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Honestly JMM and Guzman are the greatest threats. Who else comes to mind in the 135lb division.Quote:
Originally Posted by GAME
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Originally Posted by PavlikI read somewhere Arum said PAC might fight Valero in November, that's something good right:)Quote:
Originally Posted by GAME
Its better than Diaz but I can think of alot of better fighters Pac should be fighting
Campbell , Juan Diaz , Casamayor, Raheem etc .Quote:
Originally Posted by PavlikHonestly JMM and Guzman are the greatest threats. Who else comes to mind in the 135lb division.Quote:
Originally Posted by GAMEQuote:
Originally Posted by Pavlik
Its better than Diaz but I can think of alot of better fighters Pac should be fighting
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Originally Posted by JT Rock
I agree with you 100%
I wasn't able to order the fight because I am 50 bucks overdue and it kept rejecting my order. Still, I was ordering because I thought Pac might get sent back down in weight not because he is a joy to watch.
I thought Marquez beat him the second time. (and the first time)
hahaha. why is game so anti-pac? :-X
After every Pacquaio fight this is what usually happens. I've learned to adjust to these Pac-haters.:cool:
After Mayweather's retirement, Pac is p4p#1. FACT.
He won over Marquez, with a knockdown....FACT.
He castigated Morales into retirement. FACT.
He dominated Barrera after Barrera won over Naz. FACT.
He battered DIAZ, the title holder of the WBC lightweight belt. FACT.
Pac hasn't ducked anyone. FACT.
Guzman is complaining coz he wasn't given chance to fight Pac. Was that Pac's fault? Was it the fault of Pac that Joan was still a nobody during that time compared to Morales, Barrera and MArquez and therefore, it would not be that challenging and lucrative to fight him?
Let's appeal to FACTS not on emotions and what you think Guys!
Argumentum ad Misericordiam is not a valid argument in boxing!
I can't tell you how many times That the purchase of a PPV is based on the undercard for myself.It was actually a solid undercard with Santiago/Luevano and Soto/Lorenzo.The exposure of the Giant boxing Bear fields also helped ;D.Ecspecially in a main event that was thought to be,and proved to be one sided going in.Also knowing that these days HBO will be reairing it in it's entirety the following week.Pac has managed to cross over in tremendous fashion to the Masses but still has a little ways to go in marketability Imo.I'd like to see him unify The title as opposed to predictably what is so popular.....jumping divisions for name fights.....Hatton is so very tempting.
that's it! you're just plainly a die hard floyd fan that's why you think he's worth more than pac, and you'd also feel like a moron(well maybe not so much since you're a die hard fan) if you bought a pbf fight with a david diazlike opponent. so what makes floyd different from pac for you to say that pac isn't a $49.95ppv fighter while pbf is?Quote:
Originally Posted by JT RockYes because I am a die hard Floyd fan so I feel obligated to do so and yeas I would complain about it;DQuote:
Originally Posted by KKisserso you would pay $49.95 to watch pbf fight someone like a david diaz?Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
This was no different than Gatti vs Mayweather although they were both dominant Floyd put it on him more than Diaz got... but none the less gatti vs Mayweather wasnt a $49.95 fight if memory serves me correct. and it was the same danger level.. most said mayweather couldnt handle gatti's strength and power, and gatti couldnt get a glove on him and was eating 5-7 punch combos with regularity
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Originally Posted by frozensolid_702Quote:
Originally Posted by amat
Bump!
Floyd is my all-time favorite, but the general population that doesn't follow boxing as much as 90% of the members of this forum would appreciate a Pacquiao fight like we saw tonight because they (unlike us;)) are not purists of the sport.
I feel I am purist of the sport, I like every aspect of it, and I like what I saw him as much as pretty much anything I've seen from Floyd. His offensive amazingness and sound defense is comparable to watching Floyd's air tight defense and little used offense. Floyd was my favorite fighter, maybe ever, but he is as exciting as RJJ, Pacquaio, Cotto, etc. and I admit that. He is too much better than his opponents and he is too technically sound to slip up in any department of his game which makes it hard for there to be any drama in his fights.
