Is he going to man up and accept vitali's challenge to fight him at wembley? Read on sky sports vitali wants this, I really hope it does happen.
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Is he going to man up and accept vitali's challenge to fight him at wembley? Read on sky sports vitali wants this, I really hope it does happen.
Of course he will. I hope they don't take so long holding out and hyping the fight this time. I'm sure it will be another UD, Haye coming out without a scratch.
Of course, I'll watch the fight anyway in hopes they prove me wrong.
u guys are actually excited by this? sad.
vitali is the best hw in the world. haye doesnt have a chance and will get punished really bad if he were to accept. who in their right mind would WANT to see haye again after that fiasco.
Me.Quote:
Originally Posted by #1FightFan
and me :)
Gotta say me too. The Klits are without doubt the dominant force in HW boxing right now, and Wlad was too good defensively for Haye. Vitali isn't as good defensively and his footwork is nowhere near as good as Wlads either. On the other hand he is much the "tougher guy" and he will make Haye fight back where Wlad couldn't because he will take more chances. I think Haye vs Vitali would be a better fight.
I think if Haye comes in this fight with 10 good toes then he has a decent chance....especially if he gets a petticure he should be rampant and beat Klit on a split hair decision
job biscuit (split hair decision...i kill me)!!!
eh eh!!!
Haye doesn't deserve another shot, but it would be justice to see him knocked out. Wlad is the weaker of the two brothers by a considerable margin. Vitali would stomp on his younger brother and slaughter Haye.
http://www.fightnews.com/Boxing/haye-rips-vitali-2-95420
Looks like this is heating up, I really dont understand Haye he's really just digging a big hole! He better not be a bitch and have any excuses for the vitali fight.
Quote:
Originally Posted by miles
why would it be justice?
haye doesnt deserve a title shot straight away but like it or not Haye is still the most dangerous opponent for the Klits at the minute
he has little chance of winning but more than anyone else
I think so too. Povetkin has zero chance of actually winning.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44
As much as I like Chambers, he has no chance either.
I'm not sure what's up with Demintriko, but he is lacking something, so I don't give him much chance either.
Most of the others are either too old, too green (Helenius) or too rusty.
Actually I would like to see Arreola vs Wladimir. That's about it though.
I wish market forces weren't driving the fight game into the ridiculous scenario where Haye gets to fight both champions, coming into the HW division from cruiser and bypassing the more deserving top ten contenders, especially since he doesn't have a snowball's chance in hell against Vitali. Ridiculous.
I would like to see Haye have to fight his way up through the division. Especially I would like to see Haye fight Hellenius, Arreola, Dimetrenko, Povotkin. Boytsov, Chagaev. Anyone in the top ten. For Vitali to fight Haye after his unexciting performances against Vlad, Ruiz and Valuev is just not good for boxing. It's only good for short-term profit. In this day and age no-one thinks about the long term. Us boxing fans should wise up and pull an all-out sit-down stay-away strike against this Haye vs. Vitali fight.
I also think he'd get his ass whipped a few times if he had to fight his way up. There's good talent in the heavyweight division now.
Yep Provetkin and Chambers would never beat a Klit coz they cant punchQuote:
Originally Posted by ninjaspy3I think so too. Povetkin has zero chance of actually winning.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44
As much as I like Chambers, he has no chance either.
I'm not sure what's up with Demintriko, but he is lacking something, so I don't give him much chance either.
Most of the others are either too old, too green (Helenius) or too rusty.
Actually I would like to see Arreola vs Wladimir. That's about it though.
with helenius tho you never know, he has some good impressive wins, i am starting to be convinced, i used to think he was just fighting these x champs at the right time but even so he is doing a very good job
I'm not sure about arreola v Wlad, Id watch it but i think it would be a one sided beating like the rest
who do you think would beat him?Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Hughey
This time around people won't be fooled into thinking Haye has a chance and there will be much less excitement. Only in England people are fans still excited about Haye even after his dismal showing last time out. Haye doesn't have half the chin Adamek has and Vitali is more ruthless than Wlad, so this one won't go the distance.
