Castro resigns!!!!

[El Kabong]

Very few things need to be done to fix the system here the problem is no one is making the changes.

If you want socialized healthcare then go right ahead and vote for Obama or Hillary....you have your opportunity right now.



And why does every motherfucking post have to be someone berating ME about healthcare....you guys do realize that lots of people not paying their bills at the emergency room or hospital adds to the cost of both health insurance AND the cost of the stay at the ER or hospital It's not just rich people fucking the system up

[Master]

....I think we hurt them more than they hurt us.

That is not saying much for the USA then is it.

Also USA spreading and imposing their version of democracy across the world. No wonder everyone loves them. Thankfully Bush is going, he has sorted out his retirement pension and helped his multinationals director friends.

[Kirkland Laing]

Cuba will be far better off than Haiti.

I tell you what the big thing Cuba could do for us (when they become a democracy of course) ethanol from corn is all well and good but SUGAR is where it's at! Brazil has supposedly had some good success with ethanol derived from sugar and Cuba could export to the US and we could help them out with what our embargo has done to them over 4 decades.


And American tourism in general will bring them MILLIONS...they do have to clean up a bit though some American businesses can create some monster hotels down there and casinos.

Havana would become a mix of Miami and Las Vegas....and think of all the great boxers that will be able to fight in the pros when they stop being a stupid socialist state!!!

Cuba will become Haiti with tourism and a couple of skyscrapers in Havana. Ethanol as fuel is just a US socialist subsidy paid to Big Agriculture. It's not even green.

[Kirkland Laing]

Very few things need to be done to fix the system here the problem is no one is making the changes.

If you want socialized healthcare then go right ahead and vote for Obama or Hillary....you have your opportunity right now.



And why does every motherfucking post have to be someone berating ME about healthcare....you guys do realize that lots of people not paying their bills at the emergency room or hospital adds to the cost of both health insurance AND the cost of the stay at the ER or hospital It's not just rich people fucking the system up

The only parts of the US healthcare system that work efficiently are the socialised parts. The vast majority of the US system -- the corporate socialist part -- costs many times more than other industrialised countries and is rubbish.

[CFH]

Speaking as someone who lives in a country where health care is pretty much free, its not all its cracked up to be. If I need to go and see my doctor for some mundane reason, then its great. But if I need to get any type of major surgery done, I will most likely have to wait months and even years. An older guy I work with has been waiting 2+ years for knee surgery, surgery he needs; that is not an uncommon situation. Also, there have been private clinics that attempted to open up in some cities here where, if you had the money and didn't want to wait, you could pay for whatever procedure you needed, like in the States, and the fucking government blocked them as being unconstitutional. Which is fucking stupid. Also, doctors make way more money in the U.S. (and elsewhere) because of their system, so the best doctors often adandon Canada to head south to make serious coin. Plus, in about 20-30 years when all the baby-boomers get old its going to fly completely off the rails.

All that being said, I'd still take our system over your most of the time, but I'm a poor student, so I might feel different if I ever actually manage to parlay my education into a successful career.

[Trainer Monkey]

Speaking as someone who lives in a country where health care is pretty much free, its not all its cracked up to be. If I need to go and see my doctor for some mundane reason, then its great. But if I need to get any type of major surgery done, I will most likely have to wait months and even years. An older guy I work with has been waiting 2+ years for knee surgery, surgery he needs; that is not an uncommon situation. Also, there have been private clinics that attempted to open up in some cities here where, if you had the money and didn't want to wait, you could pay for whatever procedure you needed, like in the States, and the fucking government blocked them as being unconstitutional. Which is fucking stupid. Also, doctors make way more money in the U.S. (and elsewhere) because of their system, so the best doctors often adandon Canada to head south to make serious coin. Plus, in about 20-30 years when all the baby-boomers get old its going to fly completely off the rails.

All that being said, I'd still take our system over your most of the time, but I'm a poor student, so I might feel different if I ever actually manage to parlay my education into a successful career.

Did you have a wife working for a major health insuarer?
Did it cost you over a thousand dollars to get an infected finger looked at?

[AdamGB]

is not 6 and two 3s though? No where has free health care... you'll normally pay a shit load of tax to get 'free' healthcare... so even if you think you get free healthcare you've probably spent the same/more on it?

lets say you never need it until the day you die?

