Miguel Cotto vs Austin Trout - Saturday night fight/chat thread

[Rantcatrat]

I haven't read through the whole thread, but I agree that Cotto should retire. He gave it his best shot, but his punches weren't doing much to Trout. Cotto's face looked like hell after the fight. Also, Cotto's words sound like someone who's already got one foot out the door. He's got a wonderful family... and what man wouldn't want to spend time with that? I still think Cotto, for his size, did as much as he could at 154. That is not his best weight. That he won any championships at all at that weight is astounding. But Trout was younger, bigger, faster. I had a pretty good crowd over at the house watching the fight, and we got quieter and quieter as the fight went along. After 7-8 rounds... you sort of know where the fight is going.

On a happier note, I was ecstatic at seeing some good Puerto Rican prospects put in some very good efforts. Young blood coming up. That's what the sport's all about.

I completely agree. Cotto was at his best at 140, perhaps 147, but he's definitely undersized against true junior middleweights. He's a guy who would be best fighting at 147. Unfortunately, at his age, he can't get down to 147 anymore. Trout came on the big stage. The problem Trout has is that he doesn't have a big following and is not knockout artist. Clearly, he's a tougher opponent for Floyd Mayweather than Guerrero and for Canelo than Ortiz, but those guys are less risky, and Trout brings nothing besides a belt to the table.

Oh and @Mars - I completely disagree with regards to Paulie. He's a slick Italian from Staten Island. He's going to dress in flashy Dolce Gabanna suits. If you get passed his style, which doesn't agree with you, you'll warm up to his ability as an announcer. In my opinion, he is doing an excellent job as an announcer. I actually think he should consider permanently retiring from fighting to announce.

[Master]

Cotto was well beaten by the bigger and quality fighter. Cotto should try and fight Saul and call it quits if he loses.

[Nameless]

I was sure that Cotto would win that one by UD, seems like :

a) I underestimated the stigmatas from both fights with Pacaman and MArgarito
b) REally didn't know enough about Trout and clearly underestimated him.

I won't make these mistakes ever again. BEside, a fight with Canelo would be damn entertaining, I think that now it would make sense to make such happen.

[Rantcatrat]

I was sure that Cotto would win that one by UD, seems like :

a) I underestimated the stigmatas from both fights with Pacaman and MArgarito
b) REally didn't know enough about Trout and clearly underestimated him.

I won't make these mistakes ever again. BEside, a fight with Canelo would be damn entertaining, I think that now it would make sense to make such happen.

I agree. Trout deserves the big pay day against Canelo, but Canelo might need to take on Cotto first because he's faced no one of significance yet. I think Canelo knocks him out at this stage.

[IamInuit]

I haven't read through the whole thread, but I agree that Cotto should retire. He gave it his best shot, but his punches weren't doing much to Trout. Cotto's face looked like hell after the fight. Also, Cotto's words sound like someone who's already got one foot out the door. He's got a wonderful family... and what man wouldn't want to spend time with that? I still think Cotto, for his size, did as much as he could at 154. That is not his best weight. That he won any championships at all at that weight is astounding. But Trout was younger, bigger, faster. I had a pretty good crowd over at the house watching the fight, and we got quieter and quieter as the fight went along. After 7-8 rounds... you sort of know where the fight is going.

On a happier note, I was ecstatic at seeing some good Puerto Rican prospects put in some very good efforts. Young blood coming up. That's what the sport's all about.

Well stated bud

[beenKOed]

And the judges officially say: Trout wins a UD 117-111 x 2 and 119-109, what fight did that judge watch?.

I officially can not listen to Pauli & Ranello, I had these 2 clowns on mute the whole fight.

I've hated Ranello for a long time, had to deal with his corny ass for 8 years from watching MMA. He's always been shit IMO. Paulie has potential IMO but is still "finding his voice" as a commentator I guess.

As for the fight... I had it 117-111, agreed with the 2 judges. I don't think Trout won 11 rounds like one judge though, but at least they gave it to the right guy.

