JMM v. Mayweather Talks underway

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

Yeah much better for JMM... And this fight can be easily made since Mosley and JMM are with the same promoter GBP...
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hell since both Pacquaio and Chavez Jr are promoted by Top Rank than that must be his next logical opponent after Hatton, to keep the Mexicutioner moniker going :rolleyes:, hell than after that fight Pacquiao will be ranked #1 at 154 :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

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You mean you don't like PAC taking on Cotto first at 147?? ... Arum already planned for this fight maybe in September...
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Ever hear the expression...getting ahead of yourself.One fantasy at a time:-X.

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

Yeah much better for JMM... And this fight can be easily made since Mosley and JMM are with the same promoter GBP...
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hell since both Pacquaio and Chavez Jr are promoted by Top Rank than that must be his next logical opponent after Hatton, to keep the Mexicutioner moniker going :rolleyes:, hell than after that fight Pacquiao will be ranked #1 at 154 :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

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You mean you don't like PAC taking on Cotto first at 147?? ... Arum already planned for this fight maybe in September...
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Cotto a real welterweight, and in his prime, would take Pac out in about 6 rounds, same way he'd stop Hatton, i'm more interested in Cotto/Mosley II than i am in Cotto/Pacquiao to be honest, there are alot bigger fights out there than fights that include Pacquiao

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

hell since both Pacquaio and Chavez Jr are promoted by Top Rank than that must be his next logical opponent after Hatton, to keep the Mexicutioner moniker going :rolleyes:, hell than after that fight Pacquiao will be ranked #1 at 154 :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

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You mean you don't like PAC taking on Cotto first at 147?? ... Arum already planned for this fight maybe in September...
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Cotto a real welterweight, and in his prime, would take Pac out in about 6 rounds, same way he'd stop Hatton, i'm more interested in Cotto/Mosley II than i am in Cotto/Pacquiao to be honest, there are alot bigger fights out there than fights that include Pacquiao

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But from the discussion on this thread, the fights that will turn out might be (granting PBF stays retired);

Mosley vs. JMM

PAC vs. Cotto (if PAC beat Hatton)

;)

Big deal! Mayweather knows he will struggle against Pac. That's why he likes to fight the slow aging fighters for big bucks.

He's the modern day Sugar Ray Leonard

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

You mean you don't like PAC taking on Cotto first at 147?? ... Arum already planned for this fight maybe in September...
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Cotto a real welterweight, and in his prime, would take Pac out in about 6 rounds, same way he'd stop Hatton, i'm more interested in Cotto/Mosley II than i am in Cotto/Pacquiao to be honest, there are alot bigger fights out there than fights that include Pacquiao

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But from the discussion on this thread, the fights that will turn out might be (granting PBF stays retired);

Mosley vs. JMM

PAC vs. Cotto (if PAC beat Hatton)

;)

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than according to you, all hail the future p4p king, from Caguas Puerto Rico.....

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

Cotto a real welterweight, and in his prime, would take Pac out in about 6 rounds, same way he'd stop Hatton, i'm more interested in Cotto/Mosley II than i am in Cotto/Pacquiao to be honest, there are alot bigger fights out there than fights that include Pacquiao

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But from the discussion on this thread, the fights that will turn out might be (granting PBF stays retired);

Mosley vs. JMM

PAC vs. Cotto (if PAC beat Hatton)

;)

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than according to you, all hail the future p4p king, from Caguas Puerto Rico.....

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No problem at all if Cotto defeats PAC.... Cotto is a young excellent boxer and his time at the P4P throne might be now specially that PAC is retiring after one more fight after Hatton... Cotto is not an old whining veteran that always cry if he won't get the judges nod... I see Cotto as one that will take a loss like a true gentlemen...
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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

But from the discussion on this thread, the fights that will turn out might be (granting PBF stays retired);

Mosley vs. JMM

PAC vs. Cotto (if PAC beat Hatton)

;)

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than according to you, all hail the future p4p king, from Caguas Puerto Rico.....

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No problem at all if Cotto defeats PAC.... Cotto is a young excellent boxer and his time at the P4P throne might be now specially that PAC is retiring after one more fight after Hatton... Cotto is not an old whining veteran that always cry if he won't get the judges nod... I see Cotto as one that will take a loss like a true gentlemen...
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well said bro. You're really one of the few knowledgeable posters here.

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Originally Posted by brucelee

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

than according to you, all hail the future p4p king, from Caguas Puerto Rico.....

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No problem at all if Cotto defeats PAC.... Cotto is a young excellent boxer and his time at the P4P throne might be now specially that PAC is retiring after one more fight after Hatton... Cotto is not an old whining veteran that always cry if he won't get the judges nod... I see Cotto as one that will take a loss like a true gentlemen...
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well said bro. You're really one of the few knowledgeable posters here.

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Being called a knowledgeable poster by Brucelee is an insult.

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Originally Posted by eagle

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Originally Posted by brucelee

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

No problem at all if Cotto defeats PAC.... Cotto is a young excellent boxer and his time at the P4P throne might be now specially that PAC is retiring after one more fight after Hatton... Cotto is not an old whining veteran that always cry if he won't get the judges nod... I see Cotto as one that will take a loss like a true gentlemen...
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well said bro. You're really one of the few knowledgeable posters here.

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Being called a knowledgeable poster by Brucelee is an insult.

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by knowledgeable he means that he can chug just as much of Pacs nut juice as him ;), so on that note, i'm glad Bruce Leroy considers me an idiot ;D lol

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

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Originally Posted by eagle

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Originally Posted by brucelee

well said bro. You're really one of the few knowledgeable posters here.

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Being called a knowledgeable poster by Brucelee is an insult.

