After watching a prime Roy Jones on TV last night he was far from unbeatable.

[intoccabile]

Do you know the chronology of this? The big fight between Roy and Dariusz was before Roy ever moved up to heavyweight, and Dariusz ended up losing to a guy Roy pummelled for 12 rounds in Julio Gonzalez anyways. Dariusz was overrated.

Did you watch the ROy JOnes jr- Bernard Hopkins fight? By the middle Roy was landing 50% of his shots to like 20% connection for Bernard. A few times Bernard thought he had Roy figured out only to come out the next round and have Roy make the adjustments that would totally throw Bernard off again. All this was done without him being able to throw his right cross effectively. He was throwing it with an open hand all night. Roy wasn't as effective as he was in some fights, but he still won almost every round until he took off the last few, and he was still just as green as Bernard was, it took him like 5-6 rounds to even open up. Bernard couldn't deal with his speed or elusiveness. Which is the key point ,Roy wasn't just speed, he was as elusive as anyone, thats what him different in some ways from guys like Ali, Leonard, Michael Nunn, is that Roy was extremely hard to hit anywhere, while the other guys weren't quite as concerned about getting hit.

REwatch the bhop fight bro. It was far from easy.
I rewatched it and to my suprise, i actually have bhop winning this time!

[Tysonbruno]

Do you know the chronology of this? The big fight between Roy and Dariusz was before Roy ever moved up to heavyweight, and Dariusz ended up losing to a guy Roy pummelled for 12 rounds in Julio Gonzalez anyways. Dariusz was overrated.

Did you watch the ROy JOnes jr- Bernard Hopkins fight? By the middle Roy was landing 50% of his shots to like 20% connection for Bernard. A few times Bernard thought he had Roy figured out only to come out the next round and have Roy make the adjustments that would totally throw Bernard off again. All this was done without him being able to throw his right cross effectively. He was throwing it with an open hand all night. Roy wasn't as effective as he was in some fights, but he still won almost every round until he took off the last few, and he was still just as green as Bernard was, it took him like 5-6 rounds to even open up. Bernard couldn't deal with his speed or elusiveness. Which is the key point ,Roy wasn't just speed, he was as elusive as anyone, thats what him different in some ways from guys like Ali, Leonard, Michael Nunn, is that Roy was extremely hard to hit anywhere, while the other guys weren't quite as concerned about getting hit.

REwatch the bhop fight bro. It was far from easy.
I rewatched it and to my suprise, i actually have bhop winning this time!

What you have Hopkins beating Roy Jones?

[Drago]

Do you know the chronology of this? The big fight between Roy and Dariusz was before Roy ever moved up to heavyweight, and Dariusz ended up losing to a guy Roy pummelled for 12 rounds in Julio Gonzalez anyways. Dariusz was overrated.

Did you watch the ROy JOnes jr- Bernard Hopkins fight? By the middle Roy was landing 50% of his shots to like 20% connection for Bernard. A few times Bernard thought he had Roy figured out only to come out the next round and have Roy make the adjustments that would totally throw Bernard off again. All this was done without him being able to throw his right cross effectively. He was throwing it with an open hand all night. Roy wasn't as effective as he was in some fights, but he still won almost every round until he took off the last few, and he was still just as green as Bernard was, it took him like 5-6 rounds to even open up. Bernard couldn't deal with his speed or elusiveness. Which is the key point ,Roy wasn't just speed, he was as elusive as anyone, thats what him different in some ways from guys like Ali, Leonard, Michael Nunn, is that Roy was extremely hard to hit anywhere, while the other guys weren't quite as concerned about getting hit.

REwatch the bhop fight bro. It was far from easy.
I rewatched it and to my suprise, i actually have bhop winning this time!

even bhop said he lost that one

[Mr140]

Alright did not ask you how they looked i asked who had the best wins and to me that is Oscar and i think he should get some credit for it. Roy never had to step it up as much as Oscar did and Oscar had to do it alot. So dont you think but i can see your point still say Oscars higher.

