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You're kidding me right? The guy is currently the best fighter in the sport, so if anyone beat him, then that would be a great achievement. I am no hater of Manny Pacquiao, I love watching the guy fight, but truly stupid statements like this make me want him to fail.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pavlik
Ofcourse they deserve all the credit in the world, it's just whatever PAC does it's never enough. Fairness goes both ways get my drift?Quote:
Originally Posted by bzkfnYou're kidding me right? The guy is currently the best fighter in the sport, so if anyone beat him, then that would be a great achievement. I am no hater of Manny Pacquiao, I love watching the guy fight, but truly stupid statements like this make me want him to fail.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pavlik
Consider this if PAC never fought Hatton when Hatton was the lineal champ at 140 but instead destroys Bradley or Alexander, I'm pretty sure people will say he never beat Hatton and should've fought Hatton instead.
And if PAC instead of fighting Cotto, Marg or Clottey beat Berto first, people will say Berto is UNTESTED.
It'll never satisfy our satiety that's my point.
Fans like me dont consider Manny as the GOAT, we just think that whatever he does is not enough for others that's all.
Sure this is a bad fight considering Mosley's career at this point.
But I would like to point out to the revisionist historians out there. Pacquiao didn't force De La Hoya to fight at 147 for a big payday. That's just bullshit. There's a reason why DLH is nicknamed the Goldenboy. No fighter in history has ever had the upperhand in negotiations when negotiating with the Goldenboy. Not Chavez, Whitaker, Tinidad, Vargas, Hopkins, Floyd or Manny. So let's cut that bullshit out.
And another thing Tim Bradley is fighting Alexander at the end of next month, and you have the same people saying he should have fought Bradley, when they didn't bother to check whether or not Bradley is busy with a upcoming fight. But 5 months from now the same people will say Pacquiao ducked Bradley after he fought Margarito.
Completely. But please realise that most of us believe that Manny is the real deal. He is absolutely tremendous, one of the greatest fighters of all time. However, because of this, while he only has a few fights left in his career, surely you want to see your man tested to the limit. Surely you must understand, that a 40 year old Mosley, who couldn't handle Mayweather's speed, has little chance of challenging Manny. It is not a criticism of Pacquiao's achievements, it is merely a request for a better choice of opponent.Quote:
Originally Posted by PavlikOfcourse they deserve all the credit in the world, it's just whatever PAC does it's never enough. Fairness goes both ways get my drift?Quote:
Originally Posted by bzkfnYou're kidding me right? The guy is currently the best fighter in the sport, so if anyone beat him, then that would be a great achievement. I am no hater of Manny Pacquiao, I love watching the guy fight, but truly stupid statements like this make me want him to fail.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pavlik
I think Pavlik makes a very good point actually. In the eyes of the fickle fight fans a fighter really is only as good as his last fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by bzkfnYou're kidding me right? The guy is currently the best fighter in the sport, so if anyone beat him, then that would be a great achievement. I am no hater of Manny Pacquiao, I love watching the guy fight, but truly stupid statements like this make me want him to fail.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pavlik
For years Floyd was dodging the best welters in Margarito and Mosley. Hatton was unbeatable at light welter, the undisputed Ring champ. Clottey was one of the most underated fighters around (as weirdly is Collazo still because he hasn't had a big fight yet), and they were the kind of fighters Floyd wanted nothing off.
Then fast forward a couple of years and because they have since suffered losses they are just fodder for a cherry picking Filipino. Beating them means nothing, hell any decent fighter should be able to knock them out.
Right now it's guys like Bradley or Berto, or Martinez that Manny is avoiding (not counting Marquez) but if Bradley were to lose to Alexander, or Martinez to some other middleweight then they will be nothing fighters once again, and people will groan if Manny fights them.
Look at Paul Williams, knocked out by Martinez and now written off as finished. Pavlik is finished. Mosley is finished.
Hopkins was finished yet again after the second Jones Jr fight and is now back to being truly an all time great who was robbed against Calzaghe and Pascal.
The great thing about armchair fans and internat warriors is their opinions don't have to be permanent. What they say in May can be completely retracted in September.
Personally I don't believe human beings decline in skills over the period of a summer, or only have a period of 16 months where they are good at what they do, but that is the mindset of the average forum posting boxing fan.
Thanks Bilbo.Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboI think Pavlik makes a very good point actually. In the eyes of the fickle fight fans a fighter really is only as good as his last fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by bzkfnYou're kidding me right? The guy is currently the best fighter in the sport, so if anyone beat him, then that would be a great achievement. I am no hater of Manny Pacquiao, I love watching the guy fight, but truly stupid statements like this make me want him to fail.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pavlik
For years Floyd was dodging the best welters in Margarito and Mosley. Hatton was unbeatable at light welter, the undisputed Ring champ. Clottey was one of the most underated fighters around (as weirdly is Collazo still because he hasn't had a big fight yet), and they were the kind of fighters Floyd wanted nothing off.
Then fast forward a couple of years and because they have since suffered losses they are just fodder for a cherry picking Filipino. Beating them means nothing, hell any decent fighter should be able to knock them out.
Right now it's guys like Bradley or Berto, or Martinez that Manny is avoiding (not counting Marquez) but if Bradley were to lose to Alexander, or Martinez to some other middleweight then they will be nothing fighters once again, and people will groan if Manny fights them.
Look at Paul Williams, knocked out by Martinez and now written off as finished. Pavlik is finished. Mosley is finished.
Hopkins was finished yet again after the second Jones Jr fight and is now back to being truly an all time great who was robbed against Calzaghe and Pascal.
The great thing about armchair fans and internat warriors is their opinions don't have to be permanent. What they say in May can be completely retracted in September.
Personally I don't believe human beings decline in skills over the period of a summer, or only have a period of 16 months where they are good at what they do, but that is the mindset of the average forum posting boxing fan.