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Originally Posted by JT Rock
Like Floyd vs Baldo?? People were walking out of the arena in the 11th round.
I think the key is in what people are saying here. You need two to tango, I have no problem with a legitimate great matchup being on PPV but these one sided affairs are better left on regular HBO. The undercard was great though and my guess is we wouldn't have seen all the fights on regular HBO so no complaints there. I'm glad HBO has ditched the 2 fight undercard for the most part.
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Originally Posted by amat
:coolclick:
I just might have to agree with that.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
You are way off on this, JT. Like other people said, it's the matchup that makes it worth it more than anything else, and Pac vs. Diaz was a far more interesting PPV purchase than Floyd/Baldomir or washed Jones/Tito for that matter.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
It would be better if they priced Pac/Diaz less than that Pac/Morales, same as if they priced some of Floyd's crappy-ass PPV's but that's just not how they do it.
On top of it all, for 80% of all fans, Pac is much more exciting than Floyd, and considering he is the #1 star of ALL sports in the Philippines, he has the draw justify being a PPV fighter, even against Diaz. Hardcore fans who appreciate Floyd's skilled but more conservative style are in the minority compared to people who want aggression.
Your clearly racist. ;D I gotta disagree wholeheartedly, Pac is the shizzit, he looked like a filipino SRL the way he was in and out and landing from every angle. That was fun to watch...you cant say he doesn't give his all. Diaz put on a great show of heart but he was just a day late and a dollar short in the speed department.
I've never been a big PAC fan... Sure, now that Flyd retired he's at the #1 P4P spot and 98% of fans would put him there... I tend to agree with JT, though... Not to say that all Floyds fights were barnburners cuz that's just crazy talk... I think we all know I don't like Floyd at all but I did not buy the fight the other night and that's pretty rare.
I don't really know what it is... I mean, I always see his fights after when reaired and enjoy them but I'm not really willing to shell out 50 bucks to watch him live.
It always depends on the matchup.
After it's over, certain fights like Pacquiao-Morales 1-2, DLH-Vargas, Trinidad-Vargas, Barrera-Morales 3, etc....you should feel fine despite paying $50 because of the quality of the fight.
Other fights may appear on paper to be good, but ultimately be disappointing. Like Morales-Barrera 2. So you feel ripped off.
Now, certain fights like Mayweather-Baldomir, DLH-Chavez 2, DLH-Campas, DLH-Rivera, etc.....NEVER should've been on PPV for $40 and up in the first place!
My primary gripe is the Matchup... 1000000000000000% world new Diaz was led to the slaughter and to shine for an alphabet title fight moving up in weight.... It was a great performance no doubt but not for $50
You can say this was like Mayweather-Gatti same scenario even though more people picked Gatti do beat Floyd with his power and Blood and Guts style, and Gatti got demolished without so much laying so much a glove on Mayweather and I dont recall paying $50..
Pac is a 50 dollar fighter, but no way was this match. HBO screwed you guys on this, fuckin shit. The undercard wasn't even great.
I could honestly say i wouldn't pay $50 for any fight. But if Pac was on the ticket i would seriously consider it. This guy makes me love boxing. He doesn't hold, he just hits.
i think you're just bitter. you don't have any legitimate argument why floyd is $50 fighter and pac is not.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
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Originally Posted by bcollinsQuote:
Originally Posted by amat
:coolclick:
The better statement is which future Pac fight is woth $49.95 ? Based on his new weight class none. The talent pool there and their personalities do not serve interest to anyone but Pac fans.
Asking JMM to move up to 135 would also be a farce, being that JMM can not KO Pac at 130.
So only a A Guzman fight based upon Guzman's performance at 135 warrants $49.95. Pac should be cashing in. However, Pac is now a victim of mediocore and inexperienced talent. MAB and EM were worn and old. Poor Pac is just a victim of poor timing. His ceiling has just been lowered by lack of legitimate opponents.
JMM has been Pac's really only true competition and the 2 fights were controversial.
