What does Hopkins have that Jones doesn't?

[VG_Addict]

What if Jones fought Benn, Michalczewski, Eubank, Collins, and Rocchigiani?

[Master]

What if Jones fought Michalczewski, Eubank, Collins, and Rocchigiani?

Dariuz is the biggest omission.

[El Kabong]

Boxing would have been SOOOOO much different had RJJ never been robbed in the Seoul Olympics. He wouldn't have had the fear of travelling and worries of having to have a KO to win outside the US.

RJJ had the talent to KO or shut out ANYONE over 12 rounds in his prime. He was just an amazing talent, head and shoulders over everyone else.

[Master]

Every fighter has a coulda, would a, should a, but Roy was the man to beat and it was the other top fighters that did not fight him.

[chris6878]

hopkins is always in shape. He never gets out of shape. He also eats much better than jones and just takes care of his body. Diet is key

[Beanflicker]

Well let's be fair to Roy, the question should be what did Hopkins and Archie Moore have that no one else did? It's pretty standard practice for guys to be washed up in their mid 30s.

SRR in his mid 30s was losing to guys that wouldn't have been able to hold his jockstrap in his prime. By 35, Ray Leonard looked like an old man getting battered around by Terry Norris. Pernell was washed up by that age (also due to the coke I'm sure). Ali looked like a shell of himself and was losing to Leon Spinks.

Bhop is just a freak of nature.

[El Kabong]

Hopkins had a style built for the long run....Roy Jones Jr.'s style was built on reflexes, speed, timing, things that fade with time. Hopkins ALWAYS fought in an ugly manner more difficult to hit clean than most but he was always consistent with his attack and he's a strong guy. Holyfield had a similar way about him. Andre Ward has a similar way about him. Wladimir Klitschko could even be mentioned in this group (though he knocks out many more guys than the others) as it looks as his style could have him sticking around for as long as he likes.


RJJ never adapted his style to his age...not even sure if that would have been possible with the way he fought. Too herky, jerky, too much energy consumption, too much reliance on speed and reflexes.



I don't think there was a fighter in his era that could have really pushed him to the brink from 160-175....maybe cruiserweight, but you just don't know. There were certainly heavyweights that could have hurt him just due to their pure size advantages. Benn, Eubank, Collins, Michalczewski, Jirov....they couldn't have taken him and in his pomp Joe Calzaghe would have been 0 match for him. The guys that would have had chances would likely have been very small heavyweights, the super tough cruiserweights, or the extremely talented all-time greats.

[mikeeod]

Every fighter has a coulda, would a, should a, but Roy was the man to beat and it was the other top fighters that did not fight him.

I disagree with that statement. You can't force a guy to get in the ring with you. If he had missed a few guys only throughout his career, then I would agree with you. Great fighters test themselves and prove themselves against other great fighters. Just look at the competition that Whitaker, Tito, Oscar, Shane, Hopkins, Holyfield, Lewis...etc. took on throughout their career.

Roy isn't a bum and I don't think that he was scared of anyone. I do think that he is a smart man and was more interested in making the most money for the least amount of risk and not with securing his legacy. While I agree that the guy was a supreme talent and could have beaten or at least given trouble to any fighter in history, he was at fault for not making some of those big fights happen and his legacy will suffer because of it.

[mikeeod]

Hopkins had a style built for the long run....Roy Jones Jr.'s style was built on reflexes, speed, timing, things that fade with time. Hopkins ALWAYS fought in an ugly manner more difficult to hit clean than most but he was always consistent with his attack and he's a strong guy. Holyfield had a similar way about him. Andre Ward has a similar way about him. Wladimir Klitschko could even be mentioned in this group (though he knocks out many more guys than the others) as it looks as his style could have him sticking around for as long as he likes.


RJJ never adapted his style to his age...not even sure if that would have been possible with the way he fought. Too herky, jerky, too much energy consumption, too much reliance on speed and reflexes.



I don't think there was a fighter in his era that could have really pushed him to the brink from 160-175....maybe cruiserweight, but you just don't know. There were certainly heavyweights that could have hurt him just due to their pure size advantages. Benn, Eubank, Collins, Michalczewski, Jirov....they couldn't have taken him and in his pomp Joe Calzaghe would have been 0 match for him. The guys that would have had chances would likely have been very small heavyweights, the super tough cruiserweights, or the extremely talented all-time greats.

You are entitled to your opinion, but I disagree with you. We don't know how some of those other guys would have done vs. Roy. Everyone was sure G-Man would blow out Benn. Tyson was unbeatable and had zero chance to lose to Douglas. Donald Curry was the next Ray Robinson and unbeatable. Shane Mosely was on his way to being an ATG and Vernon Forrest was just going to be a speed bump on his way to greatness.

Styles make fights, and if you notice, Roy often avoided long, lanky, slick, elite boxers like Nunn and Frankie Liles, and very durable, rough, aggressive fighters like G-Man, Darius...etc. Glenn Johnson said something interesting when he beat Roy (who was past his prime at the time), and that was that most guys were intimidated by Roy throwing back and were afraid to jab, especially when close, to negate Roy's speed advantages and keep him pinned to the ropes. Benn was a HUGE puncher and actually a clever fighter later in his career and while I would DEFINITELY favor Roy in that fight, you are kidding yourself if you think he stood no chance to win.