That I completely understand:)Quote:
Originally Posted by bzkfnCompletely. But please realise that most of us believe that Manny is the real deal. He is absolutely tremendous, one of the greatest fighters of all time. However, because of this, while he only has a few fights left in his career, surely you want to see your man tested to the limit. Surely you must understand, that a 40 year old Mosley, who couldn't handle Mayweather's speed, has little chance of challenging Manny. It is not a criticism of Pacquiao's achievements, it is merely a request for a better choice of opponent.Quote:
Originally Posted by PavlikOfcourse they deserve all the credit in the world, it's just whatever PAC does it's never enough. Fairness goes both ways get my drift?Quote:
Originally Posted by bzkfnYou're kidding me right? The guy is currently the best fighter in the sport, so if anyone beat him, then that would be a great achievement. I am no hater of Manny Pacquiao, I love watching the guy fight, but truly stupid statements like this make me want him to fail.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pavlik
I completely agree that fans are fickle, but you can pick an idiot apart with facts. Anyone who claims Manny is ducking/not fighting the best is a complete idiot. Just putting linking to boxrec an checking his resume is proof of that. On first read of Pavlik's post though, it came across to me that he was making a defensive statement that Pacquiao was no longer on top of his game when he clearly is. Also, to my knowledge, I didn't see any recent posts in this thread claiming he was ducking. They are debating whether or not Mosley is the correct choice of opponent.Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboI think Pavlik makes a very good point actually. In the eyes of the fickle fight fans a fighter really is only as good as his last fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by bzkfnYou're kidding me right? The guy is currently the best fighter in the sport, so if anyone beat him, then that would be a great achievement. I am no hater of Manny Pacquiao, I love watching the guy fight, but truly stupid statements like this make me want him to fail.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pavlik
For years Floyd was dodging the best welters in Margarito and Mosley. Hatton was unbeatable at light welter, the undisputed Ring champ. Clottey was one of the most underated fighters around (as weirdly is Collazo still because he hasn't had a big fight yet), and they were the kind of fighters Floyd wanted nothing off.
Then fast forward a couple of years and because they have since suffered losses they are just fodder for a cherry picking Filipino. Beating them means nothing, hell any decent fighter should be able to knock them out.
Right now it's guys like Bradley or Berto, or Martinez that Manny is avoiding (not counting Marquez) but if Bradley were to lose to Alexander, or Martinez to some other middleweight then they will be nothing fighters once again, and people will groan if Manny fights them.
Look at Paul Williams, knocked out by Martinez and now written off as finished. Pavlik is finished. Mosley is finished.
Hopkins was finished yet again after the second Jones Jr fight and is now back to being truly an all time great who was robbed against Calzaghe and Pascal.
The great thing about armchair fans and internat warriors is their opinions don't have to be permanent. What they say in May can be completely retracted in September.
Personally I don't believe human beings decline in skills over the period of a summer, or only have a period of 16 months where they are good at what they do, but that is the mindset of the average forum posting boxing fan.
I do not have an issue with Pac-JMM at 140, I actually think thats the only weight they can have a fight at but JMM has not yet fought there. I would agree with you about the two close fights with Pac warrants a third with JMM but at 140 I would prefer to see JMM fight there first. I'm just sick of people making excuses and taking credit from where it is due. If they fight at 140 without JMM doing anything at 140 in the past and pac totally dominates him, they will just say JMM is out of his weigth class and pac just cherry picked a lightweight to fight at junior welters.Quote:
Originally Posted by bzkfnJulius, just out of interest, do you have an issue with Pac-Marquez at Welter? Because while I agree with Miles that a fight at 140lb would be more of an even fight, I accept that this is boxing, and when you hold the marbles, you get to make demands and personally, while people think JMM has no business above Lightweight, I think he does...if Pacquiao is the opponent. JMM has proved himself against Pacquiao twice and that for me is enough to warrant a 3rd fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainYou're right about Marquez being the guy who has trouble pac twice. There is no denying that. There is no denying the fact that JMM is going down more often in fights and is fighting a more aggressive fight. There is no denying the other fact that, the welterweight pacman is not the same featherweight JMM had fought. The other fact that you can not deny is pac have proven himself at welterweight while JMM has not.Quote:
Originally Posted by milesI think Marquez has a couple of fights in him max. It would be interesting to see him step up to 140 in his next fight, but there is no denying that Marquez is the one fighter above all others that has given Pac the most problems. Morales did it the one time, but Marquez has won the majority of the rounds twice in a row. Marquez deserves respect and more so considering most writers thought he won the last fight. We are all entitled to our opinions and I haven't even said that Marquez beats Pacquiao at 140, but it is most definitely a credible fight. The facts speak for themselves. These guys have history and Marquez has outboxed Pacquiao in both fights. The only doubting factor is the weight, but if Manny were to come down in weight and Marquez go up then that evens the playing field somewhat. Noone realistically expects Manny to boil down to 135 at this stage and it is ludicrious to even go there.Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainMiles your saying Marquez would be a tough fight for Pac at 140? Thats your opinion and I guess your entitled to it. Let JMM fight at 140 first before you truly delude yourself. I too have an opinion, I think pac beats JMM in a third fight and I know what you will say afterwards. JMM is old, past it, out of his weight class. Its the same song. I am not saying Mosley is a better fight, but at least Mosley isn't removed from his weight class. I don't think you can use that one on this fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by milesHow can anyone say that a potential Marquez fight at 140 is a "gimmie"? That is an outrageous statement considering that Marquez has had two fights with Manny, gone down 4 times and yet still outboxed him in the vast majority of the rounds. Also Bradley is young, fast, skilled and undefeated. Berto considerably less so, but still undefeated. And we are to believe that Clottey, Margarito and a slumped Mosley are the best challenges we can give Manny?Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius Rain;D I actually agree with you Mick. I think there's really nothing else out there for pac but Mayweather. Same goes for Floyd. I dont think Timothy, Alexander, Berto, JMM (floyd already proved) or anybody else is anything but a gimmie or just stay busy or a money making fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMick
The only real task would be above welterweight -> Sergio Martinez
Everyone would like to see the Mayweather fight, but let's not kid ourselves that there aren't more viable options out there than what we are currently being spoonfed. Martinez at 154 would be great too, but at WW and below there are still good fights to be had.
As for the other 140 pounders, from what I've seen I think they are all a level below Pac and Floyd but there names do not carry the same weight as a Cotto, Margarito, Mosley. Pac is the biggest name in boxing, he will be pit against other big names. Timothy, Alexander, Berto and anyone else are just not there yet. But I think eventually pac will run out of big name fighters and will get to these guys if the Floyd fight continues to stall.
I stick to my opinion, the only real fight out there for Pac is Floyd, anything else in WW is a stay busy, money maker fight.