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by knowledgeable he means that he can chug just as much of Pacs nut juice as him ;), so on that note, i'm glad Bruce Leroy considers me an idiot ;D lol

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They'll soon be fighting over who loves Manny more....

Why does every single motherfucking goddamn thread have to turn into a discussion about Manny fucking Pacquiao. I understand that JMM will always be linked to Pac, and in this thread it is somewhat understandable, but overall this is getting fucking ridiculous.

This is supposed to be a thread about Mayweather and Marquez.

From this point on, I am going to neg. rep every single person who brings up Manny Pacquiao for no good reason.

I feel better now.

Goldenboy Promotion must be trying to really cash in on JMMs success, nothing wrong with that though.

If this fight takes place, i hope JMM takes floyds head off ;D but i highly doubt this fight will ever take place.:-\ Because floyd is an all time pussy ;)

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Originally Posted by Julius Rain

Goldenboy Promotion must be trying to really cash in on JMMs success, nothing wrong with that though.

If this fight takes place, i hope JMM takes floyds head off ;D but i highly doubt this fight will ever take place.:-\ Because floyd is an all time pussy ;)

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Not as big a pussy as Manny Pac. Running from JMM.

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Originally Posted by eagle

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Originally Posted by Julius Rain

Goldenboy Promotion must be trying to really cash in on JMMs success, nothing wrong with that though.

If this fight takes place, i hope JMM takes floyds head off ;D but i highly doubt this fight will ever take place.:-\ Because floyd is an all time pussy ;)

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Not as big a pussy as Manny Pac. Running from JMM.

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yea pac is running from a guy he has fought twice already :rolleyes: and pac is fighting a guy who is bigger and stronger (ricky hatton), yea call pac a coward why dont you :rolleyes:

I guess pac should keep fighting jmm til jmm wins. Its just not going to happen, :LOLATYOU:

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Originally Posted by Julius Rain

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Originally Posted by eagle

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Originally Posted by Julius Rain

Goldenboy Promotion must be trying to really cash in on JMMs success, nothing wrong with that though.

If this fight takes place, i hope JMM takes floyds head off ;D but i highly doubt this fight will ever take place.:-\ Because floyd is an all time pussy ;)

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Not as big a pussy as Manny Pac. Running from JMM.

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yea pac is running from a guy he has fought twice already :rolleyes: and pac is fighting a guy who is bigger and stronger (ricky hatton), yea call pac a coward why dont you :rolleyes:

I guess pac should keep fighting jmm til jmm wins. Its just not going to happen, :LOLATYOU:

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I guess he could just go on figting champions like D Diaz and washed up DLH..... Or maybe he is content fighting PBF victims like Hatton. Face it Manny is P4P #1 by default cos he got favourable decisions in fights he lost v JMM and cos Joe and PBF are retired....

I think Mayweather is the wrong opponent for JMM, sure he delt with Pacquiao speed pretty well, but Mayweather is such a dynamic fighter, and I truly believe that JMM would have a hell of a time trying to time/hit Mayweather, while JMM defensive skills have eroded. I mean if Juan Diaz can hit him, I can't see Mayweather having any troubles against Marquez, and unlike Pacquiao who has really filled into a guy around MAyweather size, I get the feeling that physically JMM just too small, too slow, and too orthodox to beat Mayweather. His technical advantages he had against Pacquiao are gone, Mayweather is good coming forward, and exceptionally good going backwards.

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Originally Posted by eagle

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Originally Posted by Julius Rain

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Originally Posted by eagle

Not as big a pussy as Manny Pac. Running from JMM.

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yea pac is running from a guy he has fought twice already :rolleyes: and pac is fighting a guy who is bigger and stronger (ricky hatton), yea call pac a coward why dont you :rolleyes:

I guess pac should keep fighting jmm til jmm wins. Its just not going to happen, :LOLATYOU:

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I guess he could just go on figting champions like D Diaz and washed up DLH..... Or maybe he is content fighting PBF victims like Hatton. Face it Manny is P4P #1 by default cos he got favourable decisions in fights he lost v JMM and cos Joe and PBF are retired....

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Which fight did he lose against Marquez? Can you break down the fights round by round to prove your point? If not then you shouldn't arguing the fact.

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Originally Posted by Taeth

I think Mayweather is the wrong opponent for JMM, sure he delt with Pacquiao speed pretty well, but Mayweather is such a dynamic fighter, and I truly believe that JMM would have a hell of a time trying to time/hit Mayweather, while JMM defensive skills have eroded. I mean if Juan Diaz can hit him, I can't see Mayweather having any troubles against Marquez, and unlike Pacquiao who has really filled into a guy around MAyweather size, I get the feeling that physically JMM just too small, too slow, and too orthodox to beat Mayweather. His technical advantages he had against Pacquiao are gone, Mayweather is good coming forward, and exceptionally good going backwards.

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Very well said Taeth...

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Originally Posted by Taeth

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Originally Posted by eagle

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Originally Posted by Julius Rain

yea pac is running from a guy he has fought twice already :rolleyes: and pac is fighting a guy who is bigger and stronger (ricky hatton), yea call pac a coward why dont you :rolleyes:

I guess pac should keep fighting jmm til jmm wins. Its just not going to happen, :LOLATYOU:

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I guess he could just go on figting champions like D Diaz and washed up DLH..... Or maybe he is content fighting PBF victims like Hatton. Face it Manny is P4P #1 by default cos he got favourable decisions in fights he lost v JMM and cos Joe and PBF are retired....

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Which fight did he lose against Marquez? Can you break down the fights round by round to prove your point? If not then you shouldn't arguing the fact.