It would have been a crying shame if they screwed Trout out of that hard-fought victory.

Cotto has done big things in the boxing game, and I think if he's thinking about retirement then this may be an opportune time to go through with it. He's had some tough wars, best to quit and get into the promoting game so he can live with a good quality of life after boxing. Either way I wish him the best because he was a hell of a fighter.

Mauro Domenico Antonio Ranallo, how can you not like a guy with a strong name like that.

Seriously, I like the way he gets excited, just like most of us do and goes on and on. Hell, he'd fit right in at my house on fight night.

He keeps his job by acting natural and letting the words flow which adds to the excitement. He says what he thinks and is never short on words.

Jim Grey is the guy I'd like to see take a permanent vacation. Grey can ask the stupidest questions, in my opinion. My idea of hell would be having to listening to Jim Grey or Larry Merchant interviewing fighters.

I like Mauro and hope they keep him around.

[outspoken]

Just saw the fight it sucked to see Cotto get beat like that especially after the good performance he gave vs Mayweather. I still want to see him fight again maybe fight guerrero I think thats a fight cotto can win as he can over power the smaller guy.

[roberto duran legend]

All credit to Trout,he put on a super performance,i hope Cotto calls it a day,nothing left
to prove.

[Spicoli]

I was impressed by Trout. He raised his game and was as consistent as I've seen him on a much higher level, kept his head and closed the show down the stretch against the best fighter he has yet to face. No coasting, no boasting just boxing. Honestly it was a type of fight I wanted to give rounds to Cotto, after all I picked him to win it wide, but I didn't see that many at all. I never ever score even rounds over last few yrs and ended up with 9-3. I think he more than merits a fight with Canelo. Also thought it funny and equally disrespectful for Alvarez and Oscar to duck out as Trout called him out seeing as this WAS to (pre)determine who would be the next for him. If they so much as suggest a Cotto fight now they should be a-sham'd of themselves.

I have always had nothing but respect for Cotto, the way he carries himself, fights and is all business. It just wasn't there. He really looked like he reverted and tried to play young slugger Cotto, his jab was M.I.A all night and his body called his heart on it and but for a few spots he could not get it rolling. Lastnight was the writing on the wall and the biggest value he has is for that family he obviously fights and bleeds for. He needs to stop bleeding and hang them up knowing he gave all he could. No regrets, no excuses.

[IamInuit]

Sadly I think last nights performance has Oscar knocking at the door.

[CutMeMick]

I like to eat crow... I like mine well done. Thank you.

Once again my boy Cotto being counted out...

He's been here before how many times?
Think how far back he's been labeled as done, damaged goods or not good enough to beat the top guys?

I see Austin as your typical "robotic" fighter fighter who does everything to the book. He doesn't have angles, he doesn't have waist movement and his ring generalship lacks. Aside from being younger I don't believe he posses any skills that will trouble Cotto.

All Cotto has to do is show up and fight his fight. Cotto wins.

You wont read any excuses from me I though Cotto looked lathergic just completely off.
Whatever it was he lost. I think the scorecards were off though.
All in all if he's just not 100% committed he should just retire. I hope he's smart enough and has that will power to walk away.

Credit to Trout won't take anything from him but honestly I'm just not impressed.

[DavilaJones]

It was a good night for me, made my gas money and lunch money for December betting on Trout.

[IamInuit]

by Cliff Rold

Miguel Cotto has never risen to the same level of popularity achieved by Felix Trinidad. He’s never shown the artistry of Carlos Ortiz or Wilfred Benitez. The sheer carnage left in the wake of Wilfredo Gomez’s assault on Jr. Featherweight remains in its place.

That’s okay.

As preparations are completed for this Saturday’s showdown with IBF Light Middleweight titlist Austin Trout (Showtime, 10 PM EST), the 32-year old can look back on his career and know being Miguel Cotto was good enough.

In the rich history of Puerto Rican boxing, the name Cotto won’t finish at the top.