[Mr140]

As for Evander Holyfeild i say he is to cruiser what Roy is to Light heavy. It took alot to get Evander to make it Heavyweight he could of stayed at CW for alot more years but he would of not got the glory that he has. You say that Tyson was past it but Evander was older with a bad hart and still kicked the crap out of him and he was let me see 35 what was roy doing at 35 well let me see getting knocked the f*** out if i can remeber. Also the Lewis stomping him lets not forget that he was 37 and still with heart problems still has them i dont see how they could let him fight. Toney was weight drain to all hell when Roy fought him and Toney was not at his best not taking away form Roy just Toney had problems. Both him and Bernard were green and not prime so i kinda take that with a grain of salt neither was at his best and they never rematched so what ever. You bring up the close fight with Dwight but that was Evander 12 fight and we all saw what happen in the rematch he destroyed him so all i am saying why not Evander pound for pound he has done just as much but does not get the credit i think he should. I think you can poke holes through any mans career but i can say this Evander ducked no one i can not say the same for Roy and to me i think thats why i always like Evander better.

[Wayne]

As for Evander Holyfeild i say he is to cruiser what Roy is to Light heavy. It took alot to get Evander to make it Heavyweight he could of stayed at CW for alot more years but he would of not got the glory that he has. You say that Tyson was past it but Evander was older with a bad hart and still kicked the crap out of him and he was let me see 35 what was roy doing at 35 well let me see getting knocked the f*** out if i can remeber. Also the Lewis stomping him lets not forget that he was 37 and still with heart problems still has them i dont see how they could let him fight. Toney was weight drain to all hell when Roy fought him and Toney was not at his best not taking away form Roy just Toney had problems. Both him and Bernard were green and not prime so i kinda take that with a grain of salt neither was at his best and they never rematched so what ever. You bring up the close fight with Dwight but that was Evander 12 fight and we all saw what happen in the rematch he destroyed him so all i am saying why not Evander pound for pound he has done just as much but does not get the credit i think he should. I think you can poke holes through any mans career but i can say this Evander ducked no one i can not say the same for Roy and to me i think thats why i always like Evander better.

Holyfield does not have heart problems. There were other things at issue. If Evander truly had a bad ticker he wouldn't have been cleared medically.

[intoccabile]

Do you know the chronology of this? The big fight between Roy and Dariusz was before Roy ever moved up to heavyweight, and Dariusz ended up losing to a guy Roy pummelled for 12 rounds in Julio Gonzalez anyways. Dariusz was overrated.

Did you watch the ROy JOnes jr- Bernard Hopkins fight? By the middle Roy was landing 50% of his shots to like 20% connection for Bernard. A few times Bernard thought he had Roy figured out only to come out the next round and have Roy make the adjustments that would totally throw Bernard off again. All this was done without him being able to throw his right cross effectively. He was throwing it with an open hand all night. Roy wasn't as effective as he was in some fights, but he still won almost every round until he took off the last few, and he was still just as green as Bernard was, it took him like 5-6 rounds to even open up. Bernard couldn't deal with his speed or elusiveness. Which is the key point ,Roy wasn't just speed, he was as elusive as anyone, thats what him different in some ways from guys like Ali, Leonard, Michael Nunn, is that Roy was extremely hard to hit anywhere, while the other guys weren't quite as concerned about getting hit.

REwatch the bhop fight bro. It was far from easy.
I rewatched it and to my suprise, i actually have bhop winning this time!

even bhop said he lost that one

Which is what makes it so weird rofl.,
2 other people on here said they rewatched it aswell and actually had bernard by a point.
The fight was just so boring..but honestly.. it's worth a rewatch.
Fighters who don't get off like they want to in a fight or never get
in a rhythm or comfortable like Bernard clearly was the entire night, often times
wont dispute the decision if they lose...But he actually did pretty good dispite having
not perfected his craft yet.

During that time bernard was a "killer". He had a great body attack and would often times
stalk his opponent. He showed tremendous respect for Roys ability and did none of that in their fight. Obviously, Bernard is an entirely different fighter today.. which is why I never look at the Roy/Bhop fight as a huge win for Roy. If i beat on an infant today and he becomes a world champion in thirty years, does that make him a significant win for me?

