned which of those do you think Valuev would stop inside the distance if they only tried to survive?

I honestly don't think Valuev would land a punch on some of those guys. Sure they wouldn't be able to hit him either, but they would go 12 rounds which they could never do with a decent heavyweight.

Valuev is a freak show.

Any top 10 heavyweight could beat him easily. His best opposition has only been second rate fighters, (an ancient Evander, Ruiz, Chagaev) and in my opinion they all beat him handily.

The Klitschko's would kill him, and most of the other top guys could beat him easily imo.

Someone said earlier that everyone looks bad against Valuev. I disagree, I think he has made very average or past it fighters look like almost world champions.

Haye, Holyfield, Ruiz and Chagaev get dominated against the real champs, against Valuev they almost won.

[Kev]

Bilbo you have lost the plot again, my friend.

I can see some logic behind the madness but to post it is a clear sign of insanity. (I mean that as a friend)

Joe Calzaghe said he could beat Wladimir Klitschko and most rubbished his thoughts.

Drop Valuev or Wladimir in a cell with Ike Ibeabuchi and neither comes out alive.

ha yeah I agree Wlad would kill Joe. But Valuev just wouldnt land on him if Calzaghe chose to keep away.

Maybe these guys wouldn't do enough to beat him, but they would all comfortably survive if thats all they wanted to do, and imo that is shameful because they would get torn up against a decent real heavyweight champ.

Do you think Valuev would knock out Hopkins, Calzaghe, Adamek, Ward, even Floyd or Mosely if they were as negative as Haye?