Remind me again: why do we want Haye to get another pay check when he doesn't deserve it and he has no chance in this fight?
ninjapsy3 is GermanQuote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat
Adamek doesn't have head movement though. He is not very elusive. So I think that part evens out as Haye has at least proven that he can dodge. I mean seriously, who esle has dodged Wlad's punches? Byrd? Anyway, at least Haye has some power in his punch to at least keep things interesting. When Adamek hit Vitali, you could not tell it had happened. I don't think Haye will win but he has the physical traits to perform better than Adamek.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat
Haye's worst enemy is his low work rate I think.
Trust me, only the stupid public (and erics44) will be excited by this farce. The vast majority of proper boxing fans can't stand the fraud anymore.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat
I mustnt be part of the stupid public then :)Quote:
Originally Posted by boxingbantzTrust me, only the stupid public (and erics44) will be excited by this farce. The vast majority of proper boxing fans can't stand the fraud anymore.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat
how many boxers have boasted about what they will achieve in the ring and not managed it?
If Ortiz loses on saturday is he a fraud?
Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44
NO he is not. Robert Helenius is!!!! At least the finnish giant tries!
How can someone be dangerous when they are running the whole time, and not throwing any punches???? Solis deserves another shot too. He was landing quite a bit till he hurt his knee/leg.
I like helenius, and i agree he could be one to challenge in the future, at the minute he is very inexperienced, IMO at the minute Haye stands more of a chance with his speed, i think both brothers would have a reasonably easy time with helenius, its a hard one to call thoQuote:
Originally Posted by #1FightFanQuote:
Originally Posted by erics44
NO he is not. Robert Helenius is!!!! At least the finnish giant tries!
How can someone be dangerous when they are running the whole time, and not throwing any punches???? Solis deserves another shot too. He was landing quite a bit till he hurt his knee/leg.
When Solis and Vitali fought i thought Solis was winning the round and that is the first time I have seen Vitali losing a round for a long time. He did hurt his leg but he was badly shaken by the punch, bad leg or not it wouldnt have lasted much longer. So does a guy who was blown away still have a better chance than haye?
Isnt solis still injured anyway?
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They didn't face the same opponent. Why are we convinced Haye has more power in his punch? Who has he knocked out that was had a big-time chin? Even giving Haye the advantage in punching power, Haye is facing the tougher Klitschko. I thought his punching power would only help him against Wlad who has a suspect chin. Vitali's chin is anything but suspect. I don't believe he's ever even been on the canvas (right?). Moreover, why would Haye change his strategy from when he faced Wlad with his fight against Vitali? He'll still run around in circles and be afraid to engage and it'll lead to a boring fight. Thus, if we know he is going down in defeat, the fight will be boring, and he hasn't fought anyone to merit the title shot, I ask again, why are we supporting it?Quote:
Originally Posted by ninjaspy3Adamek doesn't have head movement though. He is not very elusive. So I think that part evens out as Haye has at least proven that he can dodge. I mean seriously, who esle has dodged Wlad's punches? Byrd? Anyway, at least Haye has some power in his punch to at least keep things interesting. When Adamek hit Vitali, you could not tell it had happened. I don't think Haye will win but he has the physical traits to perform better than Adamek.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat
Haye's worst enemy is his low work rate I think.
If Haye is such a showman and entertainer and has so many fans, why doesn't he fight Arreola and then Povetkin and then challenge Klitschko? He makes more money and he earns his title shot and proves that he is the best challenger out there for Vitali. Right?
No I think you have it all wrong. A real fan cant be so fickle as to give up on a fighter because of one lousy fight. You are obviously not a fan.Quote:
Originally Posted by boxingbantzTrust me, only the stupid public (and erics44) will be excited by this farce. The vast majority of proper boxing fans can't stand the fraud anymore.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat
Second thing is that there are plenty of fights that it would be worth watching Haye fight.
1 Fluke fight does not a fraud make. Say that one three times fast :-)
Main thing is, you cannot speak for everyone. Only for yourself. And it's silly to believe that everyone with the opposing opinion is stupid.
Oh Vitali. Why give him another pay day?
Hard to addmit but Adamek, while being brave, has 0% chances. He was too slow, too weak to break to the defence of Vitali. David Haye had better chanches to surprise Vladimir. But looks like he didn't have courage enough to try. He just wanted to survive to keep his trashtalking machine alive.Quote:
Originally Posted by ninjaspy3Adamek doesn't have head movement though. He is not very elusive. So I think that part evens out as Haye has at least proven that he can dodge. I mean seriously, who esle has dodged Wlad's punches? Byrd? Anyway, at least Haye has some power in his punch to at least keep things interesting. When Adamek hit Vitali, you could not tell it had happened. I don't think Haye will win but he has the physical traits to perform better than Adamek.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat
Haye's worst enemy is his low work rate I think.