There is a trend in Pac's recent opponents and that is the fact that Arum owns them all. We are only getting Mosley/Pac because Mosley went rogue and against the wishes of Goldenboy who wanted the fight for Marquez. To suggest that Margarito deserved a shot at Pac is crazy talk. What has Mosley done recently to deserve a shot either? Marquez should have had his shot this time out. There was a demand from the fans who know the history and once again Arum and Pac have given a big middle finger to the expectations of the fans. Nobody is getting any fun from the current match up if it goes according to how many of us fear it will.
Of all the fighters at 140, I think Tim Bradley is the real deal. Sure, maybe he isn't quite known enough, but I think all the ingredients of a quality fighter are there. Tim Bradley would certainly be more deserving of a shot than Clottey was. Face it, we are being dicked around by Arum and Pac again and people keep on trying to justify bare faced crookery.
Also Miles, you have such a big problem with pac having fights at catch weights. What did you think about the JMM/Floyd match up. Or the fact that you are suggesting pac to have a fight with JMM at well a catchweight 140? :o JMM is not a 140 fighter and pac is a 147 fighter which technically would be a catch weight for that match up, right?
I hope JMMs next fight is at 140 and not against the likes of Katsidis, Diaz who are guys suited for his style. 3 of his last 4 fights have been against those two and its been inside 2 years. While pac has gone up and dominated 6 fights since they last fought. You like to criticize who pac fights, well if you loook at their resume aside from floyd (who was a sound lost) on JMMs resume, pacs oppenent beats JMMs p4p or no matter how you look at it.
Diaz
Katsidis
Casamayor
Are those three wins better then
Margarito
Clottey
Cotto
Hatton
Dela Hoya
Not even close. I dont want take away how impressive JMM look going up and getting those wins, but you can not compare his wins over pacs wins. You want to call pacs oppenent old, wash up, drain, or any other excuse you can come up with. How about Casa who was 2 fights remove from a lost to Santa Cruz, a fight remove from struggling to katsidis who yes is JMMs last fight. Now why would JMM fight a guy who was already Ko'd by the guy who he tko'd Casa? Wait infact why would he rematch a guy who he already ko'd DIAz!!!!! :o In the last two years, JMM have only won fights against Diaz and Katsidis. In the last two years Pac have wins over Dela Hoya, Hatton, Cotto, Clottey, Margarito. Whos selection of oppenent in the past two years has look shitty now MIles?
You like criticizes pacs opponents or the fights he takes well take a look at other fighters. JMM is actually worst.
I would like to see JMM get a win over a decent name at 140 first, for the mean time pac will fight Mosley at 147. If JMM does great at 140 then I definitely think a JMM Pac III at 140 is a must.
As far as Pac vs Bradley goes, I think people are getting way ahead of themselves on Bradley. IMO he is going to get stopped late against Alexander anyway
I have the same opinion.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
I think he's just highlighting the fickleness of fans. Once a fighter loses he's a bum, shot, finished, a corpse and Manny beating him means nothing. So he's just being sarcastic in saying that if Manny ever loses he will just say well he was past his prime, shot, finished, too old etc and thus beating him at that point meant nothing.Quote:
Originally Posted by bzkfnI completely agree that fans are fickle, but you can pick an idiot apart with facts. Anyone who claims Manny is ducking/not fighting the best is a complete idiot. Just putting linking to boxrec an checking his resume is proof of that. On first read of Pavlik's post though, it came across to me that he was making a defensive statement that Pacquiao was no longer on top of his game when he clearly is. Also, to my knowledge, I didn't see any recent posts in this thread claiming he was ducking. They are debating whether or not Mosley is the correct choice of opponent.Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboI think Pavlik makes a very good point actually. In the eyes of the fickle fight fans a fighter really is only as good as his last fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by bzkfnYou're kidding me right? The guy is currently the best fighter in the sport, so if anyone beat him, then that would be a great achievement. I am no hater of Manny Pacquiao, I love watching the guy fight, but truly stupid statements like this make me want him to fail.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pavlik
For years Floyd was dodging the best welters in Margarito and Mosley. Hatton was unbeatable at light welter, the undisputed Ring champ. Clottey was one of the most underated fighters around (as weirdly is Collazo still because he hasn't had a big fight yet), and they were the kind of fighters Floyd wanted nothing off.
Then fast forward a couple of years and because they have since suffered losses they are just fodder for a cherry picking Filipino. Beating them means nothing, hell any decent fighter should be able to knock them out.
Right now it's guys like Bradley or Berto, or Martinez that Manny is avoiding (not counting Marquez) but if Bradley were to lose to Alexander, or Martinez to some other middleweight then they will be nothing fighters once again, and people will groan if Manny fights them.
Look at Paul Williams, knocked out by Martinez and now written off as finished. Pavlik is finished. Mosley is finished.
Hopkins was finished yet again after the second Jones Jr fight and is now back to being truly an all time great who was robbed against Calzaghe and Pascal.
The great thing about armchair fans and internat warriors is their opinions don't have to be permanent. What they say in May can be completely retracted in September.
Personally I don't believe human beings decline in skills over the period of a summer, or only have a period of 16 months where they are good at what they do, but that is the mindset of the average forum posting boxing fan.
Regarding Shane. It's not the hardest available fight but Manny is in his 30's and has just torn through 4 weight classes in the past few years beating a who's who of the best fighters of the last several years around the welterweight division.
And contrary to many fan's, the goal for Manny and his team is for him to have a sucessful career maximising his earning, long term legacy against name opponents, and to keep winning.
A lot of fans just like to imagine the toughest opponent they can who be most likely to beat him and demand he face him.
Well Manny will do, when the money is right, but he's less interested in getting beat than his haters are and so he understandably factors in risk vs reward.
Every fighter does that, they would be insane not to.
Why fight an unproven fighter like Bradley, Berto, Martinez when the jury is still out on them and they are not household names? Better to let them grow their reputations and prove themselves and then fight in a bigger fight.
Coming after Marquez, De La Hoya, Hatton, Cotto, Clottey and Margarito I'm perfectly happy for a post 30 year old Manny, who is also now a full time politician to take a slightly easier fight for decent money whilst we wait for Floyd to sort himself out and see how the chips fall later on.
Contrary to the haters interperatations Manny didn't have an easy night against Margarito. That fight was a hard fight for him. He got hit, he got hurt at times and had to suck it up.
