p4p, legacy, and resume which one takes it? PBF,Pac, RJJ

[ElTerribleMorales]

p4p - If they ever fought. Roy Jones Jr.

Legacy,Resume - Manny Pacquiao easily

easily how so? Jones has pretty much done the same thing as Manny, if anything it's more impressive given the drastic gaps between weight classes, both guys went up 40+ lbs and won titles, Jones skipped Cruiserweight completely and went straight to HW, his resume is as good as any others, and given how long he was dominant i'd say he's all around better than Pacquiao and Mayweather

[miron_lang]

p4p - If they ever fought. Roy Jones Jr.

Legacy,Resume - Manny Pacquiao easily

easily how so? Jones has pretty much done the same thing as Manny, if anything it's more impressive given the drastic gaps between weight classes, both guys went up 40+ lbs and won titles, Jones skipped Cruiserweight completely and went straight to HW, his resume is as good as any others, and given how long he was dominant i'd say he's all around better than Pacquiao and Mayweather

Roy is great but he didnt tangle with so many other great contemporaries which is a little back slash i would think.

I take back the 'easily' part. But i think its a little clear.

[Taeth]

Pacquiao's career in every aspect has eclipsed both of the other two's despite the fact I think mayweather is better. RJJ is one of my two favorites all time, but I don't see his career as great as these two, nor do I see him beating either one p4p. He was more talented than either, but they are nearly his equal in that regard, but they have far more determination and a much better work ethic.

[Hulk]

Pacquiao's career in every aspect has eclipsed both of the other two's despite the fact I think mayweather is better. RJJ is one of my two favorites all time, but I don't see his career as great as these two, nor do I see him beating either one p4p. He was more talented than either, but they are nearly his equal in that regard, but they have far more determination and a much better work ethic.

If they were in the same weight class, I don't think either could win much over a few rounds against Roy Jones.

Roy Jones is the most talented fighter who ever lived. And one of the fastest.

Pacquaio has begun to dominate larger opponents these last few years like Roy used to, so I can see some comparison to Roy.

But how anyone can think Floyd is better than Roy Jones I do not know...

I mean he had a close fight with an aging Oscar Delahoya, and he lost the first Castillo fight.

[Taeth]

Pacquiao's career in every aspect has eclipsed both of the other two's despite the fact I think mayweather is better. RJJ is one of my two favorites all time, but I don't see his career as great as these two, nor do I see him beating either one p4p. He was more talented than either, but they are nearly his equal in that regard, but they have far more determination and a much better work ethic.

If they were in the same weight class, I don't think either could win much over a few rounds against Roy Jones.

Roy Jones is the most talented fighter who ever lived. And one of the fastest.

Pacquaio has begun to dominate larger opponents these last few years like Roy used to, so I can see some comparison to Roy.

But how anyone can think Floyd is better than Roy Jones I do not know...

I mean he had a close fight with an aging Oscar Delahoya, and he lost the first Castillo fight.

He beat Oscar(at the same age Floyd is now) convincingly, and Oscar did things in that fight that would have given Roy Jones Jr a very hard time. I mean Oscar comparatively has about the same size advantage Ruiz had over Jones in comparison to Floyd. He was roughly 20 pounds heavier and 2 and a half inches taller with each pound being a lot more important at smaller weights.

Also Roy's speed doesn't mean as much when he's breaking so many rules against a guy who is a minute amount slower. Floyd has a way better jab, he's naturally taller for his weight class, he has significantly better defensive skills, and he's a more well rounded fighter. I know how the fights turned out but ROy had some difficulties against Maccallum and Virgil Hill's jabs early, or Hopkins' in their first fight because they all moved in behind the jab, and Floyd is significantly faster than any of them.

Pacquiao and Roy Jones were able to dominate guys for similar reasons. They had a special blend of power and skill, while Pacquiao uses hardwork and output, Roy had a more skills and was more elusive, but they really look good against guys who can't keep up with them. Roy was intelligent and stayed one step ahead of his opponent, while Pacuqiao is always doing something and forcing his opponent to think, but Floyd doesn't to that, he lures his opponents into mistakes and then he strikes. It's the same reason why Hopkins never looked as impressive as Roy Jones because his style was more defensive, the two reasons I don't think Hopkins would beat a prime RJJ, however I believe are the reasons Floyd would. Hopkins would lose a frustrating fight like the second bout they had, but Roy would just be a little too quick and catch him with glancing punches and rack up points with semi-meaningless flurries sort of like Calzaghe(who I thought lost), but more convincingly. Floyd has the speed and jab, which are the two things He would use to frustrate Roy that Hopkins doesn't have, FLoyd would jab to the body or start landing to the head, and he's one of the few p4p who could land a jab upstairs on Roy, but he's so smooth and quick that even Roy couldn't react effectively to his jab. FLoyd would use that jab and speed to get inside where even though Roy was pretty, he wasn't as good as Floyd on the inside, and Floyd would do some damage. Eventually Roy who never trained as hard as Floyd would wear out and the fight would become increasingly one sided in Floyd's favor. Besides speed, and power in some ways Floyd just has too many advantages in every other aspect of boxing. Even Roy's power is based on speed and unpredictability to a large extent and Floyd would see everything coming at him.

[BIG H]

We could throw 'Sweet P' into this debate aswell

[generalbulldog]

When Roy got KTFO by Tarver in the rematch and by Johnson he was 35 and when he lost to Calzaghe he was 39, not exactly what I call prime. About James Toney losing massive weight, he just defended his IBF SMW title against Charles Williams 3 1/2 months before fighting Roy so I fail to see where Toney had to lose massive weight, unless his walk around weight back then was in the 200+ range like it is today.