Oh please how can you say theres no interesting match ups for Pacquiao at 135 ?? its one of the hottest divisions in boxing at the moment probably only 2nd to Welterweight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Addicted to_boxingQuote:
Originally Posted by bcollinsQuote:
Originally Posted by amat
:coolclick:
The better statement is which future Pac fight is woth $49.95 ? Based on his new weight class none. The talent pool there and their personalities do not serve interest to anyone but Pac fans.
Asking JMM to move up to 135 would also be a farce, being that JMM can not KO Pac at 130.
So only a A Guzman fight based upon Guzman's performance at 135 warrants $49.95. Pac should be cashing in. However, Pac is now a victim of mediocore and inexperienced talent. MAB and EM were worn and old. Poor Pac is just a victim of poor timing. His ceiling has just been lowered by lack of legitimate opponents.
JMM has been Pac's really only true competition and the 2 fights were controversial.
Manny Pacquiao vs Juan Manuel Marquez vs Joel Casamayor Winner.
Manny Pacquiao vs Juan Diaz vs Michael Katsidis winner.
Manny Pacquiao vs Joan Guzman vs Nate Campbell winner.
Any of these match ups are worth paying for, and i hate people like you who just hate on a fighter no matter what they do. His 1st fight with Barrera, Barrera was not long coming off his best performance against Naseem Hamed, and also had a few other victory's over good opposition and was looking better than ever and showed no sign's of being shot in fact he looked at his peak. How can you actually sit there and not give Pacquiao his credit for dominating Barrera ?? and people also exaggerate how shot Morales was as well. Morales was still a very good fighter in both fights with Pacquiao, and Pacquiao deserves his credit for those 2 fights. And even the 3rd fight because no one has ever done to Morales what Pacquiao did.
well said ICB.:cool:Quote:
Originally Posted by ICBOh please how can you say theres no interesting match ups for Pacquiao at 135 ?? its one of the hottest divisions in boxing at the moment probably only 2nd to Welterweight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Addicted to_boxingQuote:
Originally Posted by bcollins
The better statement is which future Pac fight is woth $49.95 ? Based on his new weight class none. The talent pool there and their personalities do not serve interest to anyone but Pac fans.
Asking JMM to move up to 135 would also be a farce, being that JMM can not KO Pac at 130.
So only a A Guzman fight based upon Guzman's performance at 135 warrants $49.95. Pac should be cashing in. However, Pac is now a victim of mediocore and inexperienced talent. MAB and EM were worn and old. Poor Pac is just a victim of poor timing. His ceiling has just been lowered by lack of legitimate opponents.
JMM has been Pac's really only true competition and the 2 fights were controversial.
Manny Pacquiao vs Juan Manuel Marquez vs Joel Casamayor Winner.
Manny Pacquiao vs Juan Diaz vs Michael Katsidis winner.
Manny Pacquiao vs Joan Guzman vs Nate Campbell winner.
Any of these match ups are worth paying for, and i hate people like you who just hate on a fighter no matter what they do. His 1st fight with Barrera, Barrera was not long coming off his best performance against Naseem Hamed, and also had a few other victory's over good opposition and was looking better than ever and showed no sign's of being shot in fact he looked at his peak. How can you actually sit there and not give Pacquiao his credit for dominating Barrera ?? and people also exaggerate how shot Morales was as well. Morales was still a very good fighter in both fights with Pacquiao, and Pacquiao deserves his credit for those 2 fights. And even the 3rd fight because no one has ever done to Morales what Pacquiao did.
Can you name the opposition for a $50 Floyd fight? Certainly wasnt anyone of Diaz caliber and someone who Floyd wasnt and overwhelming favorite, and it was an EVENT that Floyd more than towed the line while promoting it... Give me Pac vs Hatton I'll pay $50 all day, Pac vs Valero I'll pay $50 Call me a hater all you want but I just didnt see the value in that matchup;)Quote:
Originally Posted by KKisseri think you're just bitter. you don't have any legitimate argument why floyd is $50 fighter and pac is not.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
Floyd Promoted the event well... Floyd was far from an overwhelming betting favorite and he moved up to challenge for the Lineal Welterweight Championship of the world...Quote:
Originally Posted by the wizQuote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
Like Floyd vs Baldo?? People were walking out of the arena in the 11th round.