Man, he has more power that Adamek for sure, can we at least agree on that one??Quote:
Originally Posted by RantcatratThey didn't face the same opponent. Why are we convinced Haye has more power in his punch? Who has he knocked out that was had a big-time chin? Even giving Haye the advantage in punching power, Haye is facing the tougher Klitschko. I thought his punching power would only help him against Wlad who has a suspect chin. Vitali's chin is anything but suspect. I don't believe he's ever even been on the canvas (right?). Moreover, why would Haye change his strategy from when he faced Wlad with his fight against Vitali? He'll still run around in circles and be afraid to engage and it'll lead to a boring fight. Thus, if we know he is going down in defeat, the fight will be boring, and he hasn't fought anyone to merit the title shot, I ask again, why are we supporting it?Quote:
Originally Posted by ninjaspy3Adamek doesn't have head movement though. He is not very elusive. So I think that part evens out as Haye has at least proven that he can dodge. I mean seriously, who esle has dodged Wlad's punches? Byrd? Anyway, at least Haye has some power in his punch to at least keep things interesting. When Adamek hit Vitali, you could not tell it had happened. I don't think Haye will win but he has the physical traits to perform better than Adamek.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat
Haye's worst enemy is his low work rate I think.
If Haye is such a showman and entertainer and has so many fans, why doesn't he fight Arreola and then Povetkin and then challenge Klitschko? He makes more money and he earns his title shot and proves that he is the best challenger out there for Vitali. Right?
And what is all this with "running". Im so tired of hearing it. I have seen fights where it really did look like one fighter was running but for God's sake, why are so many people confusing dodging punches with running. There is a difference. And it is not a sin to be elusive and make the other guy miss.
It's like people are just seeing what they wanted to see.
The problem was not that Haye "ran". The problem was that he dodged but did not follow up with counters enough, he did not commit to some of the shots, and he needs to increase his work-rate. If everyone wants to be a critic, at least let it be valid crticism.
I'm not even sure who would beat him. Hellenius could, that's for sure. Arreola could. I think Adamek could (unless he is now brain damaged). Povetkin. Any of those top ten have a chance, and we'd get some real fights because Haye would come out of the closet and try to win, like he used to at cruiserweight, not just duck and dodge to survive and get paid. I'd love to see those fights. Instead, we are going to get Haye-Vitali. Snore.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44who do you think would beat him?Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Hughey
Haye is now just one of the top ten contenders. It's a talented group of fighters. I wish they'd have a tournament to see who gets to fight a Klit. Not sure Haye would win, not at all sure. I am sure he doesn't deserve to fight for a title right now.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave HugheyI'm not even sure who would beat him. Hellenius could, that's for sure. Arreola could. I think Adamek could (unless he is now brain damaged). Povetkin. Any of those top ten have a chance, and we'd get some real fights because Haye would come out of the closet and try to win, like he used to at cruiserweight, not just duck and dodge to survive and get paid. I'd love to see those fights. Instead, we are going to get Haye-Vitali. Snore.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44who do you think would beat him?Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Hughey
In boxing a fraud needs to be knocked out. That is the justice.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44Quote:
Originally Posted by miles
why would it be justice?
It happens to all but a few in good time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave HugheyI'm not even sure who would beat him. Hellenius could, that's for sure. Arreola could. I think Adamek could (unless he is now brain damaged). Povetkin. Any of those top ten have a chance, and we'd get some real fights because Haye would come out of the closet and try to win, like he used to at cruiserweight, not just duck and dodge to survive and get paid. I'd love to see those fights. Instead, we are going to get Haye-Vitali. Snore.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44who do you think would beat him?Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Hughey
ademek and areloa could but 99 times out of 100 wouldnt
provetkin could, but whats the point he has no power and has no chance against a klit
helenius looks good at the minute, is he ready?
Quote:
Originally Posted by milesIn boxing a fraud needs to be knocked out. That is the justice.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44Quote:
Originally Posted by miles
why would it be justice?