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U mean u read this whole thread, looked at all the rubbish the Pac nuthuggers have been spewing out and my comment is the one thing u think is the furthest from the truth? Fuck me.

But if i have to i'll put down my scorecard.
Manny v JMM II

1. JMM
2. JMM
3. Pac 10-8
4. Pac
5. JMM
6. JMM
7. Pac
8. JMM
9. Pac
10. Pac
11. JMM
12. JMM

114-113 JMM.

Anybody can say what rounds they think somebody won, but I mean like punch by punch analysis, How did JMM win the first round? Pacquiao doubled the punches he landed, and they both landed one clean cross. In round 11 Pacquiao landed way more clean punches than Marquez, and his defense in that round was better than Marquez. The 12th round I gave to Marquez, but I felt that it was pretty close, but Pacquiao just didn't get enough going, but IMO Pacquiao had one of his better rounds in the 11th.

I am just saying you can call them two close fights, but to see JMM deserved both of them to me is a little tiring to hear. I didn't read the whole the thread, but Pacquiao honestly deserves everything people are saying about him, same with JMM They both are great fighters, you shouldn't hate on Pacquiao just because his greatness will outshine JMM, I don't hate him that as of now his greatness is more than both Mayweather and Roy Jones Jr(both my favorite fighters). I acknowledge the competition, and how well Pacquiao has done. Is he better p4p? Who knows, but like Hopkins he will rated higher in the archives of boxing because of what he has accomplished inside the round, while guys like Mayweather and Roy Jones Jr have never truly been tested while near or at the peak of their skills, at least not enough to show just how good they were. I think if Mayweather comes back there are guys like Marquez, Mosley, Pacquiao, and if he is much improved Berto can test Mayweather. From what he's foughten so far only JLC has been able to test him over a whole fight, Oscar he outboxed pretty soundly, Hatton tested his endurance, but just couldn't land enough.

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Originally Posted by brucelee

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

than according to you, all hail the future p4p king, from Caguas Puerto Rico.....

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No problem at all if Cotto defeats PAC.... Cotto is a young excellent boxer and his time at the P4P throne might be now specially that PAC is retiring after one more fight after Hatton... Cotto is not an old whining veteran that always cry if he won't get the judges nod... I see Cotto as one that will take a loss like a true gentlemen...
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well said bro. You're really one of the few knowledgeable posters here.

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HAHAHAHA, give this man an Emmy, he's the best thing since Seinfeld

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

This is just a publicity thing from GBP to put JMM in the mix. Why do you think PBF will fight JMM? What does JMM brings to the table for Floyd Jr.? The lightweight belts? Naahhh... PBF won't even fight JMM at 140... Remember PBF didn't even give that chance to Hatton... PBF fought Hatton at 147 where he has all the advantages... PBF is the man at that time so he has the final say...

GBP is just throwing a weak counter to Top Rank's planned PAC vs. Cotto fight if PAC demolish Hatton on May 2...
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umm you mean the fact that since last Saturday Pacquiao's hold at #1 p4p is much in doubt by a lot of fans and sportswriters, seeing how many consider Marquez now the #1 p4p fighter in the world, and how if he does fight Marquez and beat him, he can once again scoop up 2 HUGE PPV fights back to back being against JM Marquez and then against the winner of Pacquiao/Hatton, that enough of an explanation for you? oh wait, if i don't mention Pacquiao as the MAIN reason well it doesn't make sense to you

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Well Marquez didn't beat Pac to get to #1, Pac beat Marquez 2x, why does Pac need to beat Marquez to remain at #1? Pac beats Hatton, that's a bigger opponent than Diaz and if he fights Cotto or Mayweather next that's hardly ducking a guy he already beat and Pac makes way more money against both guys.

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Originally Posted by Killface

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

This is just a publicity thing from GBP to put JMM in the mix. Why do you think PBF will fight JMM? What does JMM brings to the table for Floyd Jr.? The lightweight belts? Naahhh... PBF won't even fight JMM at 140... Remember PBF didn't even give that chance to Hatton... PBF fought Hatton at 147 where he has all the advantages... PBF is the man at that time so he has the final say...

GBP is just throwing a weak counter to Top Rank's planned PAC vs. Cotto fight if PAC demolish Hatton on May 2...
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umm you mean the fact that since last Saturday Pacquiao's hold at #1 p4p is much in doubt by a lot of fans and sportswriters, seeing how many consider Marquez now the #1 p4p fighter in the world, and how if he does fight Marquez and beat him, he can once again scoop up 2 HUGE PPV fights back to back being against JM Marquez and then against the winner of Pacquiao/Hatton, that enough of an explanation for you? oh wait, if i don't mention Pacquiao as the MAIN reason well it doesn't make sense to you

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Well Marquez didn't beat Pac to get to #1, Pac beat Marquez 2x, why does Pac need to beat Marquez to remain at #1? Pac beats Hatton, that's a bigger opponent than Diaz and if he fights Cotto or Mayweather next that's hardly ducking a guy he already beat and Pac makes way more money against both guys.