Again another clear case of Floyd accuracey being in the 40% and his opponent landing in the 13%... Dont gimme this Floyd didnt knock him out crap, Tell me the last person who stopped Baldo? Forrest was teeing off on him and he couldnt put him down.... 2 entirely different examples my friend ;)
May be out of topic, but Forrest was landing everything at will and Baldo walked right through them. The same Forrest that knocked down and had Mosley in SEVERE trouble when they fought. The same Mosley who EVERYONE knows has an iron chin. Baldo must have taken a cortisone shot in his head for that fight...Quote:
Originally Posted by JT RockFloyd Promoted the event well... Floyd was far from an overwhelming betting favorite and he moved up to challenge for the Lineal Welterweight Championship of the world...Quote:
Originally Posted by the wizQuote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
Like Floyd vs Baldo?? People were walking out of the arena in the 11th round.
Again another clear case of Floyd accuracey being in the 40% and his opponent landing in the 13%... Dont gimme this Floyd didnt knock him out crap, Tell me the last person who stopped Baldo? Forrest was teeing off on him and he couldnt put him down.... 2 entirely different examples my friend ;)
Gatti and Baldomir were no more the competition that Diaz was.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT RockCan you name the opposition for a $50 Floyd fight? Certainly wasnt anyone of Diaz caliber and someone who Floyd wasnt and overwhelming favorite, and it was an EVENT that Floyd more than towed the line while promoting it... Give me Pac vs Hatton I'll pay $50 all day, Pac vs Valero I'll pay $50 Call me a hater all you want but I just didnt see the value in that matchup;)Quote:
Originally Posted by KKisseri think you're just bitter. you don't have any legitimate argument why floyd is $50 fighter and pac is not.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
Sorry but there is only 1 Gatti Amat and you know that;) Baldo had not lost in 12+ years beat Zab a then shot to bits Gatti then Floyd fought him for the Lineal Championship of the world... not an Alphabet but the whole damn crown... Different events entirelyQuote:
Originally Posted by amatGatti and Baldomir were no more the competition that Diaz was.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT RockCan you name the opposition for a $50 Floyd fight? Certainly wasnt anyone of Diaz caliber and someone who Floyd wasnt and overwhelming favorite, and it was an EVENT that Floyd more than towed the line while promoting it... Give me Pac vs Hatton I'll pay $50 all day, Pac vs Valero I'll pay $50 Call me a hater all you want but I just didnt see the value in that matchup;)Quote:
Originally Posted by KKisser
OK but all 3 were bad matchups where everyone knew who the winner was going to be at the end of the night.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT RockSorry but there is only 1 Gatti Amat and you know that;) Baldo had not lost in 12+ years beat Zab a then shot to bits Gatti then Floyd fought him for the Lineal Championship of the world... not an Alphabet but the whole damn crown... Different events entirelyQuote:
Originally Posted by amatGatti and Baldomir were no more the competition that Diaz was.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
I don't think Mayweather gets enough credit for the Arturo Gatti win, sure Gatti is no elite world beater but he is still a good fighter and he was coming off some good wins shortly before his fight with Mayweather, Micky Ward x2, Leonard Dorin 22-0, Jesse James Leija, Gianluca Branco 32-0. Those are quality wins and i'll say it again Mayweather doesn't get enough credit for his win over Gatti, as for Baldomir he should of lost to Joshua Clottey he was getting his ass kicked until Clottey got DQ, but Baldomir did rebound and got a draw with Jose Luis Cruz, who isn't a bad fighter at all and gave Shane Mosley 10 tough rounds, and then two wins over Judah, Gatti, and no matter what anyone says Judah was considered a very good fighter at that time. So for Baldomir to pull off the upset was a good achievement at the time, and he was the legit Welterweight champion at that time and they are the facts no matter what way anyone tries and twists it.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT RockSorry but there is only 1 Gatti Amat and you know that;) Baldo had not lost in 12+ years beat Zab a then shot to bits Gatti then Floyd fought him for the Lineal Championship of the world... not an Alphabet but the whole damn crown... Different events entirelyQuote:
Originally Posted by amatGatti and Baldomir were no more the competition that Diaz was.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
I haven't read the first three or four pages so I've probably missed some stuff
Congratulations, this is one of the worst posts I've read in a long time. :thumb:Quote:
Originally Posted by Addicted to_boxingQuote:
Originally Posted by bcollinsQuote:
Originally Posted by amat
:coolclick:
The better statement is which future Pac fight is woth $49.95 ? Based on his new weight class none. The talent pool there and their personalities do not serve interest to anyone but Pac fans.