It happens to all but a few in good time.
as i said in an earlier post, boxers constantly boast about what they will do in the ring and come up short
if Ortiz loses to mayweather on saturday is he a fraud?
Helenius would get battered off Haye. That I would guarantee.Quote:
Originally Posted by #1FightFanQuote:
Originally Posted by erics44
NO he is not. Robert Helenius is!!!! At least the finnish giant tries!
How can someone be dangerous when they are running the whole time, and not throwing any punches???? Solis deserves another shot too. He was landing quite a bit till he hurt his knee/leg.
I think People are getting too high on this guy beating way past their best bums. Yes he looked good beating a very worn Liakovich, but this is a guy who in his prime got beat off fucking Maurice Harris. Also it took Helenius 6 rounds to get rid of Scott Gammer FFS. Yes the same Scott Gammer who got beat off the amazing Coleman Barrett who Audley Harrison then sparked out the same night.
I know Haye hasn't got a who's who of Heavyweight boxing on his record, but for me he is way too too elusive for Helenius and "the Nordic Nightmare" takes too many shots for a big puncher like Haye not to take advantage. The Klitschko's are clearly the best in the division and they are on their own, then it is Haye and he is in the second bracket on his own IMO. I think Povetkin is next in line but against either Klitschko, I'm not sure he carries the power to worry them whereas Helenius does but he seems far too predictable and as I said easy to hit.
Ortiz has never reached the level of arrogance and subsequent cowardice that Haye has. Ortiz is a lion, Haye is merely a running, gurning hyena. At least in quitting Ortiz showed some level of heart, Haye showed NONE against Wlad. A disgusting showing and one that deserves the wrath of all boxing fans and the ultimate beat down at the hands of Vitali.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44Quote:
Originally Posted by milesIn boxing a fraud needs to be knocked out. That is the justice.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44Quote:
Originally Posted by miles
why would it be justice?
It happens to all but a few in good time.
as i said in an earlier post, boxers constantly boast about what they will do in the ring and come up short
if Ortiz loses to mayweather on saturday is he a fraud?
Time to stick a nail in the coffin of the modern day fraud that is David Haye.
99 out of 100 times? You think Haye is that good, do you? I don't. I think he is just another one of the top contenders. I think on any given day any of the ten top contenders would have a 50/50 chance at Haye. Yeah, I'd like to see Haye and Helenius get it on.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave HugheyI'm not even sure who would beat him. Hellenius could, that's for sure. Arreola could. I think Adamek could (unless he is now brain damaged). Povetkin. Any of those top ten have a chance, and we'd get some real fights because Haye would come out of the closet and try to win, like he used to at cruiserweight, not just duck and dodge to survive and get paid. I'd love to see those fights. Instead, we are going to get Haye-Vitali. Snore.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44who do you think would beat him?Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Hughey
ademek and areloa could but 99 times out of 100 wouldnt
provetkin could, but whats the point he has no power and has no chance against a klit
helenius looks good at the minute, is he ready?
he hasnt reached the level of arrogance to you, and in your opinion hayes performance was cowardiceQuote:
Originally Posted by milesOrtiz has never reached the level of arrogance and subsequent cowardice that Haye has. Ortiz is a lion, Haye is merely a running, gurning hyena. At least in quitting Ortiz showed some level of heart, Haye showed NONE against Wlad. A disgusting showing and one that deserves the wrath of all boxing fans and the ultimate beat down at the hands of Vitali.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44Quote:
Originally Posted by milesIn boxing a fraud needs to be knocked out. That is the justice.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44Quote:
Originally Posted by miles
why would it be justice?
It happens to all but a few in good time.
as i said in an earlier post, boxers constantly boast about what they will do in the ring and come up short
if Ortiz loses to mayweather on saturday is he a fraud?