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look at Pacs last two opponents and look at Marquez's last two opponents, i'd say that Pacs are second tier compared to JMM, i like Pacquiao but the nutthuggers are now doing to him what the PBF fan boys would do with Mayweather, anyone notice how when PBF retired and about 90% of his fan boys shut the fuck up, everyone started appreciating Mayweather a hell of a lot more, well it's happening now with Pacquiao, his fans say he's gonna win just cause he's Manny Pacquiao, cause he's the king of all the Filipinos:rolleyes:, that's hardly a reason, hell i said it time and time again, Pacquiao will push anyone, and is a hard fight for anyone, he looked great against Oscar and Diaz, but to be honest, i think Andre Berto, who by the way i've made it clear that i don't find him to be anything special, would have beaten Oscar just as bad, i felt Marquez out boxed Pac in the rematch just as he did in the first fight, i had it 7 rnds to 5, being 114-113 for JMM (due to the kd), he would catch Pacquiao with cleaner shots more often and also countered him most the night, i don't diss Pacquiao for taking on Hatton cause it's the biggest risk he's taken since the Marquez rematch, and also he's willing to take on Hatton at 140 which is his best weight, but no one can deny the simple fact that just like the Vazquez/R.Marquez fights, JMM/Pac III should of happened right after the second fight

I am tired people hating on Pacquiao because they retarded. What seven rounds did Marquez win, only a blind person would give him the 11th and the 1st round both. I am tired of this bullshit, Pacquiao is clearly better than Marquez, maybe when they fight eachother it is very competitive, but fighting similar opposition Pacquiao has consistantly done better. Marquez has the perfect style to counter act Pacman, and he still came out with a draw and a loss.

Also people are saying Oscar is old? Look at Joel Casamayor, he barely beat Katsidis who was way overrated. Joel wasn't even the best lightweight near his prime, when they were at their best both Castillo and Corrales were better than him. Marquez didn't outright dominate either of his last two fights. Sure David Diaz isn't as good as Duan or JOel, but Pacquiao annihilated him, then he went on to destroy Oscar, who is way better than Joel or Katsidis, you guys say he is old or weight drained, but he looked light on his feet, high energy against Steve Forbes just three pounds over the weight he fought Manny at, he looked good against Mayweather, even though Mayweather was better than him. The fact that Manny went up to WW beat the shit out of Oscar from pillar to post which nobody has ever done before (remember that Oscar has foughten Mosleyx2, Vargas, Quartey, Trinidad, Whitaker, JCC, Hopkins, Mayweather).

Also to MOrales why should they fight eachother three times in a row, look how intense the Ali-Frazier trilogy was, and they didn't do that. Their legacy wouldn't be half as big if they just were hell bent on fighting eachother, they would have been physically ruined much earlier in their careers. In the first fight Marquez was landing the cleaner punches, but in the second fight he wasn't except in the middle rounds and the 12th. People give Marquez the 1st and 11th round even though in those two rounds Pacquiao outlands him, and lands more clean punches. IMO Marquez-Vazquez fighting eachother 3 or 4 times in a row is BS, guys like JML deserve a crack at either of them, but they can't because both Vazquez and Marquez are only fighting eachother, it holds up the whole division.

People have bitched about Pacquiao not fighting Barrera again, then he did, then people were saying he was ducking the rematch with Marquez then he fought him (I might also add that Pacquiao was killing himself to make 130 by that point). People said lightweight was too big for him, then he destroyed David Diaz, and clearly showed that he was the best lightweight because as slow as D.Diaz is he would do alright against Casamayor or Juan Diaz, he wouldn't win, but he wouldn't be dominated. Then Pacquiao did what almost nobody thought he could do, and thats win every single round, and become the second man to stop Oscar De La Hoya despite the fact the man had already faced 6 guys who had or were carrying the p4p title coming into the fight, or got it because of their fight.

But hey you Marquez humpers must be right, if Pacquiao were to fight Mayweather or Cotto after Hatton he would absolutely be ducking Marquez, because we all know they couldn't beat Marquez... give me a fucking break. If Marquez went up to WW even to face the Oscar that Pacquiao fought he would be stopped. Pacquiao still has great movement he is elusive when he wants to be and his southpaw, Oscar would have that jab lined up against Marquez he could employ the same strategy he did against Mayweather, and Marquez would be there to be hit.

The Pacquaio hate is crazy. ;D Enjoy him while he's here, an exciting fighter who fights anybody.

Please don't complement me again Saddoboxer.

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Originally Posted by OumaFan

The Pacquaio hate is crazy. ;D Enjoy him while he's here, an exciting fighter who fights anybody.

Please don't complement me again Saddoboxer.

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i'm not hating on Pacquiao, hell i said it VERY clearly that i'm tired of his fan boys, saying that he's gonna win cause he's Pacquiao lol like if that's a fucking reason, and Taeth please don't act so ignorant by trying to compare the DLH that fought Pacquiao with the DLH that fought Trinidad, Vargas, Mosley X2, etc., he weighed in for Forbes at 150, he wasn't 150 come fight time, and he didn't look good against Forbes, hell many people on here said that he got hit way too much and too cleanly against Forbes, so it is valid to say he lost due to the weight and due to his age, wanna try and downplay Marquez and you're only downplaying Pacquiao, seeing how Manny dropped him 3 times in one round and then only managed to get away with a draw, a draw many thought he didn't even deserve, 7 rounds to 5 is how i had it scored like i said making it 114-113 for Marquez due to the KD, if there would have been no knockdown than it would have been 115-113 meaning one round away from a draw, not completely ludicrous scoring, D. Diaz is a joke and hell if Pacquiao wouldn't of dominated him something would have been very wrong, a shot Morales beat Diaz, was robbed, but beat him none the less, Pacquiao/Marquez III should of happened right after Pacquiao/Marquez II, no one can deny they're the top 2 p4p fighters today, so why the hell not just play the 3rd fight already?

I just don't think at the end of the day that Marquez will bring enough money to the table to interest Mayweather. It's be an interesting fight, though Marquez is going to be pushing it weight wise. The fight could also become a snoozer with both guys looking for countering opportunities.

ANYWAY

Since this isn't a Pacquiao thread.

Is it just me or does Dan Rafael "report" team Mayweather is in talks with everyone that wins a major fight between 135 and 147?

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

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Originally Posted by OumaFan

The Pacquaio hate is crazy. ;D Enjoy him while he's here, an exciting fighter who fights anybody.