Bhop was highly regarded and a great fighter at the time they fought, but he, imo, had no where near the knowledge of the game he has now. He's a much more dangerous adversary now and i actually have the fight alot closer after rewatching than I did before.

[Bomp]

Alright did not ask you how they looked i asked who had the best wins and to me that is Oscar and i think he should get some credit for it. Roy never had to step it up as much as Oscar did and Oscar had to do it alot. So dont you think but i can see your point still say Oscars higher.

Oscar's record is very strong, but it is manufactured to look even better than it actually is, plus he never actually dominated someone who wasn't cannon fodder and lost the true main events in his career.

You can tear down anyone's careerwhen you have the blinkers on. Like Taeth said, you have to look at the chronology of things before start saying that Roy ducked people (not saying you did MR140, just a reference to the thread as a whole.)

Personally I believe Benn had a punchers chance, and like someone mentioned maybe get lucky 1/5 against him, but they were never on a collision course, Benn was well and truly finished after Mclellan, and if the older Benn had fought Roy it would have been a massacre.

[ICB]

Do you know the chronology of this? The big fight between Roy and Dariusz was before Roy ever moved up to heavyweight, and Dariusz ended up losing to a guy Roy pummelled for 12 rounds in Julio Gonzalez anyways. Dariusz was overrated.

Did you watch the ROy JOnes jr- Bernard Hopkins fight? By the middle Roy was landing 50% of his shots to like 20% connection for Bernard. A few times Bernard thought he had Roy figured out only to come out the next round and have Roy make the adjustments that would totally throw Bernard off again. All this was done without him being able to throw his right cross effectively. He was throwing it with an open hand all night. Roy wasn't as effective as he was in some fights, but he still won almost every round until he took off the last few, and he was still just as green as Bernard was, it took him like 5-6 rounds to even open up. Bernard couldn't deal with his speed or elusiveness. Which is the key point ,Roy wasn't just speed, he was as elusive as anyone, thats what him different in some ways from guys like Ali, Leonard, Michael Nunn, is that Roy was extremely hard to hit anywhere, while the other guys weren't quite as concerned about getting hit.

REwatch the bhop fight bro. It was far from easy.
I rewatched it and to my suprise, i actually have bhop winning this time!

Are you out of your mind ? thats possibly one of the easiest fights to score in boxing history, 8 rounds to 4 or 9 rounds to 3 in favor of RJJ. Even Bernard Hopkins said he lost.

[Markusdarkus]

Roy was never busy enough and spent too long of his peak fighting cans to be judged.

Is up there with Calzaghe and Hopkins.

[Mr140]

Well Killface from what i read he has had a heart problem in his last fight of the trilogy with Riddick Bowie and from what i read and what tv has said and medical doctors that were being interviewed he has a heart problem to the point were it effects his fights i dont know why they lie.

[Mr140]

After losing his WBA and IBF heavyweight championship belts to Michael Moorer (JET, May 9), Evander Holyfield learned he had two heart conditions and announced his retirement at a press conference.The conditions are a "stiff heart", which prevents enough oxygen from being pumped to muscles and tissues, and an atrial septal defect, a "tiny hole" in the boxer's heart. Doctors said the conditions are not life-threatening. They were diagnosed while Holyfield was in the hospital for treatment after the Moorer fight."Mr. Holyfield fought this fight in heart failure, and it's an absolute miracle he could fight this fight for 12 rounds in this condition," observed Holyfield's personal physician, Dr. Ronald Stephens.

"His heart was not functioning at its maximum level," cardiologist Dr. Douglas Morris said. "We did not look at this that his life was imperiled."
The cardiologist told Holyfield that the condition was under control now and he could lead a normal life if he resumes a less strenuous lifestyle.
"When Dr. Stephens told me, it was an easy decision," the 31-year-old Holyfield said. "I'm going to miss boxing a lot. I had a lot of love for it and it made a better life for me."
Last year, Holyfield regained his title from Riddick Bowe in a gutsy, 12-round slugfest.


So according to that he has had it for i say 15 years so yea i have no idea why they would let him fight but he does have a hart condtion.

