Martinez-Ishida in the works???

[Rantcatrat]

I will be the 1st to admit it, I did criticize Pac for fighting Mosley. So I'm going to say it here that Martinez should get the same level of treatment. Ishida? Chavez Jr? Manfredo? That's just horrible man. That's like Floyd or Pac fighting Maglinaggi. Mosley is on the decline, but fuck at least he's not a c-level fighter.

And another thing, it's expected of Floyd and Manny to fight Martinez at 160, well how about Martinez take on Dirrel, Kessler, Bute, Ward, at 168? I remember quite a lot of people on this board was up in arms saying that's not fair to Martinez he'll be too small. But it's expected of the top 2 guys at the sport to fight at 160? But it's not expected of Martinez to fight at 168 "cuz he small." hahaha


BTW, I ain't got nothing against Sergio, but the criticism and expectations should be consistent.

Exactly, people use the fact they've fought at LMW before as justification, but in both their cases, they fought significantly bigger men with weight advantages of 20lbs+ on the night. The fact they both weigh in in the 146-152 range on the night should tell people that they simply cannot fight at MW.

Martinez has not fought a fully-fledged MW since Pavlik, so why not give Pirog a go? I mean Ishida, despite his height, is just another LMW, so at least a Manfredo fight gives him a proper MW. I've no problem him taking a gimme, but while he does let's not talk about him being the best fighter in the world. As far as I'm concerned, Malignaggi is a higher level of fighter than Ishida, I'd place Ishida more on the level of a Delvin Rodriguez. Can you imagine the uproar if Floyd or Manny fought him??

If DiBella & Lewcowicz wants to prove Sergiof the best fighter in the world he'll step up to take on some of the opposition at 168 or fight the best in or around 160, not just any LMW who's had a decent win recently.

Noone is arguing though that Ishida is a good opponent. I thought about it yesterday after our discussion and my opinion is that Sergio should wait to face the winner of the Zbik v. Chavez Jr. fight. Zbik right now is a lower top ten middleweight and if Chavez Jr. beats him that makes Chavez Jr. a lower top ten middleweight. Facing a lower top ten middleweight is fair for a take easy fight while Pirog fights Manfredo or something and gets back on American TV. Plus Chavez Jr. sells a lot of tickets.

I continue to say though that Pirog is a bit overrated. I don't think he needs to step up to 168 to prove that he is one of the best in the world. He started his career as a welterweight and spent most of it as a junior middleweight. He's only really fought at middleweight in two fights. Maybe in the future he jumps up, but that is like a year or two from now. Now he should have his sights on Sturm or Pirog or another top middleweight.

What has Pirog done to deserve a fight with Martinez? That's not to say he isn't the best opponent out there right now because Martinez' prospects are dim, but I mean there's no reason to be clammoring for him to face Martinez. If anything, James Kirkland was a more heralded boxer than Danny Jacobs.

Before he went jail maybe, but prison does things to a man *said in ominous voice*

I have little problem with a Zbik/Chavez Jr match-up or even Manfredo, but it's not going to make him the best fighter on the planet. If he stepped up & beat any of Bute, Ward or Froch then it would be up for debate.

You mention that he started his career as a Welterweight, but when he last fought there Mayweather was a 130lber & Pacquiao a Super-Bantamweight. Would we excuse them fighting Delvin Rodriguez on that basis. You also say he's only fought 2 fights there, but both Williams fights, Pavlik & Dzinziruk he was nearer to the MW limit than LMW & that's a good 18 months at the weight. That's more than enough time to be saying ok he should fight proper MWs regularly or move up.

The reason there's a clamor for Pirog is because he's undefeated, looked spectacular on HBO & because Sturm aside, who would be a better match-up for Martinez?

I don't really disagree with anything you said. The only thing I disagree with is that if Sergio Martinez comes down to 154 than he should be able to fight anyone at 154 without taking any crap for it. In my opinion, Sergio has grown into being a middleweight, but like Cotto at 154 is a small junior middleweight, Sergio is a small middleweight. Don't get me wrong though, he's still a middleweight. However, if there is better competition at 154 and he can make 154, than why not take the fight?

Jaz, would you give Martinez more credit for beating Cotto or Floyd at 154 or Pirog at 160?

Pacquiao is too small. Repeatedly, I've said that. There is no argument. Sergio will not, and won't ever, fight Pacquiao. I disagree a little bit about Floyd though. Floyd won a title at 154 against Oscar so it's not a stretch that Floyd could face Martinez at 154. Floyd's the best fighter in the world when he's active - Pirog isn't even on the list. The whole thing is that Sergio deserves a big money fight. A Manny/Floyd type of fight, just not against them. The only person at or around that weight class who is a big money fight is Cotto and on second thought, maybe Chavez Jr.