[Kirkland Laing]

Speaking as someone who lives in a country where health care is pretty much free, its not all its cracked up to be. If I need to go and see my doctor for some mundane reason, then its great. But if I need to get any type of major surgery done, I will most likely have to wait months and even years. An older guy I work with has been waiting 2+ years for knee surgery, surgery he needs; that is not an uncommon situation. Also, there have been private clinics that attempted to open up in some cities here where, if you had the money and didn't want to wait, you could pay for whatever procedure you needed, like in the States, and the fucking government blocked them as being unconstitutional. Which is fucking stupid. Also, doctors make way more money in the U.S. (and elsewhere) because of their system, so the best doctors often adandon Canada to head south to make serious coin. Plus, in about 20-30 years when all the baby-boomers get old its going to fly completely off the rails.

All that being said, I'd still take our system over your most of the time, but I'm a poor student, so I might feel different if I ever actually manage to parlay my education into a successful career.

Here's something I read about Canadian healthcare recently. My favourite is point number two, in which the author notes that although Canadian doctors are paid less than their U.S. counterparts, there are also upsides to practicing in Canada:

First, as noted, they don't have to charge higher fees to cover the salary of a full-time staffer to deal with over a hundred different insurers, all of whom are bent on denying care whenever possible. In fact, most Canadian doctors get by quite nicely with just one assistant, who cheerfully handles the phones, mail, scheduling, patient reception, stocking, filing, and billing all by herself in the course of a standard workday.
Second, they don't have to spend several hours every day on the phone cajoling insurance company bean counters into doing the right thing by their patients. My doctor in California worked a 70-hour week: 35 hours seeing patients, and another 35 hours on the phone arguing with insurance companies. My Canadian doctor, on the other hand, works a 35-hour week, period. She files her invoices online, and the vast majority are simply paid — quietly, quickly, and without hassle. There is no runaround. There are no fights. Appointments aren't interrupted by vexing phone calls. Care is seldom denied (because everybody knows the rules). She gets her checks on time, sees her patients on schedule, takes Thursdays off, and gets home in time for dinner.

Mythbusting Canadian Health Care -- Part I | OurFuture.org

[CFH]

Here's something I read about Canadian healthcare recently. My favourite is point number two, in which the author notes that although Canadian doctors are paid less than their U.S. counterparts, there are also upsides to practicing in Canada:

First, as noted, they don't have to charge higher fees to cover the salary of a full-time staffer to deal with over a hundred different insurers, all of whom are bent on denying care whenever possible. In fact, most Canadian doctors get by quite nicely with just one assistant, who cheerfully handles the phones, mail, scheduling, patient reception, stocking, filing, and billing all by herself in the course of a standard workday.

Second, they don't have to spend several hours every day on the phone cajoling insurance company bean counters into doing the right thing by their patients. My doctor in California worked a 70-hour week: 35 hours seeing patients, and another 35 hours on the phone arguing with insurance companies. My Canadian doctor, on the other hand, works a 35-hour week, period. She files her invoices online, and the vast majority are simply paid — quietly, quickly, and without hassle. There is no runaround. There are no fights. Appointments aren't interrupted by vexing phone calls. Care is seldom denied (because everybody knows the rules). She gets her checks on time, sees her patients on schedule, takes Thursdays off, and gets home in time for dinner.

Mythbusting Canadian Health Care -- Part I | OurFuture.org

That's very interesting article, I would not have considered the overhead that U.S. doctors have to deal with nor would I have considered the man hours it would take to deal with all the different health-care providers. I know in my doctors office, its just him and a secretary, but it often feels quite frantic in there, its not uncommon for me to have a 2:00 appointment and not see the doctor until after 3. Also, a lot of doctors here have taken to only dealing with one problem per visit, so if your leg and your head are both fucked up, he's only going to deal with one of them, so you better figure out which needs more immediate attention.
One thing that they kind of gloss over is point #3, wait times here are fucking horrendous, and like I said, just wait until the baby boomers hit 65, they won't be contributing much in the way of taxes and will need a ton of medical care, especially as, just like in the States, we're all a bunch of fat, under-exercising pigs up here.
Also they talk about how taxes here are only about 10% more than in the U.S., but when you consider how much $$ the U.S. spends on other things, IE a functioning military, which Canada basically ignores, you've got to imagine taxes would skyrocket if the U.S. implimented national health care.