It’s not out of place in any discussion about the contributions the small island nation has given to the game.

Win or lose against Trout, given the many physical battles he’s been in over the years, it’s not unreasonable to think the end is close. This being boxing, endings come in various shades. Cotto may go on to fight until he’s well past 40. He wouldn’t be the first.

But the best of Cotto? Those moments are growing spare. No one last forever as one of the top guys. Cotto won’t either. There are plenty who think his last best moment has already come, that his brave losing stand to Floyd Mayweather in May of this year was sort of a last hurrah.

Trout is a fashionable pick to win this weekend. He’s younger, quicker, naturally bigger. He’s hungry.

Miguel Cotto could have picked a lot easier fare and got away with it.

He didn’t. While, like any star fighter, he’s had his share of walkovers, they’ve felt fewer. Cotto is a fighter. He does it the right way.

In doing it the right way, what are the things that stand out and serve him well in comparison to the best of Puerto Rico? What are the markers of his place on the island? Here now, a look at the career of Miguel Cotto to date in comparison to his nation’s finest.

Titles: Beginning with the wild Bantamweight days of Sixto Escobar, Puerto Rico has produced more than 60 champions, the highest total of any nation save the United States and Mexico. Of those, only five others have won titles in three weight divisions: Benitez, Gomez, Trinidad, Hector Camacho, and Wilfredo Vazquez Sr.

Of those men, Benitez and Gomez are already in the International Boxing Hall of Fame. Trinidad become eligible for the 2014 class and is a shoo-in for the first ballot. The late Camacho had his last fight in 2010 but is a likely entrant when he becomes five years eligible. Vazquez remains on the ballot but has not yet been inducted.

Cotto will attempt this weekend to win a second sanctioning body belt at Jr. Middleweight after a WBO reign at Jr. Welterweight, WBA and WBO reigns at Welterweight, and a previous WBA reign at 154.

Title Fight Wins: At 17-3, Cotto is closing in on a possible 18th win in title fights with Trout. Only Trinidad and Gomez have more.

Gomez won 20 title fights, defending his 122 lb. title (Lineal and WBC) a record 17 consecutive times. He won additional titles at Featherweight and Jr. Lightweight, losing each in his fist defense.

Trinidad was almost as impressive at Welterweight as Gomez was at Jr. Featherweight, defending the IBF title 15 times and capping his run with a hotly debated win over Oscar De La Hoya for the lineal crown and the WBC belt. He rose to Jr. Middleweight and won the WBA belt, defending twice and picking up the IBF title in the latter defense. In his final title win, he bested William Joppy for a WBA belt. In total, he won 20 title fights.

The next closest to Cotto are Vazquez at 16, Sammy Serrano at 15, and Ortiz at 14.

Competition: Wins are nice, but who a fighter is in the ring with counts too. Cotto can’t say definitively he’s faced the stiffest competition in comparison to his contemporaries, but he’s not far off. Sure, the two best fighters he fought beat him.

But losing to Pacquiao and Mayweather was no shame when recalling that Trinidad (against Hopkins), Gomez (against Sanchez), Benitez (against Leonard and Hearns) also fell short in some critical showdowns. Alfredo Escalera lost both savage affairs with Alexis Arguello.

Cotto, with victories over Shane Mosley, Zab Judah, and an emotional revenge victory over the first man to defeat him, Antonio Margarito, had his share of highs. There were also plenty of good solid pros along the way. He can say he fought the best of his time with the only really big name missing being Ricky Hatton at 140 lbs.

Where Cotto falls short in comparison to some of the Puerto Rican immortals to date is his lack of a signature win. Trinidad had Fernando Vargas. Gomez had Carlos Zarate. Benitez, at the tender age of 17, had the great Antonio Cervantes. His paint brushing of Roberto Duran wasn’t bad either.

But even without that single, signature victory, Cotto can say he’s left fans with the same thing the great Puerto Ricans have been leaving behind for years.