Time to stick a nail in the coffin of the modern day fraud that is David Haye.
so whats the cut off point, when does someone become and fraud and stay genuine? A lot of people were calling Ortiz a quitter after his fights against Maidana and Peterson, if Ortiz puts on that sort of display against mayweather is he a fraud?
after all in every interview I have heard so far he has claimed he would win and keep his belt
yep 99 times out of 100, and its not all about haye being that good its about the limitations of adamek and areolaQuote:
Originally Posted by Dave Hughey99 out of 100 times? You think Haye is that good, do you? I don't. I think he is just another one of the top contenders. I think on any given day any of the ten top contenders would have a 50/50 chance at Haye. Yeah, I'd like to see Haye and Helenius get it on.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave HugheyI'm not even sure who would beat him. Hellenius could, that's for sure. Arreola could. I think Adamek could (unless he is now brain damaged). Povetkin. Any of those top ten have a chance, and we'd get some real fights because Haye would come out of the closet and try to win, like he used to at cruiserweight, not just duck and dodge to survive and get paid. I'd love to see those fights. Instead, we are going to get Haye-Vitali. Snore.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44who do you think would beat him?Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Hughey
ademek and areloa could but 99 times out of 100 wouldnt
provetkin could, but whats the point he has no power and has no chance against a klit
helenius looks good at the minute, is he ready?
hayes a cunt, im not denying that but you cant let that get in the way of your judgement when it comes to his skills
I don't think Haye's a cunt. I like the guy. He's smart. He's onto a good thing and I don't blame him for exploiting it. He's got good defensive skills and he's counting on being able to dodge Vitali like he did Wlad and coming out of the fight rich and with his brain intact. But as a fight fan, I am disappointed with the whole scenario. I'd like to see him try and fight his way up through the division and truly earn a title shot.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44yep 99 times out of 100, and its not all about haye being that good its about the limitations of adamek and areolaQuote:
Originally Posted by Dave Hughey99 out of 100 times? You think Haye is that good, do you? I don't. I think he is just another one of the top contenders. I think on any given day any of the ten top contenders would have a 50/50 chance at Haye. Yeah, I'd like to see Haye and Helenius get it on.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave HugheyI'm not even sure who would beat him. Hellenius could, that's for sure. Arreola could. I think Adamek could (unless he is now brain damaged). Povetkin. Any of those top ten have a chance, and we'd get some real fights because Haye would come out of the closet and try to win, like he used to at cruiserweight, not just duck and dodge to survive and get paid. I'd love to see those fights. Instead, we are going to get Haye-Vitali. Snore.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44who do you think would beat him?Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Hughey
ademek and areloa could but 99 times out of 100 wouldnt
provetkin could, but whats the point he has no power and has no chance against a klit
helenius looks good at the minute, is he ready?
hayes a cunt, im not denying that but you cant let that get in the way of your judgement when it comes to his skills
Helenius has been underrated so far even by the finns. But if we take a look at all his fights we surely understand he's becoming better and better all the time. He ain't slow considering his seize (6' 7" and 240 lbs). He has technic, ain't stupid, got self-discipline, hard punches with good combinations too. Even when he was beating Samuel Peter, Lamon Brewster and Siarlei Liakhovic brutally and effectively we didn't see the whole scale of Robert Heleinius. The most important thing - he will be near in future much better.Quote:
Originally Posted by rjj tszyuHelenius would get battered off Haye. That I would guarantee.Quote:
Originally Posted by #1FightFanQuote:
Originally Posted by erics44
NO he is not. Robert Helenius is!!!! At least the finnish giant tries!
How can someone be dangerous when they are running the whole time, and not throwing any punches???? Solis deserves another shot too. He was landing quite a bit till he hurt his knee/leg.
As i've mentioned before, Helenius was little bit too lazy using his left jab during that Liakhovic-fight. He addmitted it too. On the other hand his footwork, moving was much, much better than in e.g Scott Gammer-fight. Forget that Gammer-night. Even when Helenius destroyed him, that british fellow was just a bum in the ring. Liakhovic has been so far the biggest test for Helenius. He passed it well, though might have done some things much better. I find no reason why Helenius couldn't maul big mouth twat Haye too. However i prefer Helenius not wasting time to punish clowns like Haye. He and his team are planning to have 1-2 good test fights before facing mighty Klitschko.
In this moment i see Helenius hardly even 10% chance to beat Klitschko but if his development is steady he might have - let's say 30% chance to win the tittle (against Klitschko brothers). That's the upper level he will ever reach.
These guys are in ranking list above Helenius now: Povetkin, Adamek, Haye and Chambers. Haye was a clown and Adamek beaten very badly. So let's give Povetkin a chance to try it, then Chambers. When they have lost and Helenius (hopely) have won his test fights (1-2) it's his turn. It will be in late 2012 or early 2013.