[CFH]

Did you have a wife working for a major health insuarer?
Did it cost you over a thousand dollars to get an infected finger looked at?

No, that would be a shitty situation, no doubt about it. However, if the infected finger was symptomatic of something much more serious, I would like to think I was getting the best medical care money could buy, without having to wait an extended period of time to see a specialist.

[Trainer Monkey]

No, that would be a shitty situation, no doubt about it. However, if the infected finger was symptomatic of something much more serious, I would like to think I was getting the best medical care money could buy, without having to wait an extended period of time to see a specialist.

Hah,you think we just walk in the door here?
If you aint dying,your waiting sahib
We cant even good info on our loved ones if we're in the waiting room
Bro,another myth,reality aint like that

[CFH]

Hah,you think we just walk in the door here?
If you aint dying,your waiting sahib
We cant even good info on our loved ones if we're in the waiting room
Bro,another myth,reality aint like that

Admittedly, I do not know much about the American system, but I do know the Canadian one will not be functioning for too much longer if it does not get seriously overhauled, which it almost surely never will.
If you potentially had something seriously wrong with you, lets say you needed a CAT scan, how long would you have to wait in the States?
Just for something to compare wait times with.

[Kirkland Laing]

That's very interesting article, I would not have considered the overhead that U.S. doctors have to deal with nor would I have considered the man hours it would take to deal with all the different health-care providers. I know in my doctors office, its just him and a secretary, but it often feels quite frantic in there, its not uncommon for me to have a 2:00 appointment and not see the doctor until after 3. Also, a lot of doctors here have taken to only dealing with one problem per visit, so if your leg and your head are both fucked up, he's only going to deal with one of them, so you better figure out which needs more immediate attention.
One thing that they kind of gloss over is point #3, wait times here are fucking horrendous, and like I said, just wait until the baby boomers hit 65, they won't be contributing much in the way of taxes and will need a ton of medical care, especially as, just like in the States, we're all a bunch of fat, under-exercising pigs up here.
Also they talk about how taxes here are only about 10% more than in the U.S., but when you consider how much $$ the U.S. spends on other things, IE a functioning military, which Canada basically ignores, you've got to imagine taxes would skyrocket if the U.S. implimented national health care.

The US spends a lot more on healthcare than most developed nations do and with a far worse overall result. The only parts of the US system that function competitively and efficiently are the parts that are socialised. When the baby boomers retire the inefficient and expensive US corporate socialist healthcare system will collapse and be replaced by one like Canada's, unless pressure from US corporations who face global uncompetitiveness from soaring healthcare costs compared to their socialised healthcare country competitors doesn't bring about change first.

Canada doesn't need a military as it faces no serious threat and doesn't have a empire to run. If it did run a empire the economic growth from the empire would have meant low taxes in Canada too.



According to the OECD rankings of healthcare systems the US comes in just behind Costa Rica.

[Kirkland Laing]

EDIT : This is cost per person per year for healthcare.

[RP33]

Admittedly, I do not know much about the American system, but I do know the Canadian one will not be functioning for too much longer if it does not get seriously overhauled, which it almost surely never will.
If you potentially had something seriously wrong with you, lets say you needed a CAT scan, how long would you have to wait in the States?
Just for something to compare wait times with.

Depends on your current condition.. I mean, if you're taken into the ER and they need to figure out what's wrong with you asap, then you'll get it done on the spot..

But, for example, i had recurring migraines when i was younger, and after visiting the doctor 2 or 3 times he suggested i should get one.. You get a slip of paper, and then you go to the building where they do x-rays/cat scans etc, and you get it done..

Correct me if i'm wrong, but this is how i'd go about it.. I'd go to my normal doctor, ask him if he'd recommend a cat scan, or tell him i'd like to get one just to be safe, and he'll fill out a sheet of paper saying my name, and saying what i need done, and tell me to take it to the lab where they do CAT scans.. it's really that simple.

Other things that may take longer, like an MRI or something like that, are usually scheduled within the same week.