Please don't complement me again Saddoboxer.

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i'm not hating on Pacquiao, hell i said it VERY clearly that i'm tired of his fan boys, saying that he's gonna win cause he's Pacquiao lol like if that's a fucking reason, and Taeth please don't act so ignorant by trying to compare the DLH that fought Pacquiao with the DLH that fought Trinidad, Vargas, Mosley X2, etc., he weighed in for Forbes at 150, he wasn't 150 come fight time, and he didn't look good against Forbes, hell many people on here said that he got hit way too much and too cleanly against Forbes, so it is valid to say he lost due to the weight and due to his age, wanna try and downplay Marquez and you're only downplaying Pacquiao, seeing how Manny dropped him 3 times in one round and then only managed to get away with a draw, a draw many thought he didn't even deserve, 7 rounds to 5 is how i had it scored like i said making it 114-113 for Marquez due to the KD, if there would have been no knockdown than it would have been 115-113 meaning one round away from a draw, not completely ludicrous scoring, D. Diaz is a joke and hell if Pacquiao wouldn't of dominated him something would have been very wrong, a shot Morales beat Diaz, was robbed, but beat him none the less, Pacquiao/Marquez III should of happened right after Pacquiao/Marquez II, no one can deny they're the top 2 p4p fighters today, so why the hell not just play the 3rd fight already?

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What did Oscar weigh in at against Forbes then? There was nothing to show his weight on fightnight. Also how is David Diaz a joke? He beat Zab Judah to make the olympic team, he stopped Jose Santa Cruz, who lost a split decision to Joel Casamayor. I am not saying he is a great fighter, but the JOel Casamayor isn't a great fighter anymore, he once was a really good one, but not when he fought JMM, and that fight was pretty back and forth. Juan Diaz rocked JMM, and that was another close fight. Unlike JMM Pacquiao was number #2 when guys like Wright and Calzaghe and Hopkins were still active. JMM was behind all of them, and IMO Bernard should still be ahead of him. I am not downplaying JMM by saying Pacquiao is better than himl, JMM is a great fighter, its just you have to admit that he isn't as good as Pacquiao, his record isn't as impressive, his level opposition isn't either. Pacquiao is only getting better, while JMM's skills are fading. The fact is that Pacquiao beat him fair and square in the second fight. Manny isn't fighting bums, he is fighting guys like Oscar De La Hoya, David Diaz, Marquez, Marco Antonio Barrera, Jorge Solis, Morales. And who is he fighting Hatton? the 140 pound king, then going on to Cotto or Mayweather... yeah he is really taking the easy route. About scoring the Pacquiao fight, you clearly must have given two rounds (1 and 11) that should have gone to Pacquiao, at least one of them to Marquez, which means that Marquez shouldn't have won, especially not with the knockdown. I am not saying it was a close fight, but did Mayweather not have difficulties with JLC? Even their second fight was one of his most competitive fights, and still Mayweather is a way better fighter than JLC. Did Roy Jones Jr not have difficulties with Montell Griffin? Willie Pep with Saddler? I am saying that styles make fights, and JMM has the right style to fight Pacquiao, but Pacquiao still finds a way to win. Honestly Mayweather is better than Marquez, he's closer to his prime, he's bigger, he's faster, he's just as technically sound, he's harder to hit. He is a bigger, and new challenge for Pacquiao. Not only that but its a better fight for boxing, it will bring the sport way more media attention. I am not saying Pacquiao and Marquez should never fight again, but right now Pacquiao as p4p king needs to bring the sport into the spotlight, thats what the p4p king does, and fighting Marquez at least right now won't do that. Honestly I am not trying to hump Pacquiao's leg, but he is having the type of career that emulates the guys who are in the top 10 p4p ever.

PS. a "shot" Barrera gave Marquez one hell of a fight, and knocked him down. Don't disrespect Barrera or Morales. I reckon stylewise if Morales fought Marquez anywhere near where he was in his first and second fight against Pacquiao he would given JMM all he could handle. Part of Morales' reason for being shot just like Pacquiao at 130, is that he was killing himself to make 130 by the end, he looked more lively against David Diaz, and it was a really good fight.

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Originally Posted by killersheep

ANYWAY

Since this isn't a Pacquiao thread.

Is it just me or does Dan Rafael "report" team Mayweather is in talks with everyone that wins a major fight between 135 and 147?

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I think its because they think they are in talks with Mayweather. And it would make sense, there are so many guys right now that could further promote Mayweather's career that he must be interested with Cotto, Pacquiao, Hatton II, Mosley, Marquez, and if he wins a big fight Andre Berto.

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Originally Posted by ClubberLang

I just don't think at the end of the day that Marquez will bring enough money to the table to interest Mayweather. It's be an interesting fight, though Marquez is going to be pushing it weight wise. The fight could also become a snoozer with both guys looking for countering opportunities.

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I hope your right and it doesnt happen . Theres so many more better fights to be made

Marquez is out of his depth and would be shooled by the better man . Even if Floyd is proper ring rusty he still has it easy with Marquez. Juan didnt look good againt Nate campbells leftovers up until the stoppage. I dont think he was leading vs a washed up Casamayor either .

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Originally Posted by Taeth

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

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Originally Posted by OumaFan

The Pacquaio hate is crazy. ;D Enjoy him while he's here, an exciting fighter who fights anybody.

Please don't complement me again Saddoboxer.