Memories: Win or lose, fans will remember they saw Miguel Cotto leave it in the ring. While there has never been a deemed “Fight of the Year,” Cotto has given fans classic battles against Ricardo Torres, Judah, Mosley, Margarito, Joshua Clottey, Pacquiao, and Mayweather.

When his name is on the marquee fans know, before and now, they have a well better than average chance of getting their money’s worth.

It’s a remarkable career suddenly infused with new life after Mayweather and with an end growing near. On Saturday, Miguel Cotto is fighting.

Someday soon, boxing will ask who the next Miguel Cotto will be.

I quoted the read so had to add a few characters.

[Mars_ax]

I haven't read through the whole thread, but I agree that Cotto should retire. He gave it his best shot, but his punches weren't doing much to Trout. Cotto's face looked like hell after the fight. Also, Cotto's words sound like someone who's already got one foot out the door. He's got a wonderful family... and what man wouldn't want to spend time with that? I still think Cotto, for his size, did as much as he could at 154. That is not his best weight. That he won any championships at all at that weight is astounding. But Trout was younger, bigger, faster. I had a pretty good crowd over at the house watching the fight, and we got quieter and quieter as the fight went along. After 7-8 rounds... you sort of know where the fight is going.

On a happier note, I was ecstatic at seeing some good Puerto Rican prospects put in some very good efforts. Young blood coming up. That's what the sport's all about.

I completely agree. Cotto was at his best at 140, perhaps 147, but he's definitely undersized against true junior middleweights. He's a guy who would be best fighting at 147. Unfortunately, at his age, he can't get down to 147 anymore. Trout came on the big stage. The problem Trout has is that he doesn't have a big following and is not knockout artist. Clearly, he's a tougher opponent for Floyd Mayweather than Guerrero and for Canelo than Ortiz, but those guys are less risky, and Trout brings nothing besides a belt to the table.

Oh and @Mars - I completely disagree with regards to Paulie. He's a slick Italian from Staten Island. He's going to dress in flashy Dolce Gabanna suits. If you get passed his style, which doesn't agree with you, you'll warm up to his ability as an announcer. In my opinion, he is doing an excellent job as an announcer. I actually think he should consider permanently retiring from fighting to announce.

Rantcat,
It's all good if you like Pauli, I just never have cared for the clown, different strokes for different folks. Right now, besides Brian Kenny, Gerbil Farhood and Barry Tompkins, i'm not really liking any of the Showtime crew, including Bernstein who I think is full of shit much of the time. Pauli, Ranello, and Bernstein get muted, not trying to argue that's just me.

[TitoFan]

by Cliff Rold

Miguel Cotto has never risen to the same level of popularity achieved by Felix Trinidad. He’s never shown the artistry of Carlos Ortiz or Wilfred Benitez. The sheer carnage left in the wake of Wilfredo Gomez’s assault on Jr. Featherweight remains in its place.

That’s okay.

As preparations are completed for this Saturday’s showdown with IBF Light Middleweight titlist Austin Trout (Showtime, 10 PM EST), the 32-year old can look back on his career and know being Miguel Cotto was good enough.

In the rich history of Puerto Rican boxing, the name Cotto won’t finish at the top.

It’s not out of place in any discussion about the contributions the small island nation has given to the game.

Win or lose against Trout, given the many physical battles he’s been in over the years, it’s not unreasonable to think the end is close. This being boxing, endings come in various shades. Cotto may go on to fight until he’s well past 40. He wouldn’t be the first.

But the best of Cotto? Those moments are growing spare. No one last forever as one of the top guys. Cotto won’t either. There are plenty who think his last best moment has already come, that his brave losing stand to Floyd Mayweather in May of this year was sort of a last hurrah.

Trout is a fashionable pick to win this weekend. He’s younger, quicker, naturally bigger. He’s hungry.

Miguel Cotto could have picked a lot easier fare and got away with it.