Asking JMM to move up to 135 would also be a farce, being that JMM can not KO Pac at 130.
So only a A Guzman fight based upon Guzman's performance at 135 warrants $49.95. Pac should be cashing in. However, Pac is now a victim of mediocore and inexperienced talent. MAB and EM were worn and old. Poor Pac is just a victim of poor timing. His ceiling has just been lowered by lack of legitimate opponents.
JMM has been Pac's really only true competition and the 2 fights were controversial.
JMM's already moving up to 135 and since, according to many, he's already beaten Pac once, maybe twice, why a fight at 135 would be a farce is beyond me.
So Guzman-Pac is acceptable because of Guzman's performances at 135? He's never fought at 135, the highest he's ever weighed for a fight was 132, but still you may be on to something there.
And Marquez was Pac's only true competition. Really ;D
I don't know why I felt the need to explain why that was such a bad post :confused:
Pacquaio may be worth paying to watch, but Pacquaio vs. Diaz sure as hell wasn't IMO. 50 bucks is a lot for a glorified tune up fight.
Pacqauio vs. Casamayor or Nate Campbell, now thats a differnt story.
Well...i'll just say it like this. I would shell out $50 for PAcquaio over Floyd any day of the week, because atleast you know you're in for a show.
This is a joke coming from a floyd fan. I would pay for a Pac PPV before a floyd PPV every day of the week and twice on Sunday.
He is a far more exciting fighter.
The topic was being worth $49.95. Floyd's fight vs Baldo was not a value IMO. But I'll pay to watch Pac any day. He's a damn exciting fighter and worth every penny.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT RockFloyd Promoted the event well... Floyd was far from an overwhelming betting favorite and he moved up to challenge for the Lineal Welterweight Championship of the world...Quote:
Originally Posted by the wizQuote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
Like Floyd vs Baldo?? People were walking out of the arena in the 11th round.
Again another clear case of Floyd accuracey being in the 40% and his opponent landing in the 13%... Dont gimme this Floyd didnt knock him out crap, Tell me the last person who stopped Baldo? Forrest was teeing off on him and he couldnt put him down.... 2 entirely different examples my friend ;)
glad I could make you laugh ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Bx730NY
agree with you about the matchup not worth 50 bucks but the point is floyd against diazlike opponent also isn't worth 50 bucks. bottom line is it all boils down to the matchup whether we're talking about pac or pbf, and there's simply no difference there except that i think pac is more exciting of the 2 fighters to watch.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT RockCan you name the opposition for a $50 Floyd fight? Certainly wasnt anyone of Diaz caliber and someone who Floyd wasnt and overwhelming favorite, and it was an EVENT that Floyd more than towed the line while promoting it... Give me Pac vs Hatton I'll pay $50 all day, Pac vs Valero I'll pay $50 Call me a hater all you want but I just didnt see the value in that matchup;)Quote:
Originally Posted by KKisseri think you're just bitter. you don't have any legitimate argument why floyd is $50 fighter and pac is not.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
pac is hands down the more and most exciting fighter. no comparison wheather you like brawl or box. pac is either brawling or his fighting a boxer, if his not fighting a boxer his boxing. hope that made sense, now thats why he is hands down the guy to always watch. ;)