Mosley may be a foregone conclusion for us, and I too think Manny will win, but for Manny in there fighting the fight, taking the shots it won't be an easy fight. Mosley is a Hall of Famer, with vast experience, knockout power he's still never been stopped or ruined in a fight yet. It's a fight Manny should win. But Mosley is a live underdog, and a tough challenge.
Look at Marquez Diaz 2 or Marquez Katsidis. We all knew they were dead cert wins for Marqyuez. But he had to dig deep to win them. He didn't win by just turning up.
That will likely be the same here for Manny against Mosley.
When has Shane been in a dull fight? Even against Mora he piled it on in the championship rounds to the extent that Merchant and Kellerman were gushing in their praise of him.
He's a great fighter, crowd pleasing, never gives up, always has the power to turn a fight, and deserves a chance, just like all great old fighters before him to be the old fox underdog trying to turn back the hands of time.
Ali, Foreman, Hopkins, Jones Jr, Oscar, Barrera, Morrales etc all got the opportunity to be the old warhorse, why not Mosley?
I think it will be a very crowd friendly fight, and if Manny did dominate and destroy him it would be to his credit as nobody has done that yet.
I think if JMM can handle the weight at 140, he beats Bradley.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
I don't think Marquez needs to even beat the best at 140, but should be able to fight anyone ranked in the top 6 to get his shot at Pac. Just prove the weight is fine and the history between the two seals the deal. It's not as though Manny jumped up and fought the best at 135 and he wasn't facing the best fighter at WW when he fought Cotto at a CW, so Marquez should be entitled to simply face a credible fighter at 140 like Pac has been able to do in certain divisions. Then there is no reason for anyone to be against a Pac/Marquez fight at 140.Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainI think if JMM can handle the weight at 140, he beats Bradley.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
And like I say, I am not even sure that Marquez can beat him, but I am convinced that he can make it interesting and test Manny in a way that other fighters are not able to. Size is not the challenge for Manny, it is precision counter punching and all any of us are asking is that Manny test himself. Get away from Arum and his constant in house shenanigans and get Manny in there with fighters on a winning streak or else are unbeaten. Enough with these damaged or tainted fighters. It is doing nothing to enhance Manny's reputation.
With hindsight being 20/20 it's easy to come up with excuses why a guy wins. If I'm not mistaken you and I think most of this forum picked Hatton and Cotto to smash Pacquiao, but after Pacquiao wins it's they were damage, weight drain, shot, over the hill, and tainted, along with other myriad of excuses like Mayweather Sr. didn't do a good job of training or whoever that was training Cotto.Quote:
Originally Posted by milesI don't think Marquez needs to even beat the best at 140, but should be able to fight anyone ranked in the top 6 to get his shot at Pac. Just prove the weight is fine and the history between the two seals the deal. It's not as though Manny jumped up and fought the best at 135 and he wasn't facing the best fighter at WW when he fought Cotto at a CW, so Marquez should be entitled to simply face a credible fighter at 140 like Pac has been able to do in certain divisions. Then there is no reason for anyone to be against a Pac/Marquez fight at 140.Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainI think if JMM can handle the weight at 140, he beats Bradley.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
And like I say, I am not even sure that Marquez can beat him, but I am convinced that he can make it interesting and test Manny in a way that other fighters are not able to. Size is not the challenge for Manny, it is precision counter punching and all any of us are asking is that Manny test himself. Get away from Arum and his constant in house shenanigans and get Manny in there with fighters on a winning streak or else are unbeaten. Enough with these damaged or tainted fighters. It is doing nothing to enhance Manny's reputation.
If it was Berto and Pacquiao won, it would have been he was too green. If it was Bradley and Pac won, it would have been Bradley was too small and green. And if Pac did fight JMM at 140 and he won, it would have been JMM was 37 and did'nt belong at 140 as an excuse. And more than likely the same people that would have wanted those fights and picking those guys to beat him would come out with the excuses I just made after Pac beats them.
I think that's how one acts like a boxing Nastradamus.;)
I was the same, but Manny Pac beat the hell out of any opponent I favoured. You just have to accept he is a remarkable fighter. The Marg fight was amazing to watch and I really think he is beyond JMM.
I'm not saying he has to beat the best at 140, I'm just saying if he can handle the weight at 140 I believe he will beat Bradley.Quote:
Originally Posted by milesI don't think Marquez needs to even beat the best at 140, but should be able to fight anyone ranked in the top 6 to get his shot at Pac. Just prove the weight is fine and the history between the two seals the deal. It's not as though Manny jumped up and fought the best at 135 and he wasn't facing the best fighter at WW when he fought Cotto at a CW, so Marquez should be entitled to simply face a credible fighter at 140 like Pac has been able to do in certain divisions. Then there is no reason for anyone to be against a Pac/Marquez fight at 140.Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainI think if JMM can handle the weight at 140, he beats Bradley.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
And like I say, I am not even sure that Marquez can beat him, but I am convinced that he can make it interesting and test Manny in a way that other fighters are not able to. Size is not the challenge for Manny, it is precision counter punching and all any of us are asking is that Manny test himself. Get away from Arum and his constant in house shenanigans and get Manny in there with fighters on a winning streak or else are unbeaten. Enough with these damaged or tainted fighters. It is doing nothing to enhance Manny's reputation.
Miles you can set your cross hire on any fighter and discredit their wins. You have such problems with the opponent pac faces but I thought I heard JMM will be fighting Morales next? You also seem to have miss my respond to your post a few pages back.
In the last two years JMM has wins over only two guys! Diaz and Katsidis. You like that better then a guy who has wins over Dela Hoya, Hatton, Cotto, Clottey, Margarito? Those are in the last two years. Is your standard for other fighters that much lower or do you think pac should do even better?
Bradley is the best at 140, so what the fuck are you talking about? Manny has never even gone there so why should Marquez? Because Manny only fights a certain kind of come forward fighter. He will avoid Bradley and of course he will avoid Marquez too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainI'm not saying he has to beat the best at 140, I'm just saying if he can handle the weight at 140 I believe he will beat Bradley.Quote:
Originally Posted by milesI don't think Marquez needs to even beat the best at 140, but should be able to fight anyone ranked in the top 6 to get his shot at Pac. Just prove the weight is fine and the history between the two seals the deal. It's not as though Manny jumped up and fought the best at 135 and he wasn't facing the best fighter at WW when he fought Cotto at a CW, so Marquez should be entitled to simply face a credible fighter at 140 like Pac has been able to do in certain divisions. Then there is no reason for anyone to be against a Pac/Marquez fight at 140.Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainI think if JMM can handle the weight at 140, he beats Bradley.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
And like I say, I am not even sure that Marquez can beat him, but I am convinced that he can make it interesting and test Manny in a way that other fighters are not able to. Size is not the challenge for Manny, it is precision counter punching and all any of us are asking is that Manny test himself. Get away from Arum and his constant in house shenanigans and get Manny in there with fighters on a winning streak or else are unbeaten. Enough with these damaged or tainted fighters. It is doing nothing to enhance Manny's reputation.