He didn’t. While, like any star fighter, he’s had his share of walkovers, they’ve felt fewer. Cotto is a fighter. He does it the right way.

In doing it the right way, what are the things that stand out and serve him well in comparison to the best of Puerto Rico? What are the markers of his place on the island? Here now, a look at the career of Miguel Cotto to date in comparison to his nation’s finest.

Titles: Beginning with the wild Bantamweight days of Sixto Escobar, Puerto Rico has produced more than 60 champions, the highest total of any nation save the United States and Mexico. Of those, only five others have won titles in three weight divisions: Benitez, Gomez, Trinidad, Hector Camacho, and Wilfredo Vazquez Sr.

Of those men, Benitez and Gomez are already in the International Boxing Hall of Fame. Trinidad become eligible for the 2014 class and is a shoo-in for the first ballot. The late Camacho had his last fight in 2010 but is a likely entrant when he becomes five years eligible. Vazquez remains on the ballot but has not yet been inducted.

Cotto will attempt this weekend to win a second sanctioning body belt at Jr. Middleweight after a WBO reign at Jr. Welterweight, WBA and WBO reigns at Welterweight, and a previous WBA reign at 154.

Title Fight Wins: At 17-3, Cotto is closing in on a possible 18th win in title fights with Trout. Only Trinidad and Gomez have more.

Gomez won 20 title fights, defending his 122 lb. title (Lineal and WBC) a record 17 consecutive times. He won additional titles at Featherweight and Jr. Lightweight, losing each in his fist defense.

Trinidad was almost as impressive at Welterweight as Gomez was at Jr. Featherweight, defending the IBF title 15 times and capping his run with a hotly debated win over Oscar De La Hoya for the lineal crown and the WBC belt. He rose to Jr. Middleweight and won the WBA belt, defending twice and picking up the IBF title in the latter defense. In his final title win, he bested William Joppy for a WBA belt. In total, he won 20 title fights.

The next closest to Cotto are Vazquez at 16, Sammy Serrano at 15, and Ortiz at 14.

Competition: Wins are nice, but who a fighter is in the ring with counts too. Cotto can’t say definitively he’s faced the stiffest competition in comparison to his contemporaries, but he’s not far off. Sure, the two best fighters he fought beat him.

But losing to Pacquiao and Mayweather was no shame when recalling that Trinidad (against Hopkins), Gomez (against Sanchez), Benitez (against Leonard and Hearns) also fell short in some critical showdowns. Alfredo Escalera lost both savage affairs with Alexis Arguello.

Cotto, with victories over Shane Mosley, Zab Judah, and an emotional revenge victory over the first man to defeat him, Antonio Margarito, had his share of highs. There were also plenty of good solid pros along the way. He can say he fought the best of his time with the only really big name missing being Ricky Hatton at 140 lbs.

Where Cotto falls short in comparison to some of the Puerto Rican immortals to date is his lack of a signature win. Trinidad had Fernando Vargas. Gomez had Carlos Zarate. Benitez, at the tender age of 17, had the great Antonio Cervantes. His paint brushing of Roberto Duran wasn’t bad either.

But even without that single, signature victory, Cotto can say he’s left fans with the same thing the great Puerto Ricans have been leaving behind for years.

Memories: Win or lose, fans will remember they saw Miguel Cotto leave it in the ring. While there has never been a deemed “Fight of the Year,” Cotto has given fans classic battles against Ricardo Torres, Judah, Mosley, Margarito, Joshua Clottey, Pacquiao, and Mayweather.

When his name is on the marquee fans know, before and now, they have a well better than average chance of getting their money’s worth.

It’s a remarkable career suddenly infused with new life after Mayweather and with an end growing near. On Saturday, Miguel Cotto is fighting.

Someday soon, boxing will ask who the next Miguel Cotto will be.

I quoted the read so had to add a few characters.

@IamInuit, couldn't rep you... but thanks for the awesome read. Wonderful, even-handed article on a fighter who will definitely be missed when he's gone, and his place in P.R. and world boxing history.