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i'm not hating on Pacquiao, hell i said it VERY clearly that i'm tired of his fan boys, saying that he's gonna win cause he's Pacquiao lol like if that's a fucking reason, and Taeth please don't act so ignorant by trying to compare the DLH that fought Pacquiao with the DLH that fought Trinidad, Vargas, Mosley X2, etc., he weighed in for Forbes at 150, he wasn't 150 come fight time, and he didn't look good against Forbes, hell many people on here said that he got hit way too much and too cleanly against Forbes, so it is valid to say he lost due to the weight and due to his age, wanna try and downplay Marquez and you're only downplaying Pacquiao, seeing how Manny dropped him 3 times in one round and then only managed to get away with a draw, a draw many thought he didn't even deserve, 7 rounds to 5 is how i had it scored like i said making it 114-113 for Marquez due to the KD, if there would have been no knockdown than it would have been 115-113 meaning one round away from a draw, not completely ludicrous scoring, D. Diaz is a joke and hell if Pacquiao wouldn't of dominated him something would have been very wrong, a shot Morales beat Diaz, was robbed, but beat him none the less, Pacquiao/Marquez III should of happened right after Pacquiao/Marquez II, no one can deny they're the top 2 p4p fighters today, so why the hell not just play the 3rd fight already?

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What did Oscar weigh in at against Forbes then? There was nothing to show his weight on fightnight. Also how is David Diaz a joke? He beat Zab Judah to make the olympic team, he stopped Jose Santa Cruz, who lost a split decision to Joel Casamayor. I am not saying he is a great fighter, but the JOel Casamayor isn't a great fighter anymore, he once was a really good one, but not when he fought JMM, and that fight was pretty back and forth. Juan Diaz rocked JMM, and that was another close fight. Unlike JMM Pacquiao was number #2 when guys like Wright and Calzaghe and Hopkins were still active. JMM was behind all of them, and IMO Bernard should still be ahead of him. I am not downplaying JMM by saying Pacquiao is better than himl, JMM is a great fighter, its just you have to admit that he isn't as good as Pacquiao, his record isn't as impressive, his level opposition isn't either. Pacquiao is only getting better, while JMM's skills are fading. The fact is that Pacquiao beat him fair and square in the second fight. Manny isn't fighting bums, he is fighting guys like Oscar De La Hoya, David Diaz, Marquez, Marco Antonio Barrera, Jorge Solis, Morales. And who is he fighting Hatton? the 140 pound king, then going on to Cotto or Mayweather... yeah he is really taking the easy route. About scoring the Pacquiao fight, you clearly must have given two rounds (1 and 11) that should have gone to Pacquiao, at least one of them to Marquez, which means that Marquez shouldn't have won, especially not with the knockdown. I am not saying it was a close fight, but did Mayweather not have difficulties with JLC? Even their second fight was one of his most competitive fights, and still Mayweather is a way better fighter than JLC. Did Roy Jones Jr not have difficulties with Montell Griffin? Willie Pep with Saddler? I am saying that styles make fights, and JMM has the right style to fight Pacquiao, but Pacquiao still finds a way to win. Honestly Mayweather is better than Marquez, he's closer to his prime, he's bigger, he's faster, he's just as technically sound, he's harder to hit. He is a bigger, and new challenge for Pacquiao. Not only that but its a better fight for boxing, it will bring the sport way more media attention. I am not saying Pacquiao and Marquez should never fight again, but right now Pacquiao as p4p king needs to bring the sport into the spotlight, thats what the p4p king does, and fighting Marquez at least right now won't do that. Honestly I am not trying to hump Pacquiao's leg, but he is having the type of career that emulates the guys who are in the top 10 p4p ever.

PS. a "shot" Barrera gave Marquez one hell of a fight, and knocked him down. Don't disrespect Barrera or Morales. I reckon stylewise if Morales fought Marquez anywhere near where he was in his first and second fight against Pacquiao he would given JMM all he could handle. Part of Morales' reason for being shot just like Pacquiao at 130, is that he was killing himself to make 130 by the end, he looked more lively against David Diaz, and it was a really good fight.

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i'm probably the biggest Morales fan on here and i still say Morales was shot against Diaz, i don't necessarily remember what exact rounds i gave Marquez, but how the hell do you know if i gave Marquez the 1 or 11th? are you psychic now? and Montell Griffin and Roy Jones? the first fight was competitive, Roy got serious in the rematch and nearly put Griffin in a coma in the first round, Mayweather lost the first Castillo fight, then fought completely different in the rematch, not willing to engage with him, and boxing from a distance, hit and run, avoiding Castillos body shots, i didn't say Barrera was "shot" when he took on Pacquiao, those are two clear wins for Manny, and no doubt that Barrera was more willing to just last the distance than actually win the rematch

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Originally Posted by Taeth

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Originally Posted by killersheep

ANYWAY

Since this isn't a Pacquiao thread.

Is it just me or does Dan Rafael "report" team Mayweather is in talks with everyone that wins a major fight between 135 and 147?

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I think its because they think they are in talks with Mayweather. And it would make sense, there are so many guys right now that could further promote Mayweather's career that he must be interested with Cotto, Pacquiao, Hatton II, Mosley, Marquez, and if he wins a big fight Andre Berto.

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By "They" do you mean Dan Rafael?

Lets clarify something...

Jmm/Pac #1 was a draw

Jmm/Pac#2 Pac scrapes by for a win

Pac beat him once not twice;)

Also taeth your so full of crap sometimes, you absolutely jump on any athletically gifted fighters lap and denigrate any fighter thats not..

Classic example, you say Pac is better than JMM.. HMMM weird that in 2 fight with Pac, marquez won more rounds oficially and can be argued strongly that Jmm could have got the nod or ideally and deservedly another draw.