But, you want to defend the Mosley fight? Pathetic. :rolleyes:
Last time Pac was at 140, he slaughter the lineal champion in 2 rounds. What part do you not understand, I said if JMM can handle the weight at 140 I think he beats Bradley weather you think Bradley is now the best there or not. I dont see anybody at 140 that can beat JMM if he can handle the weight. I dont have a problem with the fact that a third match between pac and jmm is not happening because like I said I would like to see JMM fight at 140 first, which I believe he will win. Therefor giving more value to a fight with pac at 140.Quote:
Originally Posted by milesBradley is the best at 140, so what the fuck are you talking about? Manny has never even gone there so why should Marquez? Because Manny only fights a certain kind of come forward fighter. He will avoid Bradley and of course he will avoid Marquez too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainI'm not saying he has to beat the best at 140, I'm just saying if he can handle the weight at 140 I believe he will beat Bradley.Quote:
Originally Posted by milesI don't think Marquez needs to even beat the best at 140, but should be able to fight anyone ranked in the top 6 to get his shot at Pac. Just prove the weight is fine and the history between the two seals the deal. It's not as though Manny jumped up and fought the best at 135 and he wasn't facing the best fighter at WW when he fought Cotto at a CW, so Marquez should be entitled to simply face a credible fighter at 140 like Pac has been able to do in certain divisions. Then there is no reason for anyone to be against a Pac/Marquez fight at 140.Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainI think if JMM can handle the weight at 140, he beats Bradley.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
And like I say, I am not even sure that Marquez can beat him, but I am convinced that he can make it interesting and test Manny in a way that other fighters are not able to. Size is not the challenge for Manny, it is precision counter punching and all any of us are asking is that Manny test himself. Get away from Arum and his constant in house shenanigans and get Manny in there with fighters on a winning streak or else are unbeaten. Enough with these damaged or tainted fighters. It is doing nothing to enhance Manny's reputation.
But, you want to defend the Mosley fight? Pathetic. :rolleyes:
I am not defending the Mosley fight, I called it a gimmie, stay busy, money making fight, remember?
How are you suppose to defend JMM if he fights Morales?
If Pacman beat Floyd, I'm going to say Floyd had to many distractions outside the ring. Or he was off to long without a fight and lose his sharpness.;DQuote:
Originally Posted by generalbulldogWith hindsight being 20/20 it's easy to come up with excuses why a guy wins. If I'm not mistaken you and I think most of this forum picked Hatton and Cotto to smash Pacquiao, but after Pacquiao wins it's they were damage, weight drain, shot, over the hill, and tainted, along with other myriad of excuses like Mayweather Sr. didn't do a good job of training or whoever that was training Cotto.Quote:
Originally Posted by milesI don't think Marquez needs to even beat the best at 140, but should be able to fight anyone ranked in the top 6 to get his shot at Pac. Just prove the weight is fine and the history between the two seals the deal. It's not as though Manny jumped up and fought the best at 135 and he wasn't facing the best fighter at WW when he fought Cotto at a CW, so Marquez should be entitled to simply face a credible fighter at 140 like Pac has been able to do in certain divisions. Then there is no reason for anyone to be against a Pac/Marquez fight at 140.Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainI think if JMM can handle the weight at 140, he beats Bradley.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
And like I say, I am not even sure that Marquez can beat him, but I am convinced that he can make it interesting and test Manny in a way that other fighters are not able to. Size is not the challenge for Manny, it is precision counter punching and all any of us are asking is that Manny test himself. Get away from Arum and his constant in house shenanigans and get Manny in there with fighters on a winning streak or else are unbeaten. Enough with these damaged or tainted fighters. It is doing nothing to enhance Manny's reputation.
If it was Berto and Pacquiao won, it would have been he was too green. If it was Bradley and Pac won, it would have been Bradley was too small and green. And if Pac did fight JMM at 140 and he won, it would have been JMM was 37 and did'nt belong at 140 as an excuse. And more than likely the same people that would have wanted those fights and picking those guys to beat him would come out with the excuses I just made after Pac beats them.
I think that's how one acts like a boxing Nastradamus.;)
Quote:
Originally Posted by milesBradley is the best at 140, so what the fuck are you talking about? Manny has never even gone there so why should Marquez? Because Manny only fights a certain kind of come forward fighter. He will avoid Bradley and of course he will avoid Marquez too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainI'm not saying he has to beat the best at 140, I'm just saying if he can handle the weight at 140 I believe he will beat Bradley.Quote:
Originally Posted by milesI don't think Marquez needs to even beat the best at 140, but should be able to fight anyone ranked in the top 6 to get his shot at Pac. Just prove the weight is fine and the history between the two seals the deal. It's not as though Manny jumped up and fought the best at 135 and he wasn't facing the best fighter at WW when he fought Cotto at a CW, so Marquez should be entitled to simply face a credible fighter at 140 like Pac has been able to do in certain divisions. Then there is no reason for anyone to be against a Pac/Marquez fight at 140.Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainI think if JMM can handle the weight at 140, he beats Bradley.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
And like I say, I am not even sure that Marquez can beat him, but I am convinced that he can make it interesting and test Manny in a way that other fighters are not able to. Size is not the challenge for Manny, it is precision counter punching and all any of us are asking is that Manny test himself. Get away from Arum and his constant in house shenanigans and get Manny in there with fighters on a winning streak or else are unbeaten. Enough with these damaged or tainted fighters. It is doing nothing to enhance Manny's reputation.
But, you want to defend the Mosley fight? Pathetic. :rolleyes:
Manny did go there, he knocked out the long time Ring undisputed champion at the weight Ricky Hatton in two blistering rounds.
Thenew guys like Bradley, Alexander, Khan etc are fighting to establish themselves as the next Ring champ following on from Hatton. Right now they are all challengers rather than the true champ.