Pac and PBF's overall resume is better than Roy as I have said in my first post, but Roy's 2 big wins against prime and undefeated James Toney and Hopkins is better than Pac's and PBF's 2 biggest wins against anyone. Toney and Hopkins weren't old, past their prime, shot, on the decline or at a catchweight or out of their comfortable weight range, which PBF and Pac has a habit of doing. He outclass and beat them fairly easily. Roy in his prime also doesn't have controversial wins where it's debated that he lost like Pac against JMM or PBF against Castillo in the 1st fight. So yeah, I'm going by that Roy was even more dominant than those 2 when he was the p4p king.

[Julius Rain]

Roy was fun to watch but his wins are not as great. I think his biggest win is over James Toney at super middle weight. He fun a lot of undefeated guys but those guys were not A class fighters. I think Roy fought a lot of B class fighters. The Ruiz fight was a joke imo, and then he has a close fight with a 20-0 something Tarver. I dont even compare Roy to Floyd or Pac.

At the moment I say Pac but we should definitely see Pac vs Floyd.

Anybody saying pac reach his prime before lightweight is definitely just sticking up to the great fighters he beat up below lightweight. These are the same people who called him one dimensional but yet they are saying he was already prime?

Pac reach his prime above featherweight and p4p a welterweight Pac beats up Floyd and Roy.

[generalbulldog]

For the people that are criticizing on Roy's resume compared to Pac and PBF, you guys are right that it's overall better than Roy's but to me I go for quality over quantity. Pac and PBF 2 biggest wins don't equal Roy's 2 biggest wins. Roy made 2 atgs looked like bums which were Toney and Hopkins. Name me the 2 biggest wins on Pac and PBF's resume that are close to a prime and undefeated Toney and young Hopkins? You can't. Those 2 were atgs and one was definitely in his prime, while Hopkins wasn't in his prime niether was Roy at that stage. Remember Roy is the only guy to beat Hopkins convincingly in his career.

[JazMerkin]

It's Mayweather for me. I think both Mayweather & Pacquiao have resumes superior to Jones, and all this talk about prime is very convenient, but let's face it, prime just means when someone wasn't losing. Mike Tyson was prime until he fought Buster Douglas. Donald Curry was prime until he fought Lloyd Honeyghan.

For me, he may have beat Hopkins but it was no more convincing to me than Mayweather's win over ODLH or Pacquiao's 2nd win over Barrera. His win over Toney is impressive, but other than those two fights the opposition is too weak to me. In contrast, PBF & Pac have fought a combination of Oscar, Hatton, Mosley, Corrales, Marquez, Castillo, Barrera, Morales, Cotto, Judah, Margarito, Gatti, Genaro Hernandez, Sasakul. That's 14 possible future hall of famers between them, with at least eight I'd consider nailed on. Each has fought at least five.

Granted Jones lost a lot of weight to fight Tarver, but so did Toney when losing to Jones, so you can't have excuses one way and ignore them another. Personally I see Tarver, Johnson & Calzaghe as the best fighters Jones faced outside of B-Hop & Toney, and granted he may or may not have been past it, he still lost convincingly to all of them.

He may be the greatest athlete out of all of them, but there's not enough to prove he's the best, and in a p4p match-up, I have to ask who Jones fought who was as quick p4p as either of these guys.

I find it hard to split the other 2. I think if they both retire today, Manny has the better legacy, I'd favour PBF in p4p and their resumes are similar imo. I think on the basis that I think Mayweather is the better boxer, I'd favour him.

1) Floyd
2) Manny
3) Roy

[ono]

It's Mayweather for me. I think both Mayweather & Pacquiao have resumes superior to Jones, and all this talk about prime is very convenient, but let's face it, prime just means when someone wasn't losing. Mike Tyson was prime until he fought Buster Douglas. Donald Curry was prime until he fought Lloyd Honeyghan.

For me, he may have beat Hopkins but it was no more convincing to me than Mayweather's win over ODLH or Pacquiao's 2nd win over Barrera. His win over Toney is impressive, but other than those two fights the opposition is too weak to me. In contrast, PBF & Pac have fought a combination of Oscar, Hatton, Mosley, Corrales, Marquez, Castillo, Barrera, Morales, Cotto, Judah, Margarito, Gatti, Genaro Hernandez, Sasakul. That's 14 possible future hall of famers between them, with at least eight I'd consider nailed on. Each has fought at least five.

Granted Jones lost a lot of weight to fight Tarver, but so did Toney when losing to Jones, so you can't have excuses one way and ignore them another. Personally I see Tarver, Johnson & Calzaghe as the best fighters Jones faced outside of B-Hop & Toney, and granted he may or may not have been past it, he still lost convincingly to all of them.

He may be the greatest athlete out of all of them, but there's not enough to prove he's the best, and in a p4p match-up, I have to ask who Jones fought who was as quick p4p as either of these guys.

I find it hard to split the other 2. I think if they both retire today, Manny has the better legacy, I'd favour PBF in p4p and their resumes are similar imo. I think on the basis that I think Mayweather is the better boxer, I'd favour him.

1) Floyd
2) Manny
3) Roy

This pretty much sums up my thoughts on the matter.

[rjj tszyu]

IMO without a doubt it's RJJ. Freak of nature are the words that best sum this extraordinary fighter up when he was in his prime!

[AdamGB]

Roy.

He might not have titles in quite as many weight classes as Pac... but every one of them was a REAL weight class... no fucking about moving up 4 pounds and no catchweights etc.

He has damaged his legacy slightly in recent fights by going on too long... but prime for prime he was much more untouchable.