Stop trying to argue D Diaz absolute shit credentials, he was an extremely weak title holder, no one gives a crap that he beat Zab to get into the olympics.... Geezus Chrise man, Mike Tyson didnt make the olympic team:rolleyes:

Delahoya at 147 was an absolute zombie, freeze dried shell of the fighter he once was didnt even hydrate to the 160 that he did when he was 10 years younger.

Jmm has done more and looked even more impressive over elite competition, were as Pac fought a once elite Delahoya that was inactive and shot and a weak title holder... Those my friend are undisputable facts

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Originally Posted by JT Rock

Lets clarify something...

Jmm/Pac #1 was a draw

Jmm/Pac#2 Pac scrapes by for a win

Pac beat him once not twice;)

Also taeth your so full of crap sometimes, you absolutely jump on any athletically gifted fighters lap and denigrate any fighter thats not..

Classic example, you say Pac is better than JMM.. HMMM weird that in 2 fight with Pac, marquez won more rounds oficially and can be argued strongly that Jmm could have got the nod or ideally and deservedly another draw.

Stop trying to argue D Diaz absolute shit credentials, he was an extremely weak title holder, no one gives a crap that he beat Zab to get into the olympics.... Geezus Chrise man, Mike Tyson didnt make the olympic team:rolleyes:

Delahoya at 147 was an absolute zombie, freeze dried shell of the fighter he once was didnt even hydrate to the 160 that he did when he was 10 years younger.

Jmm has done more and looked even more impressive over elite competition, were as Pac fought a once elite Delahoya that was inactive and shot and a weak title holder... Those my friend are undisputable facts

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Was Dela Hoya 10 years younger when he KO'ed Mayorga 10x faster and more impressively than Mosley? Was he 10 years younger when he fought competitive fights with Hopkins and Mayweather?

How has JMM done more at the elite level? You are the one talking crap. JMM doesn't even have half the elite level fights that Pacquiao has had. Pacquiao has foughten four ATG's and has come out of nine confrontation 8-1-1(4ko's). You say Oscar is shot yet fail to recognize that Joel Casamayor has been shot for a few years. Oscar had the best sparring partners imaginable to get ready for Pacman, the best trainers, everything. Don't use inactivity as an excuse. Pacquiao looked better both times against Barrera if you want to compare a common opponent. I am not denigrating JMM, I am stating the obvious that he isn't as good as Pacquiao. That's why he isn't p4p#1, thats why he struggled with a decent but not great Juan Diaz.

Once again Bowe won 2 out of 3 fights against Holyfield, he wasn't the greater fighter, Saddler won 3 out of 4 fights with Pep, he wasn't the greater fighter. Buster Douglas beat Tyson, he wasn't the greater fighter, styles make fights, and Marquez employs the perfect strategy against Pacquiao.

I was just making a point with David Diaz in that he isn't the worst fighter ever, he is a decent fighter. He wasn't hte best that the lightweight division had to offer. As for Oscar De La Hoya, he would have beaten Marquez even on that night, a guy who is easy to hit, who isn't unorthodox, who is that much shorter, and more importantly Oscar's jab and left hook would be lined up. If people watched Oscar against PAcquiao then against Mayweather, you will see that its movement that killed him, he wasn't able to get off punches because Manny wasn't there, he employed brilliant footwork.

Also in this case I think Mayweather, Berto, Roy Jones Jr are all better athletes than Pacquiao, and I like first and the latter more than Pacquiao, but I still recognize that he has accomplished more with his career, because he has more heart, he wants to fight best, and he succeeds when he does.

Once again its bullshit to say PAcquiao has only foughten a once elite De La Hoya, he also faced Barrera twice, Morales 3 times, MArquez twice, not to mention other very highly ranked individuals.

Either you know nothing about boxing or you know nothing east Pacquiao's career if this is the refuse you spew forth.

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

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Originally Posted by Killface

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

umm you mean the fact that since last Saturday Pacquiao's hold at #1 p4p is much in doubt by a lot of fans and sportswriters, seeing how many consider Marquez now the #1 p4p fighter in the world, and how if he does fight Marquez and beat him, he can once again scoop up 2 HUGE PPV fights back to back being against JM Marquez and then against the winner of Pacquiao/Hatton, that enough of an explanation for you? oh wait, if i don't mention Pacquiao as the MAIN reason well it doesn't make sense to you

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Well Marquez didn't beat Pac to get to #1, Pac beat Marquez 2x, why does Pac need to beat Marquez to remain at #1? Pac beats Hatton, that's a bigger opponent than Diaz and if he fights Cotto or Mayweather next that's hardly ducking a guy he already beat and Pac makes way more money against both guys.

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look at Pacs last two opponents and look at Marquez's last two opponents, i'd say that Pacs are second tier compared to JMM, i like Pacquiao but the nutthuggers are now doing to him what the PBF fan boys would do with Mayweather, anyone notice how when PBF retired and about 90% of his fan boys shut the fuck up, everyone started appreciating Mayweather a hell of a lot more, well it's happening now with Pacquiao, his fans say he's gonna win just cause he's Manny Pacquiao, cause he's the king of all the Filipinos:rolleyes:, that's hardly a reason, hell i said it time and time again, Pacquiao will push anyone, and is a hard fight for anyone, he looked great against Oscar and Diaz, but to be honest, i think Andre Berto, who by the way i've made it clear that i don't find him to be anything special, would have beaten Oscar just as bad, i felt Marquez out boxed Pac in the rematch just as he did in the first fight, i had it 7 rnds to 5, being 114-113 for JMM (due to the kd), he would catch Pacquiao with cleaner shots more often and also countered him most the night, i don't diss Pacquiao for taking on Hatton cause it's the biggest risk he's taken since the Marquez rematch, and also he's willing to take on Hatton at 140 which is his best weight, but no one can deny the simple fact that just like the Vazquez/R.Marquez fights, JMM/Pac III should of happened right after the second fight

