Vasyl Lomachenko is P4P #1

[Gandalf]

I thought Reid beat Calzaghe.

A broken hand will make a fight closer, but think Calzaghe edged that. Maidana beat Mayweather on an off night too, these things happen. Reid is obviously not on a Calzaghe level.

[Alpha]

I thought Reid beat Calzaghe.

A broken hand will make a fight closer, but think Calzaghe edged that. Maidana beat Mayweather on an off night too, these things happen. Reid is obviously not on a Calzaghe level.

I had it 114-113 Reid when I watched it. But yeah Calzaghe had the better career.

[Gandalf]

I thought Reid beat Calzaghe.

A broken hand will make a fight closer, but think Calzaghe edged that. Maidana beat Mayweather on an off night too, these things happen. Reid is obviously not on a Calzaghe level.

I had it 114-113 Reid when I watched it. But yeah Calzaghe had the better career.

That's fair enough. It was a close fight and on the whole one of Calzaghe's lesser performances. Calzaghe was excellent in those days too when focused, but with the hand injuries he refined himself into something really different. It could have ended his career and at times seemed to be getting there, but he evolved that style which is hard for any fighter to prepare for. Sometimes it has been leveled that Calzaghe's resume is lacking, but you can flip that quite easily and say 'Well look at Kovalev's. He's been knocking everyone out but there is nobody there that Calzaghe would have had the minimal amount of difficult handling'. I don't like it when people put Calzaghe down because he was awesome and not only that but really gave his money's worth. I sometimes look at fighters filling out rounds or throwing a minimal amount and you never saw that with Calzaghe. Most of his fights are really exciting and when he stepped up he dazzled almost every time. Even at his sloppiest like against Mitchell it was FOTY material. Even in a gritty fight like against spoiler Hopkins he still massively outlanded him landing 232 punches as compared with Kovalev's 166. That was against a really brittle looking BHop and 38 came in the final round so it was something like 10 punches landed a round for 11 rounds. It's dismal really. Yet Kovalev is rated so highly by some, as is Ward who made his name off of Calzaghe leftovers. I rated Kov highly too and thought he was maybe just having an off day against Chilemba and took a breather against Hop, but he really seems to have forgotten how to put people away. He struggles after 6 and he hasn't even thrown a lot of punches. People suggest that Kovalev would stop Calzaghe or Ward would be too 'gifted' and it's absurd really. People are high on these fighters and forget just how good Calzaghe was. Ward and Kovalez are good, but they are no legends like Hopkins, Calzaghe, or Toney.

[Alpha]

I thought Reid beat Calzaghe.

A broken hand will make a fight closer, but think Calzaghe edged that. Maidana beat Mayweather on an off night too, these things happen. Reid is obviously not on a Calzaghe level.

I had it 114-113 Reid when I watched it. But yeah Calzaghe had the better career.

That's fair enough. It was a close fight and on the whole one of Calzaghe's lesser performances. Calzaghe was excellent in those days too when focused, but with the hand injuries he refined himself into something really different. It could have ended his career and at times seemed to be getting there, but he evolved that style which is hard for any fighter to prepare for. Sometimes it has been leveled that Calzaghe's resume is lacking, but you can flip that quite easily and say 'Well look at Kovalev's. He's been knocking everyone out but there is nobody there that Calzaghe would have had the minimal amount of difficult handling'. I don't like it when people put Calzaghe down because he was awesome and not only that but really gave his money's worth. I sometimes look at fighters filling out rounds or throwing a minimal amount and you never saw that with Calzaghe. Most of his fights are really exciting and when he stepped up he dazzled almost every time. Even at his sloppiest like against Mitchell it was FOTY material. Even in a gritty fight like against spoiler Hopkins he still massively outlanded him landing 232 punches as compared with Kovalev's 166. That was against a really brittle looking BHop and 38 came in the final round so it was something like 10 punches landed a round for 11 rounds. It's dismal really. Yet Kovalev is rated so highly by some, as is Ward who made his name off of Calzaghe leftovers. I rated Kov highly too and thought he was maybe just having an off day against Chilemba and took a breather against Hop, but he really seems to have forgotten how to put people away. He struggles after 6 and he hasn't even thrown a lot of punches. People suggest that Kovalev would stop Calzaghe or Ward would be too 'gifted' and it's absurd really. People are high on these fighters and forget just how good Calzaghe was. Ward and Kovalez are good, but they are no legends like Hopkins, Calzaghe, or Toney.

Nice post. Totally agree. I feel bad for Reid. He was robbed against Ottke.

[Gandalf]

Reid had a good career. Calzaghe greatness aside I think Lomachenko is the best fighter in the world. He has variety, all the punches, and most importantly has output. You cannot be considered the best throwing 30 punches a round, you have to double or triple it. Aim for the sky with volume. It's what I like. James Toney comeback life is good.

[powerpuncher]

So you give calzaghe a pass for a broken hand against Reid? What about when ward still dominated froch with a broken hand?

Calzaghe wouldn't be throwing 100 punches a round against ward. Ward slows people down. It's like what mayweather does. He lowers his opponents output by a lot. And the difference is that calzaghe isn't a come forward brawler who just walks through punches. He doesn't just walk through punches. He has gotten hurt multiple times throughout his career.

I don't mind you thinking that calzaghe is great, but he best win by far was hopkins which was close. Other than that, he didn't beat anybody that good. I was never that impressed with him.

And once again, ward is an elite fighter in any era. He is potentially the best p4p fighter in the world right now. If he beats kovalev convincingly this time around, he should be undisputed #1. Nobody ever even considered calzaghe near that good when he was fighting other than a few fans from Wales.

[Gandalf]

So you give calzaghe a pass for a broken hand against Reid? What about when ward still dominated froch with a broken hand?

Calzaghe wouldn't be throwing 100 punches a round against ward. Ward slows people down. It's like what mayweather does. He lowers his opponents output by a lot. And the difference is that calzaghe isn't a come forward brawler who just walks through punches. He doesn't just walk through punches. He has gotten hurt multiple times throughout his career.

I don't mind you thinking that calzaghe is great, but he best win by far was hopkins which was close. Other than that, he didn't beat anybody that good. I was never that impressed with him.

And once again, ward is an elite fighter in any era. He is potentially the best p4p fighter in the world right now. If he beats kovalev convincingly this time around, he should be undisputed #1. Nobody ever even considered calzaghe near that good when he was fighting other than a few fans from Wales.

I don't give him a pass as I think he won a close fight. I also think Calzaghe would have shut out Froch 12 to nothing and do it much more impressively than Andre Ward did. Calzaghe wouldn't be throwing a 100 punches a round, no. It would be because Ward would be clinching as he always does. However, Calzaghe is just as quick as Ward and can maintain what he does better. Every round would see Ward outlanded, increasingly bloodied and frustrated. Ward doesn't have the power to put Calzaghe down so the notion of him being hurt is a silly one. Calzaghe got put down early, shook it off, and came back like a demon everytime. Ward doesn't have a punch. Ward and Kovalev have shallow records and both have been fighting non elite fighters lately, so the notion that these two 30-40 punch a round guys are the cream of the cream is a funny one to me. Lomachenko is much, much better.