Roy Jones, where did it all go wrong?

[marbleheadmaui]

The bert sugar list is next just as soon as I find it.

Nice article. Thanks. But let's be really clear. Max Never called him the best. He said he Could become that. Obviously he didn't

[JonesJrMayweather]

The bert sugar list is next just as soon as I find it.

Nice article. Thanks. But let's be really clear. Max Never called him the best. He said he Could become that. Obviously he didn't

In that article, you're right, but he did say definitively that Jones would have smoked SRL. Outboxed Hagler, Kayoed Hearns, and Marciano wouldn't have gotten a whiff. Now speaking on the mythical pound for pound rankings list, many have SRL in the top 10. Now if he says Jones would have smoked him. How many others on that list would have smoked Ray Leonard? And can't one draw an intelligent conclusion that if say jones would easily beat those four guys that at least puts him around top five all time?

Not too mention the point made about Conn and Louis, Conn was way ahead going into the 13th round. If Conn who clearly was no where near Jones level was able to do that to one of best heavies of all time how would jones fair, in modern era Jones would have won or even in 15rounds jones would stayed away from him to win the fight.



When asked by a reporter why he went for the knockout, Conn replied famously, "What's the use of being Irish if you can't be thick (i.e. stupid)?" Later he would joke with Louis, "Why couldn't you let me hold the title for a year or so?", to which the Brown Bomber responded, "You had the title for twelve rounds and you couldn't hold on to it." - wiki

[Spicoli]

I gotta ask as far as article...isn't that all a bit nul and void seeing as how it was written right before Tarver match...and well, Superman went on to have his cape pulled by and then lose to 'Robin' aka Tarver ? Its really all one big 'If' by Max, and I like the guy but, meh.

[marbleheadmaui]

I gotta ask as far as article...isn't that all a bit nul and void seeing as how it was written right before Tarver match...and well, Superman went on to have his cape pulled by and then lose to 'Robin' aka Tarver ? Its really all one big 'If' by Max, and I like the guy but, meh.

[jumping over the fence to the Roy side].

Is a KO loss at 35 really that meaningful for a guy who had been a pro for 15 years?

[Spicoli]

I gotta ask as far as article...isn't that all a bit nul and void seeing as how it was written right before Tarver match...and well, Superman went on to have his cape pulled by and then lose to 'Robin' aka Tarver ? Its really all one big 'If' by Max, and I like the guy but, meh.

[jumping over the fence to the Roy side].

Is a KO loss at 35 really that meaningful for a guy who had been a pro for 15 years?

When your knocking out Superman it is.

Max had said 'If' he had retired after Ruiz fight then he's be all time best, right? He was 35 when he whipped Ruiz as well.....>enter weight argument here<

[marbleheadmaui]

The bert sugar list is next just as soon as I find it.

Nice article. Thanks. But let's be really clear. Max Never called him the best. He said he Could become that. Obviously he didn't

In that article, you're right, but he did say definitively that Jones would have smoked SRL. Outboxed Hagler, Kayoed Hearns, and Marciano wouldn't have gotten a whiff. Now speaking on the mythical pound for pound rankings list, many have SRL in the top 10. Now if he says Jones would have smoked him. How many others on that list would have smoked Ray Leonard? And can't one draw an intelligent conclusion that if say jones would easily beat those four guys that at least puts him around top five all time?

Not too mention the point made about Conn and Louis, Conn was way ahead going into the 13th round. If Conn who clearly was no where near Jones level was able to do that to one of best heavies of all time how would jones fair, in modern era Jones would have won or even in 15rounds jones would stayed away from him to win the fight.



When asked by a reporter why he went for the knockout, Conn replied famously, "What's the use of being Irish if you can't be thick (i.e. stupid)?" Later he would joke with Louis, "Why couldn't you let me hold the title for a year or so?", to which the Brown Bomber responded, "You had the title for twelve rounds and you couldn't hold on to it." - wiki

Hell I think Roy would have beaten Ray Leoanrd too! Why? He was 20+ pounds heavier. As for Joe Louis? i think there are a whole bunch of guys where Roy would have won most/every round right up until he was KO'd. Why? His speed would have protected him while the superior technicians figured things out. But figuring things out are what they did. Having said that, what Conn had that Roy didn't was athleticism combined with technical excellence. (Love the Irish line btw). The Hagler of 1980 would have destroyed the Roy who actually fought at middle. Just too much of an experience difference. The 168 Roy several years later? He would have had 12-15 pounds on Marvin at fight time. Tough call.

Max doesn't ask the right questions. How about Ezzard and Archie and Spinks and Foster (well, at least he mentions the last two) and Tunney and Harold Johnson? All guys who were the same size as Roy.

And NO speculation CANNOT be the primary source of historical rankings like that. Your guess of mythical matchups mean zippo. Neither do mine. Why? Because they are simply guesses. What a guy did and against whom is what has to govern, doesn't it? (That's my story and I'm sticking too it!)

One last thing. I wonder about the current view that Roy's chin was his weakness. I'm not so sure. I suspect anyone who is never taught and never practices how to take/roll with a punch could be one punched by a good fighter. Might it not be true that Roy's chin was adequate and his KO's were another example of a technical failing? If that's true and we want to play imaginary games? Think about Roy having been taught that!

Again, a fun read. I love when Max gets all manic