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Everyone has slumps in opposition. You don't like De La Hoya and Diaz (as if Marquez wouldn't have fought De La Hoya?)? Well now Hatton is fighting Pac and if Manny wins maybe he fights Mayweather. Like I said, Manny doesn't need to fight Marquez to stay at #1. I don't have a problem with them not fighting again- he fought him twice already and technically beat him twice (scoring error on a judge's part). So long as there are legit fights out there for Manny the fans would like to see I have 0 problem with him not taking on Marquez a 3rd time. Let's not revise history. Virtually everyone had Manny losing to Oscar and he handed him his hat. It isn't abnormal to take on a tune-up fight when one moves up in weight and Diaz was more than a legit opponent for that. Manny tore both guys to shreds. Wasn't Joel Casamayor faded when Marquez took him apart? Juan Diaz was a good W, but he certainly wasn't as good as we all used to think. Now everyone is going to know how (KNOW, but not necessarily be able to execute) to beat Diaz. If Manny tears it up at 140 and Marquez comes up and does the same then maybe I can see it late next year or early 2011, but to hop all over Manny when he's got legit big paydays coming up is just flat out wrong.

I think that the Mayweather that retired would stop Marquez at any weight of 140 or above. Floyd was too fast and skilled defensively and I dont think Marquez would have the power at 140 or above to bother Money. If Juan Diaz could lay some leather on Marquez, it would be like taking candy from a baby for the money man.........

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Originally Posted by Hunter

I think that the Mayweather that retired would stop Marquez at any weight of 140 or above. Floyd was too fast and skilled defensively and I dont think Marquez would have the power at 140 or above to bother Money. If Juan Diaz could lay some leather on Marquez, it would be like taking candy from a baby for the money man.........

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100% agreed. I like both Diaz and Marquez but Mayweather is a class above both!

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Originally Posted by Taeth

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Originally Posted by JT Rock

Lets clarify something...

Jmm/Pac #1 was a draw

Jmm/Pac#2 Pac scrapes by for a win

Pac beat him once not twice;)

Also taeth your so full of crap sometimes, you absolutely jump on any athletically gifted fighters lap and denigrate any fighter thats not..

Classic example, you say Pac is better than JMM.. HMMM weird that in 2 fight with Pac, marquez won more rounds oficially and can be argued strongly that Jmm could have got the nod or ideally and deservedly another draw.

Stop trying to argue D Diaz absolute shit credentials, he was an extremely weak title holder, no one gives a crap that he beat Zab to get into the olympics.... Geezus Chrise man, Mike Tyson didnt make the olympic team:rolleyes:

Delahoya at 147 was an absolute zombie, freeze dried shell of the fighter he once was didnt even hydrate to the 160 that he did when he was 10 years younger.

Jmm has done more and looked even more impressive over elite competition, were as Pac fought a once elite Delahoya that was inactive and shot and a weak title holder... Those my friend are undisputable facts

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Was Dela Hoya 10 years younger when he KO'ed Mayorga 10x faster and more impressively than Mosley? Was he 10 years younger when he fought competitive fights with Hopkins and Mayweather?

How has JMM done more at the elite level? You are the one talking crap. JMM doesn't even have half the elite level fights that Pacquiao has had. Pacquiao has foughten four ATG's and has come out of nine confrontation 8-1-1(4ko's). You say Oscar is shot yet fail to recognize that Joel Casamayor has been shot for a few years. Oscar had the best sparring partners imaginable to get ready for Pacman, the best trainers, everything. Don't use inactivity as an excuse. Pacquiao looked better both times against Barrera if you want to compare a common opponent. I am not denigrating JMM, I am stating the obvious that he isn't as good as Pacquiao. That's why he isn't p4p#1, thats why he struggled with a decent but not great Juan Diaz.

Once again Bowe won 2 out of 3 fights against Holyfield, he wasn't the greater fighter, Saddler won 3 out of 4 fights with Pep, he wasn't the greater fighter. Buster Douglas beat Tyson, he wasn't the greater fighter, styles make fights, and Marquez employs the perfect strategy against Pacquiao.

I was just making a point with David Diaz in that he isn't the worst fighter ever, he is a decent fighter. He wasn't hte best that the lightweight division had to offer. As for Oscar De La Hoya, he would have beaten Marquez even on that night, a guy who is easy to hit, who isn't unorthodox, who is that much shorter, and more importantly Oscar's jab and left hook would be lined up. If people watched Oscar against PAcquiao then against Mayweather, you will see that its movement that killed him, he wasn't able to get off punches because Manny wasn't there, he employed brilliant footwork.

Also in this case I think Mayweather, Berto, Roy Jones Jr are all better athletes than Pacquiao, and I like first and the latter more than Pacquiao, but I still recognize that he has accomplished more with his career, because he has more heart, he wants to fight best, and he succeeds when he does.

Once again its bullshit to say PAcquiao has only foughten a once elite De La Hoya, he also faced Barrera twice, Morales 3 times, MArquez twice, not to mention other very highly ranked individuals.

Either you know nothing about boxing or you know nothing east Pacquiao's career if this is the refuse you spew forth.

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Many writers including Dan Rafael rank JMM achievments highr than both Barrera and Morales..

Delahoya hasnt fought 147 for almost a decade

You have ignored the fact that JMM has won more rounds against Pac in 2 combined fights.

Casamayor was the recognized Ring Champion at 135 and had been fighting at that weight all along.... Not an inactive fighter, competing at a weight he hadnt fought in 10 years... Were was Oscar ranked at the time of the fight? Certainly not ranked as high as Casa.

You are the one with questionable knowledge