Roy jones jr vs Mike Tyson

[El Kabong]

rjjtszyu, Ali was bigger than Foreman AND George didn't box back in those days. I specifically selected the Klitschko's because they use their height and reach and are good technically sound fighters. It is my belief that Ali had more trouble with guys who could box a bit...the Klitschko's can box but they also have legit KO power which would have to bother Ali, I'm not saying they would always win but they would always do well.

Holmes' era was ok, but he had the same problem that the Klitschko's currently have. The competition they have right now are young and inexperienced.

I just think Evander Holyfield is the closest thing we could get to Joe Frazier in terms of his will to win.

[rjj tszyu]

rjjtszyu, Ali was bigger than Foreman AND George didn't box back in those days. I specifically selected the Klitschko's because they use their height and reach and are good technically sound fighters. It is my belief that Ali had more trouble with guys who could box a bit...the Klitschko's can box but they also have legit KO power which would have to bother Ali, I'm not saying they would always win but they would always do well.

Holmes' era was ok, but he had the same problem that the Klitschko's currently have. The competition they have right now are young and inexperienced.

I just think Evander Holyfield is the closest thing we could get to Joe Frazier in terms of his will to win.

Well I agree with you on Holyfield but for a start, Foreman was Bigger than Ali, he was 1/2 inch taller had a 82" inch reach which is 2" more than Ali (and both Klits for that matter) and when they fought he weighed in 4 lbs heavier than Ali but had drained to quite a light weight for Foreman to supposedly help his speed with Ali and his next fight against Ron Lyle (one of the greatest HW fights of all time IMO) he weighed in 6 lbs heavier than he did against Ali. Also he was only 25 so he had not finished growing by any means, whereas when Ali was 25 he weighed a full 10lbs+ less than Foreman, so how was Ali bigger?

Also Foreman didn't box in those days? Why don't you go and watch some of Foremans other fights, he used to work his jab very, very well and set up the bombs with it, kind of like in the way Wlad does but he made it a lot more exciting because he wasn't as safety first as Wlad is these days. He just couldn't figure out Ali's style but not many could, as it changed from fight to fight. A lot of people seem to have this warped idea that Foreman was just a slugger. Far from it, he was a very effective boxer who set everything up behind a solid jab, the thing was nothing went far because what he did follow it up with was so hard it seemed to get rid of his opponent.

[Master]

Added to that Ali handled Ernie Terrell who was 6ft6" with ease.

[El Kabong]

I confused the Foreman fight with the Liston fight...Ali was bigger than Sonny and not George, my bad.

Is Ernie Terrell better than anyone I mentioned?

Might I ask if Foreman used his height and reach advantage successfully BEFORE he made his comeback? I don't believe he did, he relied 100% on his power which is why he got caught by Ron Lyle and put down.

My point is that recently BOXERS have invaded the heavyweight division. Guys who can take you the distance or get you out quick. They are bigger stronger (probably not faster) but they are better at controlling pace and range than guys who were fighting back in the 1970's. Also it's a select few great fighters over a period 20 or so years....so it's not crazy to assume they would give anyone a tough fight, I'm not saying those guys would win all the time, I'm just saying Ali never fought anyone with the skill sets of the fighters I mentioned...the closest is maybe Bowe is close to Holmes, other than that he never fought anyone like Lewis, Wlad or Vitali.

[generalbulldog]

Ali was not bigger than Liston, Liston was about 10 pounds heavier in both of their fights. Liston had all of the physical advantages over Ali except for height. Unless your definition of being bigger means taller then we can say Paul Williams and Tommy Hearns was "bigger" than Mike Tyson because they were both taller than him.

[X]

JUst going back to the RJJ v Tyson question ..... assuming we are talking about them both being in their prime:

If it is a pound for pound scenario (and Jones would not have been so quick if he was bigger, whereas Tyson would not have been so powerful if he was smaller) I would say it's a pick-em fight.

Prime Tyson v Prime Jones in the same ring would have resulted in Tyson overwhelming Jones and blasting him out early, I'm afraid.

[El Kabong]

Ali was not bigger than Liston, Liston was about 10 pounds heavier in both of their fights. Liston had all of the physical advantages over Ali except for height. Unless your definition of being bigger means taller then we can say Paul Williams and Tommy Hearns was "bigger" than Mike Tyson because they were both taller than him.

But we can say the 22 year old Ali had not fully filled out his frame and that is not the case for Hearns/Williams in comparison to Tyson.

Hearns did fill out to light heavyweight though. And I'm thinking Williams may be able to fill out to 168 or so.

[rjj tszyu]

I confused the Foreman fight with the Liston fight...Ali was bigger than Sonny and not George, my bad.

Is Ernie Terrell better than anyone I mentioned?

Might I ask if Foreman used his height and reach advantage successfully BEFORE he made his comeback? I don't believe he did, he relied 100% on his power which is why he got caught by Ron Lyle and put down.

My point is that recently BOXERS have invaded the heavyweight division. Guys who can take you the distance or get you out quick. They are bigger stronger (probably not faster) but they are better at controlling pace and range than guys who were fighting back in the 1970's. Also it's a select few great fighters over a period 20 or so years....so it's not crazy to assume they would give anyone a tough fight, I'm not saying those guys would win all the time, I'm just saying Ali never fought anyone with the skill sets of the fighters I mentioned...the closest is maybe Bowe is close to Holmes, other than that he never fought anyone like Lewis, Wlad or Vitali.

Against Lyle though Foreman had the Ali demons in his head which he did not take well, watch him work the jab here against Chuvalo and tell me he didn't use his height and reach well and work behind the jab.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d2KRcH1N-xY