But Hatton was unquestionably the light welterweight king and Manny smashed him.
If you check the Marquez-Morales thread, you'll see he doesn't defend it. None of us can. Marquez & Pacquiao should be fighting each other, rather than the opponents they have chosen.Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainLast time Pac was at 140, he slaughter the lineal champion in 2 rounds. What part do you not understand, I said if JMM can handle the weight at 140 I think he beats Bradley weather you think Bradley is now the best there or not. I dont see anybody at 140 that can beat JMM if he can handle the weight. I dont have a problem with the fact that a third match between pac and jmm is not happening because like I said I would like to see JMM fight at 140 first, which I believe he will win. Therefor giving more value to a fight with pac at 140.Quote:
Originally Posted by milesBradley is the best at 140, so what the fuck are you talking about? Manny has never even gone there so why should Marquez? Because Manny only fights a certain kind of come forward fighter. He will avoid Bradley and of course he will avoid Marquez too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainI'm not saying he has to beat the best at 140, I'm just saying if he can handle the weight at 140 I believe he will beat Bradley.Quote:
Originally Posted by milesI don't think Marquez needs to even beat the best at 140, but should be able to fight anyone ranked in the top 6 to get his shot at Pac. Just prove the weight is fine and the history between the two seals the deal. It's not as though Manny jumped up and fought the best at 135 and he wasn't facing the best fighter at WW when he fought Cotto at a CW, so Marquez should be entitled to simply face a credible fighter at 140 like Pac has been able to do in certain divisions. Then there is no reason for anyone to be against a Pac/Marquez fight at 140.Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainI think if JMM can handle the weight at 140, he beats Bradley.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
And like I say, I am not even sure that Marquez can beat him, but I am convinced that he can make it interesting and test Manny in a way that other fighters are not able to. Size is not the challenge for Manny, it is precision counter punching and all any of us are asking is that Manny test himself. Get away from Arum and his constant in house shenanigans and get Manny in there with fighters on a winning streak or else are unbeaten. Enough with these damaged or tainted fighters. It is doing nothing to enhance Manny's reputation.
But, you want to defend the Mosley fight? Pathetic. :rolleyes:
I am not defending the Mosley fight, I called it a gimmie, stay busy, money making fight, remember?
How are you suppose to defend JMM if he fights Morales?
I just re-watched the oldie fights, Cotto vs. Judah and Margarito vs. Mosley.
Cotto and Margarito as observed after viewing these fights were significantly improved when they faced but still both lost out to Pacquiao. If not much with skill, Tony and Miguel improved on their individual preparations leading up to their fight against Manny, but despite this all, both still lost miserably. This certifies the accolades bestowed upon by fans for the fighter from Gen San, in the Philippines.
I view this upcoming fight of Pac against Mosley as a no gimme' at all! Mosley will misconstrue the fickle fears from detractors and come up with the necessary skill and make up to make this a competitive and an interesting scrap. Or better yet, legitimize a puncher's chance in beating his opponent regardless of the odds. Manny pound for pound king or not, come fight night, Mosley will come inspired to inflict a beating on him.
After all as logic just follows, these fighters including Shane Mosley are world class and certifiable future hall of famers, and the like... They will twist and shout come fight night not wanting in preparedness, in ammunition, and with the maximum available skill.
They will only get beat, if it lead be, simply because the other guy was just better on that given fight... which off on a tangent, reason I am dumfounded no end that SS Mosley gassed out after two rounds with Floyd Jr. especially this was after owning the "Money" man just the previous round. This dismal display is so untypical a characteristic of the level fighter Mosley is viewed as.
The Mosley that beat the skittish Margarito will have it fair if not better to land a haymaker on Pac to turn the table and win some serious Vegas' cash for the underdogs. Any one claiming Pac is the clear favorite against Shane, much in the same breath as in the Margarito fight, is just setting up shop to negate any merit so shall Pac gain when he prevails against a boxer of certifiable renown, in Sugar Shane Mosley!
All said and done, I like Pac's chances. If he avoids any of those SS Mosley bombs, I favor him to win by UD.
JMM fought Pacquiao, then moved up to 135 to chase Manny ( Manny fought a paper champ) defeated the Ring lineal LW champion, defended it in a FOTY, moved up to face Mayweather, moved back down to rematch his opponent for the previous FOTY, and defends it against his mandatory in another possible FOTY...Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius Rain
:rolleyes:
You find that better than what Pac has done?Quote:
Originally Posted by hardcore_crashJMM fought Pacquiao, then moved up to 135 to chase Manny ( Manny fought a paper champ) defeated the Ring lineal LW champion, defended it in a FOTY, moved up to face Mayweather, moved back down to rematch his opponent for the previous FOTY, and defends it against his mandatory in another possible FOTY...Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius Rain
:rolleyes:
I bet you're going to say yes :rolleyes:
In two years he has wins only against two guys, Diaz and Katsidis. If he fights and gets destroyed by pac, thats exactly what you will use as an excuse to discredit pacs victory.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainYou find that better than what Pac has done?Quote:
Originally Posted by hardcore_crashJMM fought Pacquiao, then moved up to 135 to chase Manny ( Manny fought a paper champ) defeated the Ring lineal LW champion, defended it in a FOTY, moved up to face Mayweather, moved back down to rematch his opponent for the previous FOTY, and defends it against his mandatory in another possible FOTY...Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius Rain
:rolleyes:
I bet you're going to say yes :rolleyes:
In two years he has wins only against two guys, Diaz and Katsidis. If he fights and gets destroyed by pac, thats exactly what you will use as an excuse to discredit pacs victory.
Why would I say yes? Because I am a fan of Marquez?
Just being a fan doesn't make me blind and ignore facts, unlike you and your obsession.
You don't have to be to smart to realize Pacquaio has done something in the last two years no one else has, let alone Marquez...
Obsession? Your the idiot who cut and paste a post of mine that is just a small part of an entire post and then commented on it. So what the fxck was your point? Cause my point was if you clowns are going to say pac opponents are weak then look at other fighters and compare who really is doing so much better.Quote:
Originally Posted by hardcore_crashQuote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainYou find that better than what Pac has done?Quote:
Originally Posted by hardcore_crashJMM fought Pacquiao, then moved up to 135 to chase Manny ( Manny fought a paper champ) defeated the Ring lineal LW champion, defended it in a FOTY, moved up to face Mayweather, moved back down to rematch his opponent for the previous FOTY, and defends it against his mandatory in another possible FOTY...Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius Rain
:rolleyes:
I bet you're going to say yes :rolleyes:
In two years he has wins only against two guys, Diaz and Katsidis. If he fights and gets destroyed by pac, thats exactly what you will use as an excuse to discredit pacs victory.