I think that Roy was a great talent and great fighter. I also think that Roy was made to look more dominant and his fans exaggerate his greatness and invincibility because of the weak level of competition he faced between the Toney and Tarver fights (sorry, Virgil Hill was washed up, Mcallum was washed up, Montell was not an elite fighter, and Ruiz was a joke).

[Master]

Every fighter has a coulda, would a, should a, but Roy was the man to beat and it was the other top fighters that did not fight him.

I disagree with that statement. You can't force a guy to get in the ring with you. If he had missed a few guys only throughout his career, then I would agree with you. Great fighters test themselves and prove themselves against other great fighters. Just look at the competition that Whitaker, Tito, Oscar, Shane, Hopkins, Holyfield, Lewis...etc. took on throughout their career.

Roy isn't a bum and I don't think that he was scared of anyone. I do think that he is a smart man and was more interested in making the most money for the least amount of risk and not with securing his legacy. While I agree that the guy was a supreme talent and could have beaten or at least given trouble to any fighter in history, he was at fault for not making some of those big fights happen and his legacy will suffer because of it.

Roy beat B Hop and Toney who are great fighters, he unified all the belts at light heavy and the top fighters should come to him. I do not even consider Roy to be a great light heavy but would at super middle if he stayed long enough.

[mikeeod]

Every fighter has a coulda, would a, should a, but Roy was the man to beat and it was the other top fighters that did not fight him.

I disagree with that statement. You can't force a guy to get in the ring with you. If he had missed a few guys only throughout his career, then I would agree with you. Great fighters test themselves and prove themselves against other great fighters. Just look at the competition that Whitaker, Tito, Oscar, Shane, Hopkins, Holyfield, Lewis...etc. took on throughout their career.

Roy isn't a bum and I don't think that he was scared of anyone. I do think that he is a smart man and was more interested in making the most money for the least amount of risk and not with securing his legacy. While I agree that the guy was a supreme talent and could have beaten or at least given trouble to any fighter in history, he was at fault for not making some of those big fights happen and his legacy will suffer because of it.

Roy beat B Hop and Toney who are great fighters, he unified all the belts at light heavy and the top fighters should come to him. I do not even consider Roy to be a great light heavy but would at super middle if he stayed long enough.

The Hop that Roy beat in 1993 was green and no where near the fighter he became in the late 90's and early 2000's to mid 2000's. Hop was tough, but not an elite fighter at that point, just like Roy was no longer elite when Hop beat him in their rematch. Toney was Roy's best win, and only win over a p4p ranked (at the time of the fight) guy.

Roy also never unified all the belts at light heavy, Darius was the WBO and lineal champ. It is hard to say which weight was better for Roy, in my opinion, because he had a great win over Toney at 168, but overall weaker challengers to his title (Vinny Paz!!!). At 175 Roy didn't have that great, signature win over a top p4p guy, but he fought slightly better competition overall than what he had at 168.

I always thought 168 was the perfect weight for Roy, as he had one punch power and was a good sized 168 pounder. At 175 he was on the smaller side (until he fought Ruiz, then he looked HUGE!), and had enough power to shake and discourage guys, but not blow them out as consistently, although the Virgil Hill and Montell stoppages were impressive and spectacular.

[generalbulldog]

Speaking of Hopkins-Jones, did you know that in their 2nd fight Jones basically made 0 money? Yes, that's right, while Hopkins and Goldenboy made $3.5 million.

• Yahoo! Sports columnist Kevin Iole reported that Jones probably didn't make any money for the fight. He wrote:

The sad thing about the fight is that Jones won't make anything. Let's assume for a second that the 6,792 in the building actually paid for their seats (we know that's not true) and that the seats averaged $300 a ticket (a figure higher than reality). That would mean the gate was $2 million. If the expenses to rent the building and promote the fight were $1 million, that means $1 million is left. Now, let's figure it sold 100,000 pay-per-views at $49.95 apiece. That's about $5 million. They have to split 50 percent of that with the cable and satellite operators, so that leaves $2.498 million for themselves. Add the $1 million from the gate and the $2.498 million from the pay-per-view and you have $3.498 million in profit. Given that the contract called for the first $3.5 million in profit to go to Hopkins and Golden Boy, it's almost certain Jones fought for nothing.

Bernard Hopkins vs. Roy Jones Jr. (2nd meeting) - Boxrec Boxing Encyclopaedia

[Beanflicker]

I do not even consider Roy to be a great light heavy but would at super middle if he stayed long enough.

Roy not a great LHW? Didn't he spend 7 or 8 years there just murdering everyone?

[Beanflicker]

Bottom line, Roy beats ANYBODY IN THE HISTORY OF BOXING from 168-175.

When people actually pick guys like Bob Foster (and I love Bob Foster) to beat Roy, I wish I could spit in their faces.

Unfortunately Roy will forever be underrated because of the last 10 years he spend pissing away his legacy, but prime Roy Jones is untouchable.

[VG_Addict]

I do not even consider Roy to be a great light heavy but would at super middle if he stayed long enough.

Roy not a great LHW? Didn't he spend 7 or 8 years there just murdering everyone?

Not everyone. He missed a couple like Michalczewski and Rocchigiani.

I also would have liked to have seen him at CW, against Juan Carlos Gomez and Jirov.