[intoccabile]

After losing his WBA and IBF heavyweight championship belts to Michael Moorer (JET, May 9), Evander Holyfield learned he had two heart conditions and announced his retirement at a press conference.The conditions are a "stiff heart", which prevents enough oxygen from being pumped to muscles and tissues, and an atrial septal defect, a "tiny hole" in the boxer's heart. Doctors said the conditions are not life-threatening. They were diagnosed while Holyfield was in the hospital for treatment after the Moorer fight."Mr. Holyfield fought this fight in heart failure, and it's an absolute miracle he could fight this fight for 12 rounds in this condition," observed Holyfield's personal physician, Dr. Ronald Stephens.

"His heart was not functioning at its maximum level," cardiologist Dr. Douglas Morris said. "We did not look at this that his life was imperiled."
The cardiologist told Holyfield that the condition was under control now and he could lead a normal life if he resumes a less strenuous lifestyle.
"When Dr. Stephens told me, it was an easy decision," the 31-year-old Holyfield said. "I'm going to miss boxing a lot. I had a lot of love for it and it made a better life for me."
Last year, Holyfield regained his title from Riddick Bowe in a gutsy, 12-round slugfest.


So according to that he has had it for i say 15 years so yea i have no idea why they would let him fight but he does have a hart condtion.

also has Hepatitis B

[Dizaster]

I want to get a copy of this tv show that everyone watched that turned them against Roy's skills... I've watched 99% of Roy's fights, and given on a few nights he didn't explode knocking guys out in the first round, from the majority of his fights and what he was capable of, in MOST nights he was unbeatable..

Obviously the tv show was designed, edited, "flavoured", to show Roy as the legend he was, but to show him as the guy who had many chinks in his armour "some of which were exposed during his career".... Pick any fighter in the world and you could put together a show that paints him as someone who was highly overrated.. But it's just not the case... Fuck it's easy to say Roy was far from Unbeatable, but 99% he faced had no fucking chance of beating him.... And if he came prime in every fight, I doubt he would have ever lost a fight.. It's a big statement -- but "extraordinary talent" + "prime" = Unbeatable... That's all there is too it... And no one of Roy's time, and maybe any other time could have stopped him on his best night..

I agree he wasn't PERFECT by any stretch (and maybe that is what is being pointed out here), but in the ring where the game is to knock the other guy out or get knocked out yourself.. Roy was the fucking king of that game..

[Spicoli]

yeh i was dthinking the same thing watching it.. dont get me wrong great fighter, but far from unbeatable..

I also feel that calzaghe would of given him a real test.. he would of bin all over Roy like a rash..

Fighters who swarmed Roy Jones Jr in his prime got slaughtered.

I agree 100%...

Out of curiosity...I would like the detractors to name guys that they feel would have beaten Roy at 168...His true prime...

Not given a good fight but beat him......

Every fighter is beatable no matter who they are....Just have not seen the man able to do it..

I'll bite .Simply put,I think Nigel Benn had a realistic chance of defeating Jones.Can I say he "would" have beaten him,No.But in fairness I equally can not say Jones "would" have beaten Benn.After what Benn prevailed through in that tragic but stunning McClellan battle,I was hard pressed to make Jones a lock for a win and if their was a fight to be made,that was the ONE.McClellan was a huge favorite,many picked him to steamroll Benn.....for a moment lets put aside all of the excuses,Rabbit punching,Long count,etc.I am always hesitant to trump that fight up,talk fondly of the win.You just can not,It was a horrible ending,but the fight did happen,and Benn emerged the victor.

On paper,It appeared a whitewash for Roy.He was faster,deeper in pedigree,emence balance and instinct,really exploited a mans mistakes in embarrassing fashion.If we are talking strictly 168 as mentioned,he faced some guys in Thorton,Pazienza,Brannon etc. who brought forward pressure but NEVER the unbridled two fisted threat and intensity of Benn in that division.Benn could make it rough in there in a way Jones never had to deal with and would keep jones guessing.And I do think that as hard as Jones was to catch clean...I feel that Benn had the arsenal/power to hurt Jones badly.Call it the proverbial "punchers chance" but I think it was more than that & I honestly think Benn had an honest shot, I don't think Jones would be able to get in Benns head ,Ok commence laughter,Im done.