Why would I say yes? Because I am a fan of Marquez?
Just being a fan doesn't make me blind and ignore facts, unlike you and your obsession.
You don't have to be to smart to realize Pacquaio has done something in the last two years no one else has, let alone Marquez...
And your the one sugar coating JMMs win, you called Diaz the Lineal Champ? Campbell whooped him before JMM did. And then your going to say he rematch Diaz like that was a real relevant rematch :rolleyes: the only reason why you think they are FOTY is because of how well you think they did against JMM, and yes Diaz is a fucking weak opposition compare to pac. Even P.Malignaggi had already two wins over Diaz before JMM did. If your going to call Casamayor the Lineal champ, that was outside the two years I was talking about and no Santa Cruz had already defeated him. As for pac he did beat the 140 lineal champ, Hatton. The same Hatton who had never lost at 140.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainObsession? Your the idiot who cut and paste a post of mine that is just a small part of an entire post and then commented on it. So what the fxck was your point? Cause my point was if you clowns are going to say pac opponents are weak then look at other fighters and compare who really is doing so much better.Quote:
Originally Posted by hardcore_crashQuote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainYou find that better than what Pac has done?Quote:
Originally Posted by hardcore_crashJMM fought Pacquiao, then moved up to 135 to chase Manny ( Manny fought a paper champ) defeated the Ring lineal LW champion, defended it in a FOTY, moved up to face Mayweather, moved back down to rematch his opponent for the previous FOTY, and defends it against his mandatory in another possible FOTY...Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius Rain
:rolleyes:
I bet you're going to say yes :rolleyes:
In two years he has wins only against two guys, Diaz and Katsidis. If he fights and gets destroyed by pac, thats exactly what you will use as an excuse to discredit pacs victory.
Why would I say yes? Because I am a fan of Marquez?
Just being a fan doesn't make me blind and ignore facts, unlike you and your obsession.
You don't have to be to smart to realize Pacquaio has done something in the last two years no one else has, let alone Marquez...
And your the one sugar coating JMMs win, you called Diaz the Lineal Champ? Campbell whooped him before JMM did. And then your going to say he rematch Diaz like that was a real relevant rematch :rolleyes: the only reason why you think they are FOTY is because of how well you think they did against JMM, and yes Diaz is a fucking weak opposition compare to pac. Even P.Malignaggi had already two wins over Diaz before JMM did. If your going to call Casamayor the Lineal champ, that was outside the two years I was talking about and no Santa Cruz had already defeated him. As for pac he did beat the 140 lineal champ, Hatton. The same Hatton who had never lost at 140.
And now you are going to start with the name calling? Why are you so offended by most posts??
Because I am replying to a direct statement you wrote, i cut some of your post instead on putting in in bold lettering.
Soooorry I mentioned a win from September 2008, and I was not talking about the two years you were talking about. lol.
Casa was the linear champ, he may have slid a SD decision, but he was the champ.
Do you write your own Boxing history books or something???
I don't have to resort to name calling like you, and you most likely wont push my buttons like you did Mil.
You're forgiven, I can't stay mad at idiots.Quote:
Originally Posted by hardcore_crashQuote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainObsession? Your the idiot who cut and paste a post of mine that is just a small part of an entire post and then commented on it. So what the fxck was your point? Cause my point was if you clowns are going to say pac opponents are weak then look at other fighters and compare who really is doing so much better.Quote:
Originally Posted by hardcore_crashQuote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainYou find that better than what Pac has done?Quote:
Originally Posted by hardcore_crashJMM fought Pacquiao, then moved up to 135 to chase Manny ( Manny fought a paper champ) defeated the Ring lineal LW champion, defended it in a FOTY, moved up to face Mayweather, moved back down to rematch his opponent for the previous FOTY, and defends it against his mandatory in another possible FOTY...Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius Rain
:rolleyes:
I bet you're going to say yes :rolleyes:
In two years he has wins only against two guys, Diaz and Katsidis. If he fights and gets destroyed by pac, thats exactly what you will use as an excuse to discredit pacs victory.
Why would I say yes? Because I am a fan of Marquez?
Just being a fan doesn't make me blind and ignore facts, unlike you and your obsession.
You don't have to be to smart to realize Pacquaio has done something in the last two years no one else has, let alone Marquez...
And your the one sugar coating JMMs win, you called Diaz the Lineal Champ? Campbell whooped him before JMM did. And then your going to say he rematch Diaz like that was a real relevant rematch :rolleyes: the only reason why you think they are FOTY is because of how well you think they did against JMM, and yes Diaz is a fucking weak opposition compare to pac. Even P.Malignaggi had already two wins over Diaz before JMM did. If your going to call Casamayor the Lineal champ, that was outside the two years I was talking about and no Santa Cruz had already defeated him. As for pac he did beat the 140 lineal champ, Hatton. The same Hatton who had never lost at 140.
And now you are going to start with the name calling? Why are you so offended by most posts??
Because I am replying to a direct statement you wrote, i cut some of your post instead on putting in in bold lettering.
Soooorry I mentioned a win from September 2008, and I was not talking about the two years you were talking about. lol.
Casa was the linear champ, he may have slid a SD decision, but he was the champ.
Do you write your own Boxing history books or something???
I don't have to resort to name calling like you, and you most likely wont push my buttons like you did Mil.
I get it, your Mils alt.
I have that fight recorded and have watched it a few times now. Most people don't realize how competitive Margarito was in the fight all the way up to round 10. Every time Margarito started getting somewhere against Pacquiao, Pacquiao would turn on the punch wheel and just wipe out what ever Margarito did scoring wise.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
:LOLATYOU:Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainYou're forgiven, I can't stay mad at idiots.Quote:
Originally Posted by hardcore_crashQuote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainObsession? Your the idiot who cut and paste a post of mine that is just a small part of an entire post and then commented on it. So what the fxck was your point? Cause my point was if you clowns are going to say pac opponents are weak then look at other fighters and compare who really is doing so much better.Quote:
Originally Posted by hardcore_crashQuote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainYou find that better than what Pac has done?Quote:
Originally Posted by hardcore_crashJMM fought Pacquiao, then moved up to 135 to chase Manny ( Manny fought a paper champ) defeated the Ring lineal LW champion, defended it in a FOTY, moved up to face Mayweather, moved back down to rematch his opponent for the previous FOTY, and defends it against his mandatory in another possible FOTY...Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius Rain
:rolleyes:
I bet you're going to say yes :rolleyes:
In two years he has wins only against two guys, Diaz and Katsidis. If he fights and gets destroyed by pac, thats exactly what you will use as an excuse to discredit pacs victory.
Why would I say yes? Because I am a fan of Marquez?
Just being a fan doesn't make me blind and ignore facts, unlike you and your obsession.
You don't have to be to smart to realize Pacquaio has done something in the last two years no one else has, let alone Marquez...
And your the one sugar coating JMMs win, you called Diaz the Lineal Champ? Campbell whooped him before JMM did. And then your going to say he rematch Diaz like that was a real relevant rematch :rolleyes: the only reason why you think they are FOTY is because of how well you think they did against JMM, and yes Diaz is a fucking weak opposition compare to pac. Even P.Malignaggi had already two wins over Diaz before JMM did. If your going to call Casamayor the Lineal champ, that was outside the two years I was talking about and no Santa Cruz had already defeated him. As for pac he did beat the 140 lineal champ, Hatton. The same Hatton who had never lost at 140.
And now you are going to start with the name calling? Why are you so offended by most posts??
Because I am replying to a direct statement you wrote, i cut some of your post instead on putting in in bold lettering.
Soooorry I mentioned a win from September 2008, and I was not talking about the two years you were talking about. lol.
Casa was the linear champ, he may have slid a SD decision, but he was the champ.
Do you write your own Boxing history books or something???
I don't have to resort to name calling like you, and you most likely wont push my buttons like you did Mil.
I get it, your Mils alt.
LMAO at you coming to the conclusion I'm someone else alt.
You must bet the idiot.
I respect Margarito for trying to make the fight, unlike Clottey. He would take 2 to land his 1. You also have to consider that Margarito had a broken face after 4 and couldn't see for a large part of the fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by fan johnnyI have that fight recorded and have watched it a few times now. Most people don't realize how competitive Margarito was in the fight all the way up to round 10. Every time Margarito started getting somewhere against Pacquiao, Pacquiao would turn on the punch wheel and just wipe out what ever Margarito did scoring wise.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
That is why I struggle to see Mosley making an impact, he cannot throw 800+ punches and he doesn't have Margarito's legs and relative youth.
Quote:
Originally Posted by fan johnnyQuote:
Originally Posted by Master
Just to add...(IMHO)Quote:
Originally Posted by fan johnny
The Margarito that showed up to face Pacquiao is a much better prepared fighter than the version that have faced Sugar Shane Mosley. Tony's stamina on that November 13th fight was superb, his jabs and uppercuts were effective, and his counters against a side to side Pac and the cutting of the ring was next to none. It would not be a surprise if this version would have performed better in the fight with Mosley.
His trainer Robert Garcia deserve credit on that note but certainly likewise deserve stiff admonishment for allowing his fighter to foolishly continue on despite being fully aware of the futility in outcome and an endangerment in health involved for Tony in having done so.
Boxing on Youtube: UPDATE: Antonio Margarito's injury from the Manny Pacquiao fight
The terrible thing mostly gone unnoticed was the remarkable skill level needed to defeat a determined version of Margarito that gave no quarters and fought tooth and nail. That one had no quit and certainly no surrender. It’s a shame how the referee, Lawrence Cole, allowed that kind of a beating to progress.
How valiant those two protagonists fought! Pac showed a well above in rudimentary skill to overcome this tough one, and in Tony, an unbelievable spunk and will to win, to keep on trying despite the evident futility.
I believe some fans have gotten a bit spoiled, a bit numb in under appreciating this fight. They thought they saw just an OK fight, nothing out of the ordinary... Wrong! Pac and Tony were both in a life and death situation just to bring that fight on.
Jerry Jones who owns among others, the "Dallas Cowboys" and the billion dollar plus stadium where this football franchise play and where on this night, the fight took place, got it right on the dot... he had fully appreciated what had transpired... the fierce battle that took place, the significance it entailed, the fighters gracing and honoring his venue with their blood, sweat, and tears. It had moved him well enough to whisper in Tony Margarito's ears... that in him, Tony had a friend for life!
You are right Marg was one or two shots away from victory.
Or weight advantage. . . . . If Marg wasnt so much bigger than Pac I think he would have been out of there in 3 or 4 rounds. But his size got him through the rough patches and helped carry him through that fight. I think Pac was 1 sustained attack away from stopping Marg throughout that fight. Whenever he was on the brink of stopping Tony, he would just get back to his boxing and the gameplan.Quote:
Originally Posted by milesI respect Margarito for trying to make the fight, unlike Clottey. He would take 2 to land his 1. You also have to consider that Margarito had a broken face after 4 and couldn't see for a large part of the fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by fan johnnyI have that fight recorded and have watched it a few times now. Most people don't realize how competitive Margarito was in the fight all the way up to round 10. Every time Margarito started getting somewhere against Pacquiao, Pacquiao would turn on the punch wheel and just wipe out what ever Margarito did scoring wise.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
That is why I struggle to see Mosley making an impact, he cannot throw 800+ punches and he doesn't have Margarito's legs and relative youth.
Although it was a physically demanding fight for Pac I disagree that Marg came close to winning. He landed 1 punch that caused a reaction which was a body shot in round 6. Thats it. Apart from that I dont think he ever had Pac in any trouble. He was always on top of the action controlling the Mexican. He had to dig deep but was always in the driving seat.
Mosley has a good left hook to the body and as Freddie said, Mosley will attack in a more considered way than Tony. He has that touch of class in his boxing Tony didnt and is a bigger banger too. The advantage Tony had over Pac was height and weight but Shane hasnt really got that and as ever speed kills. That will be the deciding factor. Shane at 40 just wont be quick enough when it matters.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qt70k...eature=related
Undeniable FACT!
Makes me nervous:eek:
Just wanted to add this...Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMick
Even Roach Admits Manny Pacquiao Should Have Fought Marquez